People who think whatever was done to them should be held against all mankind

[grahamg]

A good friend once told me her view was that the failing, or criminal actions of one man should influence the way those in authority behave towards all men, even all the innocent ones, (something like that anyway?).

I don't mean to disparage this lady, who was a formidable, capable, caring, successful business person, mother, grandmother, and so on, but the logic behind the thinking, "all men must be held responsible for the actions of one", creates all kinds of problems doesn't it.

Do we really expect to Iive in a world without risk/risks?

I do think too, there is something of the "bully", or "bullying" about holding everybody responsible for the actions of one, (didn't this happen in the Nazi era?), and of course as a way of protecting yourself against whatever threat, it isn't going to work is it, as there will always be those individuals likely to do harm to others.

 

[Keesha]

It’s called forgiveness and I feel sorry for these types of people because without forgiveness our perspective can make us hateful souls.

 

[chic]

That's alarming.

 

[Verisure]

A good friend once told me her view was that the failing, or criminal actions of one man should influence the way those in authority behave towards all men, even all the innocent ones, (something like that anyway?).

I don't mean to disparage this lady, who was a formidable, capable, caring, successful business person, mother, grandmother, and so on, but the logic behind the thinking, "all men must be held responsible for the actions of one", creates all kinds of problems doesn't it.

Do we really expect to Iive in a world without risk/risks?

I do think too, there is something of the "bully", or "bullying" about holding everybody responsible for the actions of one, (didn't this happen in the Nazi era?), and of course as a way of protecting yourself against whatever threat, it isn't going to work is it, as there will always be those individuals likely to do harm to others.

Someone ought to remind your friend about all of the "idiosyncrasies" in women that we now - in this snowflake/feminist era - have been forbidden to discuss. Plus there are the injustices women have suffered in a previous time that we don't really want to see return wearing a new set of clothes.

 

[grahamg]

Someone ought to remind your friend about all of the "idiosyncrasies" in women that we now - in this snowflake/feminist era - have been forbidden to discuss. Plus there are the injustices women have suffered in a previous time that we don't really want to see return wearing a new set of clothes.

I'm afraid my dear friend is no longer with us, so can't be reminded obviously, but her thinking comes to my mind every time I hear the poor relatives of someone who has suffered a tragic event, when they are understandably prone to say, "The authorities should change the law, so that no other family loses a loved one in this way".

In the UK at the moment, because of an awful crime leading to the death of a young woman, we hear calls for a "change of mindset",(affecting the whole population one imagines, if no other young woman is to lose her life ever again this way).

How do you change the mindset of every man in the country, (is that feasible?)?

However, this thread isn't so much about any particular crime, as about the expectations of people, as stated in the OP.

 

[grahamg]

It’s called forgiveness and I feel sorry for these types of people because without forgiveness our perspective can make us hateful souls.

There is an element of "Once bitten, twice shy" to this type of thing, (all around you could say!).

 

[Devi]

It's an awful generalization, to blame something that happens on everyone. And it's illogical.

I hear that in these forums as well. Someone does something wrong, and the comment comes: what have we come to?

Again, illogical.

 

[Verisure]

I'm afraid my dear friend is no longer with us, so can't be reminded obviously, but her thinking comes to my mind every time I hear the poor relatives of someone who has suffered a tragic event, when they are understandably prone to say, "The authorities should change the law, so that no other family loses a loved one in this way".

In the UK at the moment, because of an awful crime leading to the death of a young woman, we hear calls for a "change of mindset",(affecting the whole population one imagines, if no other young woman is to lose her life ever again this way).

How do you change the mindset of every man in the country, (is that feasible?)?

However, this thread isn't so much about any particular crime, as about the expectations of people, as stated in the OP.

Oh, I see. I certainly do not blame anyone for saying, "The authorities should change the law, so that no other family loses a loved one in this way". I say it myself. The problem we have (all of us, it seems) is being allowed to say exactly what that law ought to be. I think you know what I mean without saying it?

I am thinking of a specific problem where changing the mindset of the population (or a particular segment of it) is a good idea if it floats. The forbidden subject (regarding this problem) would point the finger at cultural differences. That is to say that "others" do not understand the importance of certain cultural behaviour. It's alright that foreign workers in Saudi Arabia keep their drinking habits confined to allotted "designated areas" and we do not see such laws as "racist". Do we?

You do remember what happened in Cologne a few short years back when young women were sexually molested and raped during a festive event. Here, in Sweden, a similar tragedy struck during the "We are Stockholm" event. Yes, our authorities covered it up just as they had done in Germany but it finally leaked. What to do? Rather than begin a debate on the problems with mass migration (as a parallel subject), it was immediately suggested that all further events ought to be for women only. No men allowed.

 

[chic]

I'm afraid my dear friend is no longer with us, so can't be reminded obviously, but her thinking comes to my mind every time I hear the poor relatives of someone who has suffered a tragic event, when they are understandably prone to say, "The authorities should change the law, so that no other family loses a loved one in this way".

In the UK at the moment, because of an awful crime leading to the death of a young woman, we hear calls for a "change of mindset",(affecting the whole population one imagines, if no other young woman is to lose her life ever again this way).

How do you change the mindset of every man in the country, (is that feasible?)?

However, this thread isn't so much about any particular crime, as about the expectations of people, as stated in the OP.

Yeah. Unleash a pandemic on them. Sorry. My humor is getting twisted from all this covid stuff, but look how quick a pandemic changes everyone's mind.

 

[Nathan]

....but the logic behind the thinking, "all men must be held responsible for the actions of one", creates all kinds of problems doesn't it.

True. My wife has a few friends that are avid man-haters because of marriages or relationships having gone wrong. But, in knowing these ladies- I can see that they themselves heavily contributed to those failures.

 

[Rosemarie]

You mean that all should suffer because of the actions of one? One predator attacks a young woman out at night, so a curfew should be imposed? A taxi-driver assaults his passenger, so all taxi-drivers are considered a risk?
Not really logical, is it?

 

[grahamg]

It's an awful generalization, to blame something that happens on everyone. And it's illogical.
I hear that in these forums as well. Someone does something wrong, and the comment comes: what have we come to?
Again, illogical.

Whether its logical or not, (and I'm in two minds), I can see that if you somehow manage to impose enough rules you might prevent some dreadful, albeit rare occurence, then it could have some logic behind it.
At the same time, what do you lose into the bargain, the loss of freedom for those who would never pose a threat to anyone, has to be brought into this, (regardless of logic).

And again, do we really want, or expect to live in a world without risks?

 

[Verisure]

Whether its logical or not, (and I'm in two minds), I can see that if you somehow manage to impose enough rules you might prevent some dreadful, albeit rare occurence, then it could have some logic behind it.
At the same time, what do you lose into the bargain, the loss of freedom for those who would never pose a threat to anyone, has to be brought into this, (regardless of logic).

And again, do we really want, or expect to live in a world without risks?

Do we really want, or expect to live in a world without death? I'm 74 and I wonder if I'd like to live forever. No, I don't think I would.

 

[Murrmurr]

People who think whatever was done to them should be held against all mankind​

are narcissistic sociopaths.

 

[tbeltrans]

I can't comment on people I don't know. However, I can comment on my own thoughts on the subject. I feel that I am responsible for both my choices and my outcomes. I learn from mistakes and hope/plan to do better next time. My life seems to have worked out reasonably well with that code.

Tony

 

[Elsie]

If she was thinking of only "men" who are in authority? If so, well men are men are men. So what are they to do about excluding themselves from their MAN hood if they don't make the same judgement against themselves as they make against any other man? "Mankind" all peoples, men and women.

 

[HoneyNut]

I suppose if someone does a financial scam that steals people money, they would pass a law against the scam and enforce some required auditing/reporting financial laws against everyone.

 

[tbeltrans]

I suppose if someone does a financial scam that steals people money, they would pass a law against the scam and enforce some required auditing/reporting financial laws against everyone.

This is as it should be. That is how laws came to be to oversee Wall Street after the Depression. However, even that seems to have slipped.

Tony

 

[grahamg]

If she was thinking of only "men" who are in authority? If so, well men are men are men. So what are they to do about excluding themselves from their MAN hood if they don't make the same judgement against themselves as they make against any other man? "Mankind" all peoples, men and women.

I'm not entirely sure what my friend meant by "those in authority", but I'd guess she didn't mean "just men" in authority, (and by "authority she meant those making the laws I guess).

There is a case at the moment in the UK where "someone in the public eye", (let's say), had said something inappropriate, and it was discovered, and "those in authority over him" have decided he can keep his job, but he was "instructed to undertake safeguarding and social media protection training"!

"Who fancies a bit of safeguarding and social media protection training", (could be fascinating!).

 

[Elsie]

I'm not entirely sure what my friend meant by "those in authority", but I'd guess she didn't mean "just men" in authority, (and by "authority she meant those making the laws I guess).

There is a case at the moment in the UK where "someone in the public eye", (let's say), had said something inappropriate, and it was discovered, and "those in authority over him" have decided he can keep his job, but he was "instructed to undertake safeguarding and social media protection training"!

"Who fancies a bit of safeguarding and social media protection training", (could be fascinating!).

He used a foul word, or something prejudiced, or degrading of certain people, etc.? (Hmmm. "instructed to undertake safeguarding and social media protection training"! sounds pretty serious...if they feel he needs that. How can those in authority be assured he won't blurt out something "inappropriate" again as time goes by? We all say things we wish we hadn't said that at that moment gives a bad impression of us. Quite a conundrum.

 

[Sunny]

It depends on what sort of bad behavior you are talking about. If one person (doesn't have to be a man) finds a clever way to get into someone's email and steal all their passwords for instance, the email administrators absolutely should take measures to prevent this from happening ever again. It doesn't mean the criminal act is being held against all mankind, it's just ordinary precautions because some people are bad guys.

And so, for instance, when I want to communicate with my bank online, the bank texts a code to my phone, which I have to use before getting any access to my account or any information about it. I'm glad to have this safety measure, which was made necessary because of the bad actions of very few people. We are not being punished for their actions, we are being protected.

 

[Ruthanne]

Someone ought to remind your friend about all of the "idiosyncrasies" in women that we now - in this snowflake/feminist era - have been forbidden to discuss. Plus there are the injustices women have suffered in a previous time that we don't really want to see return wearing a new set of clothes.

Someone should disallow the use of the word "snowflake" as it is not very nice and attributed to those of a certain political persuasion.

 

[grahamg]

Someone should disallow the use of the word "snowflake" as it is not very nice and attributed to those of a certain political persuasion.

"Or just put up with it and learn to laugh at yourself, (whoever his being referred to)"?

 

[Brookswood]

it was immediately suggested that all further events ought to be for women only. No men allowed.

Most of the women I know enjoy men at events. Some are looking to meet a good man. Others just want free drinks. Some like to show off their man. Some know that when it's only women at a gathering the worst female tendencies are magnified and the claws come out. A few just like to not have men around.

Note: For the record, all male events sometimes bring out the stupid Macho Guy stuff. Neither sex is immune from being stupid.

 

[grahamg]

Most of the women I know enjoy men at events. Some are looking to meet a good man. Others just want free drinks. Some know that when it's only women at a gathering the worst female tendencies are magnified,...Break,Note: For the record, all male events sometimes bring out the stupid Macho Guy stuff. Neither sex is immune from being stupid.

Amen to that!