North Dakota man says condo association threatens $200 daily fines over American flag 'noise'

May I play 'Devil's advocate'? Say I live in an apartment complex. I like to leave windows open in the Spring to have fresh air while sleeping. Neighbor hangs laundry out on his deck. Wind whips the laundry, making loud popping noises that keep me awake. Does his right to hang out laundry, top my right to have peaceful sleep? Take it a step further. My neighbor likes to play his banjo at 11 p.m. He has a right to sit out on his deck and play his banjo... no matter what time day or night?
What makes a difference whether the offensive noise comes from a loud radio, musical instrument, laundry flapping in the breeze, or a flag? If the noise is keeping people awake during normal sleeping hours, why not take the flag inside at night? Or, purchase a large "wall flag" that has grommets at each corner. Tie it off, horizontally, so it still shows your patriotism, while not keeping neighbors awake.
Personally, it sounds to me it is an issue of him wanting the attention of being obstinate. The "Fly Your Flag" legislation gives me the right to fly the flag of my Country and not have to remove it due to a person's political issues with my flag. I don't believe that legislation permits the flying of an object that removes the right of someone to sleep at night. Will be an interesting litigation if and when it enters the judicial system.
 
I'd be ashamed to cry like a little girl over something so petty.

My neighbour has panties hanging on her wash-line... my neighbour has a cloth flag on a pole in his yard that flaps loudly... my neighbour just stubbed a cigarette out in her yard.

What has our society come to!

What a bunch of overgrown babies!
 
The true farce IMHO is to make sure it's "the American flag" that is prominent in the article and the surrounding comments. Automatically shifts the discussion to "real Americans" and "commie sympathizers". Same old - same old.

Who gives a s**t what it is that's making the noise? How about a multi colored gay flag of the same cloth material? Make a difference to some of you? Maybe a bundle of tin cans? The alternate suggestions in Post#4 should seem pretty sensible to a normally considerate person.
 
May I play 'Devil's advocate'? Say I live in an apartment complex. I like to leave windows open in the Spring to have fresh air while sleeping. Neighbor hangs laundry out on his deck. Wind whips the laundry, making loud popping noises that keep me awake. Does his right to hang out laundry, top my right to have peaceful sleep? Take it a step further. My neighbor likes to play his banjo at 11 p.m. He has a right to sit out on his deck and play his banjo... no matter what time day or night?
What makes a difference whether the offensive noise comes from a loud radio, musical instrument, laundry flapping in the breeze, or a flag? If the noise is keeping people awake during normal sleeping hours, why not take the flag inside at night? Or, purchase a large "wall flag" that has grommets at each corner. Tie it off, horizontally, so it still shows your patriotism, while not keeping neighbors awake.
Personally, it sounds to me it is an issue of him wanting the attention of being obstinate. The "Fly Your Flag" legislation gives me the right to fly the flag of my Country and not have to remove it due to a person's political issues with my flag. I don't believe that legislation permits the flying of an object that removes the right of someone to sleep at night. Will be an interesting litigation if and when it enters the judicial system.
Indeed, it will be an interesting litigation.

If it goes in favour of the defendant, three cheers from me, if the defendant is found guilty, not only will that confirm to me what a cissy, namby-pamby society we live in today (bunch of wet-bottomed cry babies), but it will confirm to me what cissy, namby-pamby judges we have in the court system today.

Our world isn't swirling round-and-round in the toilet water, it's already gone down the toilet.
 
I agree with all those who made the point that the important thing isn't what caused the noise, it's the noise itself. It could be any kind of flag, or anything else that flaps in the wind.

Complaining about a flag making a gentle flapping sound in the daytime is just ridiculous. Sounds like a neighborhood feud. But there are two "what if's" that were not answered in the article.

1. Is it only during the daytime? Does he take the flag down every night?

2. Is the decibel level above what is allowed by local ordinances? What if someone decides to put his drum set out in the yard or on his deck and practice all day? What if someone wants to play a very loud video game with explosions, shooting, etc. out on the deck? Is there a noise limit that is being violated in a residential neighborhood?

The article is very poorly written, and coming from Fox News, is highly suspect IMO. They love to stir up hostilities against anyone who does not agree with their opinion of what good, old-fashioned, red-blooded American patriotism consists of. This fits right into their trouble-making vendetta, and they seem to be scraping the bottom of the barrel looking for news stories to get trouble stirred up.

If you really want to see how people in Fargo, ND treat each other, check out the series "Fargo" on Hulu. * (It's called Fargo, even though it's supposed to take place in MN. ) Great series, and funny in an oddball way, in spite of all the bloodshed.

*Just kidding. Fargo is probably no more violent than any other place.
 
The true farce IMHO is to make sure it's "the American flag" that is prominent in the article and the surrounding comments. Automatically shifts the discussion to "real Americans" and "commie sympathizers". Same old - same old.

Who gives a s**t what it is that's making the noise? How about a multi colored gay flag of the same cloth material? Make a difference to some of you? Maybe a bundle of tin cans? The alternate suggestions in Post#4 should seem pretty sensible to a normally considerate person.
*Some* media outlets make sure they never miss the opportunity to invoke rage, fear or confusion with their followers.
 
I have a noise issue now in an apartment and flapping flag outside would be heaven compared to what the neighboring tenants are doing.

But just another attack from condo commandos exercising their power.
 
The condo association didn’t immediately respond to calls from Fox News. But Almer said he suspected the real issue is "a personal vendetta" the condo association president, who happens to live in the unit above Almer, has against him.

There probably are multiple sides to this story and we’re not reading all the details. One person on a condo board can’t do this on their own, so the whole council must have agreed that there’s a problem.

It’s an “All-Weather” Flag. Maybe that makes the difference on sound level.
 
Future HOA Rules:

HOA's will build their units on a site that's been blanketed by a slab of concrete... hence keeping insect sound levels down at night so everyone can get their beauty sleep. i.e. Crickets sounding, ants crawling, etc. Rest assured (pardon the pun) they'll be no more of that.

In addition to, HOA compounds will offer NO grass, and NO trees, because heaven forbid a few leaves dropping and sullying the image of homeowners properties, plus, no one will have to suffer through the songs that birds sing through the day.

Vehicles will NOT be permitted past the security gates of the HOA compound due to exhaust fumes possibly contaminating the air that homeowners breathe.

NO smoking allowed! Not inside, not outside.

Glass bottles are prohibited due to the loud and obnoxious clanking noise they produce when transporting them to and from residences in plastic shopping/grocery bags.

Talking will NOT be permitted outside of ones home, as louder than average voices tend to carry through the airwaves, disrupting the afternoon napping patterns of elderly homeowners.

When windows and doors are open in residences in the HOA compound, sounds of televisions, quiet music, and/or any other sound producing practices or activities is strictly prohibited. i.e. No blenders, coffeemakers, food processors, hair blow-dryers, the rattling of house/car keys, the closing of refrigerator and oven doors, the on and off flipping action (sound) of wall switches, etc.

Last but not least, hard-soled footwear is absolutely prohibited from being worn outside of homeowners residences, account the loud and obnoxious clicking and tapping sound hard-soled footwear produces on concrete surfaces. To circumvent this, footwear is to be removed before exiting ones residence, leaving stocking or bare feet, then once homeowners are outside the compound gates, outer footwear can then be reapplied and worn.

Any additional sounds and noise coming from the distance (blocks away, even miles away, including air traffic) is to be reported and written up immediately, and authorities contacted. i.e. Police, HOA property managers, etc.
 
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The sun should not set before the national flag is lowered and folded. Talk to the neighbours about flying the flag respectfully and wear ear muffs on windy days. Problem solved.
 
There probably are multiple sides to this story and we’re not reading all the details. One person on a condo board can’t do this on their own, so the whole council must have agreed that there’s a problem.

It’s an “All-Weather” Flag. Maybe that makes the difference on sound level.
Maybe it makes the sound of crackling plastic. That would drive me nuts.
 
Is he going to obey this? Is he going to fight it? Will he move?
From the article, it sounds like he will fight the complex's request to remove the flag... or quiet it. He feels a state law allows him the "right" to fly the flag whenever and wherever he wants. Should it go to civil court, the court will either grant him the right to continue as he is... or order him to remove it. Depending on how much money he has... or how much money will be donated towards his cause... he would appeal the order. Once he has run out of appeals... or money... he can remove the flag as ordered or leave it in place. Defying the court order would find him in contempt and subject to a court ordered fine. The fine would probably be assessed per day he is in violation of the order. Eventually, should he not pay the fine, he would be hauled in to jail and sentenced.

I interpreted the article such that he is flying the flag 24/7. Day, night, rain, storm... the flag remains flapping in the wind. Too bad a negotiated agreement can't be reached where he flies the flag during daylight hours. Sounds more as if he is more focused on his 15 minutes of fame than thing like how he will pay utilities and taxes if imprisoned for a significant period of time.
 
Thanks for the infoPatch!
Wanta hear something weird?

My American all weather flag, on private property was put up by me with heavy bolts, fender washers and nuts, all tight and fit.
On Inauguration day, the flag fell, did not touch the ground, but I checked everything to find out WHY it fell, and everything was secure.
I can't, for the life of me, figure out WHAT made it fall! It makes no sense! The bolts were still tight, but disconnected!
 
Thanks for the infoPatch!
Wanta hear something weird?

My American all weather flag, on private property was put up by me with heavy bolts, fender washers and nuts, all tight and fit.
On Inauguration day, the flag fell, did not touch the ground, but I checked everything to find out WHY it fell, and everything was secure.
I can't, for the life of me, figure out WHAT made it fall! It makes no sense! The bolts were still tight, but disconnected!
Aliens from Roswell awoke and made mischief????
 
May I play 'Devil's advocate'? Say I live in an apartment complex. I like to leave windows open in the Spring to have fresh air while sleeping. Neighbor hangs laundry out on his deck. Wind whips the laundry, making loud popping noises that keep me awake. Does his right to hang out laundry, top my right to have peaceful sleep? Take it a step further. My neighbor likes to play his banjo at 11 p.m. He has a right to sit out on his deck and play his banjo... no matter what time day or night?
What makes a difference whether the offensive noise comes from a loud radio, musical instrument, laundry flapping in the breeze, or a flag? If the noise is keeping people awake during normal sleeping hours, why not take the flag inside at night? Or, purchase a large "wall flag" that has grommets at each corner. Tie it off, horizontally, so it still shows your patriotism, while not keeping neighbors awake.
Personally, it sounds to me it is an issue of him wanting the attention of being obstinate. The "Fly Your Flag" legislation gives me the right to fly the flag of my Country and not have to remove it due to a person's political issues with my flag. I don't believe that legislation permits the flying of an object that removes the right of someone to sleep at night. Will be an interesting litigation if and when it enters the judicial system.
Unless there are quiet hours in your rental agreement or HOA prohibiting certain noises then those irritants go with having close neighbors.
 
Unless there are quiet hours in your rental agreement or HOA prohibiting certain noises then those irritants go with having close neighbors.
I couldn't agree more, Annie, and to add to your entry, certain noises go with.................. HELLO ALL HOA RESIDENTS, THIS ONE IS FOR YOU.................. living on planet earth.

(((No, really HOA residents... the entire world does not shut down at 8:00 pm until 8:00 am, Monday through Sunday for HOA residents))).
 
I'd be ashamed to cry like a little girl over something so petty.

My neighbour has panties hanging on her wash-line... my neighbour has a cloth flag on a pole in his yard that flaps loudly... my neighbour just stubbed a cigarette out in her yard.

What has our society come to!

What a bunch of overgrown babies!
Welcome to America...home of the aholes!
 


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