Tesla stock downgraded; Musk's behavior to blame

SeniorBen

SeniorBen

Senior Member
Surveys find Tesla's brand image is falling, and sales people say "a lot" of customers canceling reservations and not signing new leases blame Musk's Twitter behavior.

On Monday, Oppenheimer was among the first major analyst firms to issue a downgrade for Tesla's stock, CNBC reported, rating it at "perform" from "outperform" before. On Tuesday, Evercore ISI slashed its 12-month price target for Tesla stock by a third, cutting it to $200 from $300. Analysts at Daiwa Capital Markets reportedly marked their target even lower, at $177, citing a "higher risk profile from the Twitter distraction." Tesla's stock has sunk more than 10% just this week.
https://www.cnet.com/tech/these-tesla-drivers-are-done-with-elon-musks-twitter-drama/
 

It sounds like the Tesla short sellers are getting their revenge. They lost their pants a few years ago when everybody and his brother were predicting that Tesla would fail sometime in 2020 and close shop or be taken over by a real automobile company like GM or VW. Instead the stock soared and the short sellers had to pay big dollars to cover their bad bets on the stock's price.

Is Telsa stock over priced? IMO, it is. I don't diretly own any and never have. I assume that my total US market index fund probably has some Tesla shares in it. Nothing I can control, manipulate or frame and put on my office wall.

IMO, the fuss over Musk's behavior is mainly a mass media event. I recall that when Musk first took over Twitter some where saying the company was only a few days away from having to close its door and shut down. Then a few weeks. Well, it is still up and running. That should tell you something.
 

Tesla was over 400 just a little over a year ago. Now it's at 123 and in an apparent free-fall. Yikes! :ROFLMAO:

Two years ago, it was at about 25, so it all depends on when you got in or got out.
 
Under no circumstances would I buy a Tesla. It has nothing to do with the guy being a jerk. I will continue to stick with my tried and true brands: Honda and Toyota. If I want to change to something more environmentally friendly, buying a scaled down ( not fully loaded) hybrid from one of them is the way to go.

I don't do individual stocks. So if I'm invested in Tesla, it's because a fund manager thinks it was wise.
 
An 'expert' was on talk radio the other morning. He said a large part of the fall is due to the falling / failing love of electric cars. He said that in his opinion, the sales of them has reached it's peak ? If I recall correctly ... in the begining Tesla stock was over $700 per share .... sure glad I didn't buy-in then.
 
I have read a little about Musk's Twitter behavior.
He has agreed to step down.

I do not know enough about today's new technology cars.
I have heard of the name Telsa.
Electric and Hybrid cars are becomng the new trend in automotive driving.
Other than that I have no knowledge.

Starting in 2008 or 2009, I began thinking that now is the time to stay away from investing.
Stock's value will go up and down.
 
I have never invested in auto companies.
If I were to invest in a company I would want to know about the company and then do more thinking about whether to invest or not to invest.
 
As a point of reference, the average closing price for Dow Jones in 2008 was 11,244. The Dow closed Friday (yesterday) at 33,203. You can do math.

Also, the first known electric (battery) powered vehicle was made in 1890 by a chemist in Des Moines, IA. Still trying to work the bugs out 122 years later..
 
Buckeye said:
As a point of reference, the average closing price for Dow Jones in 2008 was 11,244. The Dow closed Friday (yesterday) at 33,203. You can do math.

Also, the first known electric (battery) powered vehicle was made in 1890 by a chemist in Des Moines, IA. Still trying to work the bugs out 122 years later..
Click to expand...
The technology is fairly simple. You just need a battery to power the motor and off you go! The impediment has always been battery technology, but that's changing rapidly. You can see that in your phone battery. It used to take all night to charge your phone, but now it only takes an hour, and the battery lasts longer. And batteries are getting cheaper, too!

We're to the point where electric cars are feasible for some commuters, but perhaps not so much for someone who drives a lot during the day. They take too long to charge and don't last long enough for it to be practical, but give it a few more years and it will be so. Electric cars are the technology of the future. Good riddance to gas powered cars!
 
rgp said:
An 'expert' was on talk radio the other morning. He said a large part of the fall is due to the falling / failing love of electric cars. He said that in his opinion, the sales of them has reached it's peak ? If I recall correctly ... in the begining Tesla stock was over $700 per share .... sure glad I didn't buy-in then.
Click to expand...
I think there is some truth to that. Think about what it takes to purchase a new Tesla:

1. A very good income. Telsa cars are more expensive to purchase than many other similar vehicles of the same type including hybrids.
2. Most Tesla buyers have a personal and private place to charge their Tesla overnight.They can plug in their car in the late evening, sleep and wake up in the morning to a fully charged vehicle.
3. They often drive shorter distances on major highways with lots of charging stations conveniently located.

IOW, I am saying that EVs may have picked all the low-hanging fruit when it comes to people who will actually buy an EV. Now the EV makers have to figure out how to get all the middle and lower income people to buy an EV. For starters where do they get the extra money to pay for an EV?

And they have to figure out how the people who live in apartments, high-rise condos, etc. who don't have a private parking area, how are they going to easily and conveniently charge their EV overnight? They aren't going to want to drive over to a public charging station at 10:00 PM before going to bed, wait 30 minutes to an hour for the car to charge to 80%, and then drive back home with a charged car ready for tomorrow.

How many apartment complexes and condo buildings have enough chargers for each owner to plug in their EV at night and have it fully charged in the morning? My guess is a very small percentage. I've never seen one with a charger for each unit. Yet that is what it will take.

Despite the number of public chargers being built , people on long drives to out of the way places still face charging anxiety. Even if a charger is available, it is usually a slower charger that takes a lot of time. There are no quick fill-ups. Even the famed Tesla Superchargers take 20-30 minutes to get the car to 80% charged. Let's see 80% of a 400 mile driving range is 320 miles. Not much of a driving range if you are driving out West, or suddenly have to take a long detour on small country roads that have been blocked or closed for some reason.

And, by the way, where is all the power to do the charging going to come from? And where will the transmission lines be built? How will that power be generated?
 
Brookswood said:
They can plug in their car in the late evening, sleep and wake up in the morning to a fully charged vehicle.
Click to expand...
If they have their owner charging station, they can control when the charger comes on from their smart phone.

Brookswood said:
people on long drives to out of the way places still face charging anxiety
Click to expand...
My SS experienced this the first time he drove through the mountain roads to get here. As another driver said to him, itā€™s a learning experience and soon it becomes second nature. He found that true.

I think many new buildings are being required to have EV plug-ins. Friends who bought in a fancy condo have to go to a central location to charge. Thatā€™s not too hard if youā€™re retired. Still a PITA.
 
One of my pet peeves is the need for Tesla owners to mention the brand when they talk about any place they go. ā€Drove the Tesla toā€¦..ā€
If someone wants to promote their car, at least just say ā€œdrove the EV to ā€¦.ā€
 
Jace said:
Just checked....@$122.19

What did it start at? šŸ¤”
Click to expand...

In the last three years, Tesla shares have gone from $28.50 (Dec 30, 2019) to a high of about $418 to the current price of about $115. There was a five-for-one split in there somewhere as well.

Musk has faced some similarly awful situations in the past. It will be interesting to see if he rebounds from this one. I hope he does as we own a hundred shares and are down a lot.
 
MissRJ said:
I have read a little about Musk's Twitter behavior.
He has agreed to step down.

I do not know enough about today's new technology cars.
I have heard of the name Telsa.
Electric and Hybrid cars are becomng the new trend in automotive driving.
Other than that I have no knowledge.

Starting in 2008 or 2009, I began thinking that now is the time to stay away from investing.
Stock's value will go up and down.
Click to expand...

The value of stocks will definitely go up and down. On the other hand, over the last 50 years the stock market has returned almost 10 percent per year on average. That's hard to beat. If you have time and patience, putting your money in an S&P index fund or ETF is close to a sure thing.
 
An EV-plosion awaits in 2023, and itā€™ll be packed with tech
2022 was the year that electric vehicles entered the mainstream. Not everyone has one, but buying an EV no longer makes you an outlier. Driven by policy initiatives from governments and billions of dollars in investment from automakers, we can safely say the EV industry has begun to take shape.
https://techcrunch.com/2022/12/27/an-ev-plosion-awaits-in-2023-and-itll-be-packed-with-tech/

I had to go downtown this afternoon and on the way there and back, I spotted four Teslas. Not that I was looking for them, but they were on the road ahead of me in close proximity and I just happened to notice them. Obviously, they're popular in Denver and the surrounding areas.

All the major car manufacturers are now producing EVs and they're out there too, but just not as easy to spot as Tesla's EVs. Tesla only manufactures EVs while other car makers produce gas, hybrid, and diesel vehicles along with EVs.

EVs are the future, and as much as that upsets luddites and troglodytes, they can't stop progress.
 
SeniorBen said:
An EV-plosion awaits in 2023, and itā€™ll be packed with tech
2022 was the year that electric vehicles entered the mainstream. Not everyone has one, but buying an EV no longer makes you an outlier. Driven by policy initiatives from governments and billions of dollars in investment from automakers, we can safely say the EV industry has begun to take shape.
https://techcrunch.com/2022/12/27/an-ev-plosion-awaits-in-2023-and-itll-be-packed-with-tech/

I had to go downtown this afternoon and on the way there and back, I spotted four Teslas. Not that I was looking for them, but they were on the road ahead of me in close proximity and I just happened to notice them. Obviously, they're popular in Denver and the surrounding areas.

All the major car manufacturers are now producing EVs and they're out there too, but just not as easy to spot as Tesla's EVs. Tesla only manufactures EVs while other car makers produce gas, hybrid, and diesel vehicles along with EVs.

EVs are the future, and as much as that upsets luddites and troglodytes, they can't stop progress.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone is denying that EVs are the future. The question is whether the future is here just yet. Based on what I've heard about "range anxiety" and the limitations of the grid, I would have to say "not quite."

There is another issue as well, which is the environmental impact of EVs in terms of use of scarce resources, battery pollution, increased electrical demand and other concerns. I'm sure the overall impact is much less than that of gas-powered vehicles but it has to be taken into consideration.
 
I'm not surprised that Musk himself is the cause of the downgrade. Also there have been several incidences with Tesla cars over the past few years. I read an article from 2018 that I can't find now, citing problems even at the manufacturing level including Tesla using parts they shouldn't have according to an employee. Hopefully those were rectified. There's currently a class action suit.
"Between July 2021 and June 2022, there were 392 reported crashes involving driver-assistance programs, with Tesla accounting for nearly 70% of them. In some cases, the programs failed to recognize emergency vehicles or motorcycles."
https://www.sokolovelaw.com/product-liability/tesla/
And incidences continued into 2022.
 
Liberty said:
Tesla's stock is down 68% this year. Think when Ford and GM get fully cranked up on EVs, by 2024 or 5 Tesla will be eating their dust. Tesla has GM as their EV servicing stations.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/general-motors-gm-dealership-tesla-service-direct-sales/

Ford closed their 2022order book on the Lightening trucks...had over 200,000 orders. They had to build a
new factory just for the truck.

https://www.autoblog.com/2022/12/04/ford-f150-lightning-orders-factory-expansion/
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Nevertheless, Ford and GM both saw steep drops in their share prices. Tesla's was a little steeper due to the Musk/Twitter factor. Will be interesting to see what happens this year. I own both Tesla and Ford and hope they both do well.
 
Jules said:
One of my pet peeves is the need for Tesla owners to mention the brand when they talk about any place they go. ā€Drove the Tesla toā€¦..ā€
If someone wants to promote their car, at least just say ā€œdrove the EV to ā€¦.ā€
Click to expand...
Today, I'll be driving my Mitsubishi Outlander Sport to work. Then I'll be driving my Mitsubishi Outlander Sport back home. :)
 

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