Roe vs. Wade....again

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chic said:
It isn't an issue of morality. It's subjugating women by limiting their choices in life by denying them reproductive rights. It's a huge step backward IMHO.
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I said morality because it seems a lot of these anti-abortion cranks are also Religious fanatics. But that's what I get for living down here in the Bible Belt. But I agree with you. It's a huge step backward. And I am vehemently against it.
 
This morning, the local news said that our State Senate passed an anti-abortion bill that puts our State among those who are trying to dictate this issue to women. I suspect that this issue will soon be headed to the Supreme Court, and I hope the court leaves this responsibility to the people and the doctors. An increase in funding for things like Planned Parenthood, and better education for our young, regarding childbirth, would be a far better approach than what these States are proposing.
 
Roe vs. Wade will never be overturned, or at least not in our lifetime. States that are passing their own laws that circumvent the RW ruling will have their laws overturned by the high court.

Until the SCOTUS changes their position, the law will stand as they have ruled.
 
Trade said:
I said morality because it seems a lot of these anti-abortion cranks are also Religious fanatics. But that's what I get for living down here in the Bible Belt. But I agree with you. It's a huge step backward. And I am vehemently against it.
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It was the Son of God. A Daughter of God was never considered. And when the angel Gabriel told Mary she was pregnant, she didn't have a choice about it. Nothing's changed. All religions across the planet subjugate women one way or another. Except today it's women who are just as vicious and would prefer to see women die in back alleys, especially since doctors who perform abortions would be subject to criminal liability.

The Father, The Son, and the Holy Ghost are all males.
 
Don M. said:
It seems that recently there is a movement in several states to put severe restrictions on Abortion and effectively close down organizations like Planned Parenthood. What are your thoughts on this issue? Personally, I think there are already far too many children being born to parents who either cannot afford, or have no desire, to raise them properly. I will agree with these anti-abortion activists when I see them lining up to adopt these unwanted children.
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I agree with the unwanted, unable to care for issue with parents. Once again, Americans behaving badly. DW and I are pro-choice, but the 'other side' has a point.

I listened to a couple of discussions on this. I found some striking talking points:

-- there are almost 20 states that have movements to support legislation similar to Alabama --- Missouri being next in line.
--- even though it's essentially 50 years with roe/wade, almost half the country still has a problem with it (depends on the poll you read, but it would appear a solid 40% have an issue)
--- the primary issue with those that support Alabama is that it's murder. If you're pro choice, you don't believe the fetus is a human. Roe/Wade condones killing and those that abort put their own wants over the killing of a human. That's why rapists would get a smaller sentence than the woman having the abortion.

Anyway, you decide. There was also a discussion about the conservative court and a very good possibility that Row/Wade will be overturned.
 
That's why rapists would get a smaller sentence than the woman having the abortion.
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So these people want punishment for the women? And rapists would get a lighter sentence?

I would love to see a reference for that. I've actually heard only one person saying women who have an abortion should be punished, and that was in an interview on TV.
 
Olivia said:
So these people want punishment for the women? And rapists would get a lighter sentence?

I would love to see a reference for that. I've actually heard only one person saying women who have an abortion should be punished, and that was in an interview on TV.
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All you have to do is 'google': "should women be punished for abortion" and you can find all sorts of citations. There is some percentage of the population, as I mentioned, that believe abortion is homicide. Therefore, women should be subject to the laws for homicide. You don't have to agree. Also, as stated, around 20 states have movements to enact legislation similar to Alabama.

[h=3]Poll: Women should be punished for abortions, say 39 percent of ...[/h]
 
Trade said:
If you don't like abortion, don't get one. It's that simple. It's not the government's business to legislate morality.
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Not that simple. A goodly percentage of people don't look at it as a moral issue. They look at it as homicide. You choose to believe that a fetus is not a person. A great many people would disagree.
 
retiredtraveler said:
A goodly percentage of people don't look at it as a moral issue. They look at it as homicide. You choose to believe that a fetus is not a person. A great many people would disagree.
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Then a goodly percentage of people are FUBAR in the head.

The idea that I should be able to sit down and calmly and rationally discuss issues with people who have a different opinion than mine has limits. And this goes way beyond those limits.
 
retiredtraveler said:
All you have to do is 'google': "should women be punished for abortion" and you can find all sorts of citations. There is some percentage of the population, as I mentioned, that believe abortion is homicide. Therefore, women should be subject to the laws for homicide. You don't have to agree. Also, as stated, around 20 states have movements to enact legislation similar to Alabama.

Poll: Women should be punished for abortions, say 39 percent of ...
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I was asking what legislation passed anywhere provides punishment for women who have abortions. So far, I have only found "opinions" about that. I've no doubt that fanatical idiots would love to pass the death penalty for this "crime".
 
retiredtraveler said:
Not that simple. A goodly percentage of people don't look at it as a moral issue. They look at it as homicide. You choose to believe that a fetus is not a person. A great many people would disagree.
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Wrong. Those who see it as homicide always have moral reasoning. They may mention heartbeat, other science, but their "logic" is based on their personal reality, which always tracks back to religion. Also to their control freak personalities. A woman is not a brood mare to be bred against her will. A fetus is dependent on it's host. A viable person is not.
 
Trade said:
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Ugh. That reminds me of back in the '80s when I went into the hospital to have my tubes tied having had all the kids we wanted. They would not operate until my husband signed the PERMISSION page. I was madder than eff and spewed plenty of expletives in that hospital. Of course, my husband signed, but still... what the actual hell?? I am no one's property, and that wasn't so long ago. It still steams my oats to think of that.
 
C'est Moi said:
Ugh. That reminds me of back in the '80s when I went into the hospital to have my tubes tied having had all the kids we wanted. They would not operate until my husband signed the PERMISSION page. I was madder than eff and spewed plenty of expletives in that hospital. Of course, my husband signed, but still... what the actual hell?? I am no one's property, and that wasn't so long ago. It still steams my oats to think of that.
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Sorta related?...if I'm hijacking?...I apologize..........

In 1968 , while working at a Pontiac dealer, a young woman inquired about a car to one of the salesmen.....I happened to be standing there. The salesman replied.....well, why don't you stop by this evening with your husband, and we'll all sit down & discuss it.........Try that today....:eek:nthego:
 
fmdog44 said:
Look at how many voters on the new Alabama law are men.
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And look at who signed it. Alabama is #33 of all the states in voter turnout. 2/3rds of white woman voted for a child molester in the last election. The people of Alabama don't care to vote, so they don't much care about the issues. That's fine --- states rights. They want this legislation, voted for men who support this legislation (in relatively small numbers), they got it.
I have a real pet peeve about people not showing up to vote, so I always figure you get the government you want. If you don't care to vote, you're happy with things. If you're not, you forfeit the right to complain.
 
Does anyone think this new legislation is connected with the “browning of America?” As the white population decreases in the US this would be a way a sneaky backdoor way to increase it. Just curious.
 
Aneeda72 said:
Does anyone think this new legislation is connected with the “browning of America?” As the white population decreases in the US this would be a way a sneaky backdoor way to increase it. Just curious.
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You are definitely on to something. However, it would certainly increase the "browning" as well, but we are not dealing with rational thinkers here.
 
Pepper,

There would have to be a breakdown of which of the different races obtain the most terminations. It might be illegal to collect such data. Then you’d have to take into account what faith different people are and how that affected their decision, again that might be illegal.

But it’s the southern states, the Bible Belt, so I think there is some connection. In some places in the south, women are still considered second class citizens. Plus, we can’t afford the children that are in foster care now. What will we do with all those unwanted babies?

There was a case in Utah where large amounts of abused children were removed from a certain segment of the population. They were returned because the state could not afford to care for them. It always comes down to the money. It’s going to be an interesting case to watch.
 

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