Pocketbooks to be squeezed further

[MACKTEXAS]

Are you saving for retirement, rainy day fund, paying off student debt, paying high rent/mtg in the metro's, saving for kids college, or buying a car?

No, I'm not doing all you enumerated. The implication is that accounts for the difference, and it's a valid point.

However, when I worked, I saved a lot toward retirement and emergencies ("rainy day fund"). No, I had no student debt. I had a car payment (every year from 1986 - 2014). I paid cash for my last car in 2018. When I worked, I had, and still have, a mortgage payment, although not high.

When we worked, my wife and I together did not earn as much as some single people did. It was often hard for us to understand why some of them were struggling. But if they "bit off more than they could chew" then I guess they deal with the outcome as best they can.

[Edited to add last sentence.]

 

[mathjak107]

My heart bleeds for you, cry me a river! The take out food delivery costs more than it used to. Well that's tough chit and that's not my problem to solve either, but here's a suggestion: If you can't afford it, don't order it.

most can afford it if they were ordering previously .

it just reached a point it ain’t worth using the services anymore because now the food delivery services have their own set of prices you get charged .

and so now the workers who saw such a big increase in wages are now working less , tips are greatly reduced and many had to go find new sources of employment.

we still bring in food as much as we used to when we were heavy users of door dash , we just get it ourselves and you get different prices ordering directly from a place

so markets are self adjusting when wages go to high .

 

[Rich]

Ted, I hope you know I'm not knocking your post or anything, but it showed $90,771 / year for Texas. I don't know what those people are calling "comfortable" but I live on less than half that. I'm careful with my money, but I have deprived myself of nothing.

UPS seems to have this figured out, they are doing well and they pay significantly more than minimum wage. I suppose if UPS can do this Amazon should be able to figure it out as well. I suspect Unions may be the next big target...

UPS delivery drivers earn solid wages, especially under their union-negotiated contracts. Here's a breakdown of what you can expect in 2025:
Base Pay & Progression

• Starting rate: $25.75/hour for full-time drivers
• After 1 year: $26.75/hour
• After 2 years: $27.75/hour
• After 3 years: $33.50/hour
• Top rate (after 4+ years): Typically $42–$44/hour depending on location

That means:
Starting annual salary: ~$53,560 (based on 40 hours/week)
Top-tier annual salary: $87,000+ — not including overtime

Overtime & Peak Season
Overtime is paid at 1.5× your hourly rate
Many drivers work 5–10 overtime hours weekly
During holidays, some earn six figures with extra shifts

Benefits Package
UPS drivers also receive:
Health, dental, and vision insurance
Pension and retirement savings
Paid vacation, holidays, and sick leave
Tuition assistance (up to $5,250/year)

Total Compensation
By the end of a five-year contract, full-time drivers can earn around $170,000 annually in combined pay and benefits.

 

[MACKTEXAS]

UPS seems to have this figured out, they are doing well and they pay significantly more than minimum wage. I suppose if UPS can do this Amazon should be able to figure it out as well. I suspect Unions may be the next big target...

UPS delivery drivers earn solid wages, especially under their union-negotiated contracts. Here's a breakdown of what you can expect in 2025:
Base Pay & Progression

• Starting rate: $25.75/hour for full-time drivers
• After 1 year: $26.75/hour
• After 2 years: $27.75/hour
• After 3 years: $33.50/hour
• Top rate (after 4+ years): Typically $42–$44/hour depending on location

That means:
Starting annual salary: ~$53,560 (based on 40 hours/week)
Top-tier annual salary: $87,000+ — not including overtime

Overtime & Peak Season
Overtime is paid at 1.5× your hourly rate
Many drivers work 5–10 overtime hours weekly
During holidays, some earn six figures with extra shifts

Benefits Package
UPS drivers also receive:
Health, dental, and vision insurance
Pension and retirement savings
Paid vacation, holidays, and sick leave
Tuition assistance (up to $5,250/year)

Total Compensation
By the end of a five-year contract, full-time drivers can earn around $170,000 annually in combined pay and benefits.

Thanks for the information, Rich. Quite often, we see things alike, so I'm not clear on why you're presenting your detail as a reply to my post instead of a stand alone post.

Even though I don't question your figures, I'm often surprised by today's current wages / salaries, since they've generally doubled in the accounting field I worked in 10 years ago, but unless you find information otherwise, the cost of living has not doubled in the same 10 years.

When I first contributed to this thread (post #21) it was just a link from Investopedia about how rising wages drive inflation, which expressed how I felt. I just wanted to leave a link instead of voicing an opinion. One thing led to another and then I'm in the middle of something ongoing which I'm really not even that interested in.

My subsequent posts and my answer to another member regarding certain of my expenses are still in this thread. I have less expenses than many single people, but I do have a mortgage, utility bills, groceries to buy, a car to maintain, house and car insurance to pay, etc., yet I can live on less than half of $90,000 a year.

Those singles who travel extensively, buy a lot more "stuff" than I do - and maybe their rent is $3000 a month or so, understandably might need it. But many of them may also be less careful with money than I am. My posts were not speaking about them or the wisdom (or lack thereof) of their financial decisions. I was simply relating my personal experiences.

 

[Aunt Bea]

I live on much less and am confident that most people do but the article was basing ‘comfortable’ on the 50-30-20 rule or strategy.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/11/how-to-follow-the-50-30-20-budgeting-strategy.html?&doc=108155302

50% of income for needs, 30% for wants, and 20% for savings and investments.

I think that the average American is squeaking by with most of their income devoted towards needs or roughly half of the income in the article.

 

[MACKTEXAS]

^^^^
Okay, but I take particular note of the last category "20% for savings and investments," when reading Bankrate's comments which indicates there isn't much saving going on:

"Only 46% of U.S. adults have enough emergency savings to cover three months of expenses. Additionally, 30% of people have some emergency savings but not enough to cover three months’ expenses, and 24% have no emergency savings at all."

[Edited to correct Bankrate link; sorry.]

 

[Aunt Bea]

^^^^
Okay, but I take particular note of the last category "20% for savings and investments," when reading Bankrate's comments which indicates there isn't much saving going on:

"Only 46% of U.S. adults have enough emergency savings to cover three months of expenses. Additionally, 30% of people have some emergency savings but not enough to cover three months’ expenses, and 24% have no emergency savings at all."

[Edited to correct Bankrate link; sorry.]

It’s difficult to get a good understanding from a few statistics.

I know that when I was young, I lived paycheck to paycheck and had no emergency savings and no investments.

I also believe that many Americans use credit cards to power them through the rough spots in life.

The bottom line is that we all seem to manage whatever life throws our way.

 

[outlander]

Money tells you what to do. You become a slave to it. If you fall for society's agenda which is to spend, spend, spend to get the best, the latest, the newest, what your neighbor has, what you must have, then you have achieved success and happiness!

Congratulations! You have succeeded in life! But don't waste too much time on this forum. You need to get back to work to buy some newer updated things to be even happier!

 

[MACKTEXAS]

(1) It’s difficult to get a good understanding from a few statistics.

(2) I know that when I was young, I lived paycheck to paycheck and had no emergency savings and no investments.

(3) I also believe that many Americans use credit cards to power them through the rough spots in life.

(2) The bottom line is that we all seem to manage whatever life throws our way.

(1) True, that's why I was surprised when reading the statistics, and felt like commenting, even though this will be my final post to this particular thread.

(2) I was the same, Aunt Bea until age 30. After that age, I always saved, and did without things I didn't have to have in order to save.

(3) Too many - it's in the news. Credit card balances now stand at a record-high $1.21 trillion. I use a credit card and pay my balance when I get the bill.

(4) Not quite all of us. Around 23 out of every 10,000 Americans — 771,480 people — experienced homelessness in January 2024.
______________________________________________

 

[Aunt Bea]

Money tells you what to do. You become a slave to it. If you fall for society's agenda which is to spend, spend, spend to get the best, the latest, the newest, what your neighbor has, what you must have, then you have achieved success and happiness!

Congratulations! You have succeeded in life! But don't waste too much time on this forum. You need to get back to work to buy some newer updated things to be even happier!

I’ve never been very interested in stuff.

For me money has always been about freedom and security.

“I've been rich and I've been poor. Rich is better.” - Sophie Tucker

 

[mathjak107]

money has represented choices in life to me and staying out of the projects where i grew up .

it isn’t as much about spending for us.

as an investor i made quite a bit of money over the years and i enjoyed doing it so i certainly was no slave to it .

in fact investing is my money working for me

 

[Muskrat]

I once was trying to find out how many seniors lived exclusively on social security…and then found that unless someone outright divulges this info there is no way to know. Statistics lie.

 

[mathjak107]

I once was trying to find out how many seniors lived exclusively on social security…and then found that unless someone outright divulges this info there is no way to know. Statistics lie.

not true at all .

the irs gets every statement no matter what the source and whether they file a return or not .

only 19% of those who receive social security have ss making up 90% of their income according to the irs .

but most never really live on ss alone .

some work off the books , most lower incomes get subsidized in some way .

a side from medicare assistance , medicaid , there are all different programs like utility assistance , here in nyc we have scrie. , which is where seniors in stabilized apartments never see another rent increase if the rent is more than 30% or so of their income .

there are food stamps for some and medication assistance on costly drugs .

lower incomes can have bigger apparent incomes than those earning much more who don’t qualify for anything

so no one really lives on just ss

 

[Muskrat]

That is exactly what i mean…people have money in the bank, under the bed. Their kids assist. They might own their home…or not. Hard to get a clear picture.

 

[Aunt Bea]

That is exactly what i mean…people have money in the bank, under the bed. Their kids assist. They might own their home…or not. Hard to get a clear picture.

Another thing that is overlooked is credit card debt.

I’ve known two seniors that subsidized a very small Social Security check by carefully managing and pyramiding large amounts of credit card debt among several cards over several years until everything simply collapsed around them and the unsecured debt was eventually written off by the issuers.

 

[Muskrat]

@Aunt Bea ….I actually know of someone who bought a mobile home on a lot doing this. The mobile home was not encumbered by the debt because a credit card was used….

 

[mathjak107]

That is exactly what i mean…people have money in the bank, under the bed. Their kids assist. They might own their home…or not. Hard to get a clear picture.

in reality no one knows what any of us have .

there is a whole underground economy generating billions and billions of dollars.

i used to work in brownsville brooklyn .

it is one of the most ghetto places in nyc .

no one seemed to be lacking money for phones , sneakers , beer , lottery tickets and cars.

quite frankly i couldn’t care less what everyone has .

i care about keeping us financially solvent.

most articles on the subject are just click bait

 

[gruntlabor]

error

 

[retiredtraveler]

"minimum wage was for teens starting out"

That's a myth that people use to make themselves feel better about seeing other people being treated badly.

From the dept of Labor....
The 1996 Amendments to the FLSA allow employers to pay a youth minimum wage of not less than $4.25 an hour to employees who are under 20 years of age during the first 90 consecutive calendar days after initial employment.

 

[againstthegrain]

From the dept of Labor....
The 1996 Amendments to the FLSA allow employers to pay a youth minimum wage of not less than $4.25 an hour to employees who are under 20 years of age during the first 90 consecutive calendar days after initial employment.

There's min standards for youth that are different than adults, so what. There were minimum wages in the 1930's in the US for adults and children.

 

[Rich]

From the dept of Labor....
The 1996 Amendments to the FLSA allow employers to pay a youth minimum wage of not less than $4.25 an hour to employees who are under 20 years of age during the first 90 consecutive calendar days after initial employment.

In Florida, employers can pay workers under 20 just $4.25 per hour—but only for the first 90 days. After that, they’re required to bump up to the full minimum wage, currently $12 an hour. Makes you wonder how many businesses are cycling through young hires every three months to keep costs down.
It reminds me of the 1980s, when the company I worked for had two secretaries splitting the day. Each worked half-time—neither qualified for benefits. Clever accounting or strategic exploitation? Depends on who you ask.