What do you hate about church?

There are mainstream churches in every city with well educated ministers of both sexes and rational services meant to help us make sense of it all. It's sad to read how fundamentalist churches have turned people off on religion. I'm glad I was raised Presbyterian. I never heard a fire and brimstone sermon, we were never threatened with hell for dancing or drinking, we were never asked to come down front at the end of the service and there were no sex scandals.
 

The OP actually posted such a title on our public Senior Forum haha? Associated the word church and hate together in a thread title like ignoring trying to mix oil and water? Which planet did you grow up on?
 
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VintageBetter said:
I'll start: I am so sick of male preachers teaching the Bible as if heaven is a football game. Or a basketball game. Or a race with blue ribbons to be won at the end. (Alas, if time is infinite, there is no end, correct?)

I am so sick of the male vision of the Bible's many analogies.

I am sick of the male privilege exercised by the church for centuries.

I'm sick of church structure. I hate how we're supposed to sit there for 30 to 45 minutes and listen. When do we get to ask questions or present our opinions or tell people what's going on in our lives? (Don't say "in Bible Study" because I've been to many of those where the church structure is the same: "you heathen just sit there and listen to the learned teacher"). Example: Why don't they have a microphone set up in the aisle so those brave enough among us can walk right up and ask the preacher/pastor some question in the middle of the sermon? Why, after all these centuries, are we treated like little jars to be filled and not equals with church leadership?

I'm sick of praise songs that are the same verse sung 70 times. I hate those the most. When did someone think boring people to death musically was a good way to illustrate the spiritual? And if I say honestly, "I really hate that song", why am I seen as a trouble maker for being honest?

I guess I ask too many questions. If some church came along that did actually shake up the whole church formula, they'd probably be roundly and severely condemned by other churches. Peer pressure.
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I think you might like a Quaker service. They have no official minister and anyone is allowed to stand up and speak as often as she/he likes. We have Quaker services around here because of a local Quaker run college in Wilmington Ohio. They're a very intelligent bunch that has believed in women's equality from the start. I think you would fit in well.
 

January said:
I no longer go to church - but I dont think OP's experience is the same in all churches.

The one I used to go to did have informal services (as well as their traditional Sunday morning one) and people could ask questions ,raise points etc
and if you hated a particular song you could say so
and there were women ministers too.
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Which denomination, January? Mine is UCA.
 
Della said:
There are mainstream churches in every city with well educated ministers of both sexes and rational services meant to help us make sense of it all. It's sad to read how fundamentalist churches have turned people off on religion. I'm glad I was raised Presbyterian. I never heard a fire and brimstone sermon, we were never threatened with hell for dancing or drinking, we were never asked to come down front at the end of the service and there were no sex scandals.
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Presbyterian clergy have always been very well educated.
 
I was brought up in a Scottish Presbyterian family, and without it being 'Fire and brimstone', was rather too fundamentalist. I think that my parents were even more fundamentalist than any of the church ministers. This was made worse by their refusal / inability to explain their beliefs. It just was and I had to obey it.

I didn't hate the church, but I had no belief in its teachings. Back in the day, getting married meant either church or registry office - and that was no choice at all. Mrs. L and I went to church for a while so we could get married there in a simple service. A bit hypocritical some might say, but that's what we did. We were never back, and our children were never baptised.

Now, in Scotland, Secular marriage ceremonies are the most common type.
 
I don't hate anything about church, just so long as I don't have to attend. I do dislike various beliefs that I think are harmful to people who are supposed to loved by Christians, as Jesus loved the Christians (although they were not called Christians at the time Jesus said that, I suppose).
 
There is nothing that I hate about church…hate is too strong a word…although there are things I dislike about some churches, and the orientations that they as individual churches have chosen to take.

As Paul Little observed, “Being a Christian does not mean kissing your brains goodbye.“ I don’t like churches that have devolved into cults with unquestioning obedience towards autocratic-types of leadership, or cults of personality. I don’t like churches that have been infiltrated by rigid adherence to political philosophies, or that essentially operate with a political infrastructure indistinguishable from the secular world, including favoritism and partiality among particular congregational members. I don’t like churches that judge and condemn people for being different in one way or another, or practice different forms of “shunning.”

i don’t like churches that put an excessive emphasis upon financial giving, or church leaders with an “edifice complex” that seek beyond reason to expand their building or facilities...and I don’t like churches that excessively dump responsibilities on members who simply have demonstrated interest or capability in certain things…

IMG_1334.jpeg
 
May I add........
One of the most enjoyable and realistic tv series I've watched is "Young Sheldon". Their portrayal of a southern (Texas) small town Baptist Church and its staff is spot on. It's take on religion, growing up, Texas, and relationships is truly the best I've seen. And, it contains a lot of scientific information given in a way that most of us can understand.
 
Lilac said:
I don't hate anything about the church.

This question is for our members living in Europe. Is there still a church tax that you have to pay? I remember hearing about it years ago from my uncle in Germany. Not sure if it's still a thing or not. Here, we have no tax & the money comes from the parishioners to the church for support.
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Yes. In Germany you still must pay church tax, if you're a member of the church. In former times the churches were collecting "Kirchgeld" (literally church money) too, but this was voluntary. I don't mean the money you give during the service, but a similar voluntary fee as the obligatory church tax.
 
As a Muslim, the only time I go to church now is for funerals. But I was raised Christian (Methodist) and had to go to church every Sunday plus Sunday school before church began. I don't know if you've ever been to a Black church, but services are long! It's funny you gave the analogy of football and basketball games. I remember as a young woman being very turned off by the minister seeming to focus more on sports than the religious teaching. I also started to notice that Easter and Christmas sermons seemed to have been "recycled". Although I considered myself a Christian until I was about 47 years old, I stopped going to church on the regular when I was in my mid 20s.

Also as a young woman I remember hearing the story about a girl who got pregnant and the Catholic church turned her away. I thought they should have done what they could to help her. Also I thought it was sexist that women couldn't be bishops and hold higher positions within the Catholic church. I guess it was the same in the Methodist churches too, although we did (and do) have female pastors.

I also very much hate the fact that so many priests were allowed to get away with molesting boys. Instead of being banned from the priesthood, they were shuffled around and the scandals were hushed. I was shocked to find out boys were being molested at a Catholic church in my neighborhood. Knowing that just made the issue that much more real to me and reading one of the men's stories of what happened to him as a child broke my heart and angered me at the same time.
 
January said:
yes it was Uniting Church of Australia
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The Uniting Church is not uniform in its theology. Some congregations are very progressive while others close by seem to be stuck in the past. There is one in the next suburb to mine that very retrograde. They think that our congregation is on the way to Hell in a handbasket.
 
Due to my MISUNDERSTANDING of what the Church was
all about, I grew into a very depressed, unsatisfied individual,
esp regarding self-worth, finance's, and such. I felt as tho I
would NEVER be good enough both for the "CHURCH" and
for life itself. I believed that EVERYONE was my judge of my
worth, and they all looked DOWN on me, and I looked DOWN
on myself......our family went to a "christian" church in the
little town......:(:cry:
 
Let me clarify - I don't hate The Church, in all its forms. I have seen is that The Church, whether it's the Catholics, Protestants, Baptists, Methodists, etc., has TRIED mightily to do some good over the centuries.

In fact, in my area, some of our best hospitals were started as part of a religious sponsorship and they still see their mission is to heal as Jesus healed.

But what I hate is the STRUCTURE of so many church services and I also hate he misogyny that is traditional at so many churches, and the lackluster, soulless music at many.

Yesterday I attended church online. I "went" to an A.M.E. service online and I really liked it - liked the music and the preaching.
 
CinnamonSugar said:
The title of this thread saddens me... why be negative? I'm not saying church is perfect but there are some very good things.
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I did clarify in my last comment that I hate the STRUCTURE of church services. I think many misunderstood me. It's OK. I'm sure God has heard these complaints plenty over the centuries.
 
January said:
I no longer go to church - but I dont think OP's experience is the same in all churches.

The one I used to go to did have informal services (as well as their traditional Sunday morning one) and people could ask questions ,raise points etc
and if you hated a particular song you could say so
and there were women ministers too.
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Wow. That is a very progressive church. I think there is so much obedience at most churches that I'm the only one who will complain about an issue. Then, if I dare to complain, then I'm labeled a gadfly - an annoyance. Gosh, at some places, not even mere discussion is allowed on how to make things more meaningful.

Rather than be labeled as an annoyance, I just leave and go looking for a better fit. Often I will just visit a church only once and I'll know. I'll know I will never fit there, women are not treated as equals, so I have to bolt.

I guess that's what prompted this posting. It scares me how many churches I have visited where women are 2nd class citizens. Truly frightening to see that still in 2024.
 
VintageBetter said:
I think there is so much obedience at most churches that I'm the only one who will complain about an issue.
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Unfortunately, that seems to be the case in a lot of religions. It's no wonder that some humans seem to want to worship without question a "strong", real-life, cruel, authoritarian p*litical leader; heck, some humans invented a strong, cruel, authoritarian supreme being.
 
JeeperDon said:
I hate that they don't pay taxes.
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The property for churches and other religious places of worship are tax exempt for the reason that they ARE public places of worship. Churches are considered 501(c)(3) charities. What would you have being taxed exactly? The money that worshipers/parishioners give to keep the church running? Considering that was parishioner money from their wallet, it already WAS taxed as their income when they made the money. Double taxing generally doesn't go over very well.
 
C50 said:
Why would I hate church? I'm an atheist but even that's certainly no reason to hate church or those who choose to attend.

Sounds like a gas lighting question to me.
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NOT FAIR, SIR!

Gaslighting definition: "In short, gaslighting happens when someone manipulates you into thinking your version of events didn’t happen the way you say they happened. They may gaslight you by questioning your authority, denying the evidence you have or doing everything they can to make you feel like you’re wrong."

If I come here to complain that I have a lot of problems with the STRUCTURE of many church services, and I guess I have a problem relating the the authority figures who are so many pastors and preachers, and I dislike the boring, repetitive church songs so many contemporary churches have adopted, my statements are not manipulating anyone's opposite beliefs or experiences at their churches of choice.

If I say, "I really hate Pistachio ice cream", does that mean I hate all ice cream, or that you are not allowed to say you love Pistachio ice cream? NO!

As I said to another poster, I don't think it's going to hurt God's feelings if I or anyone else WHINES or complains about his groups of people clumped together trying to do something to honor and acknowledge him following a FORMULA laid out centuries before.

Quite frankly, my church experience is a lot like taking a college CLASS and complaining, "Wow, I really hated that class and I thought the professor was A, B and C. I really dislike A and B and I can barely tolerate C. I'm sure glad I never have to take that class again." Does that mean I hated the SUBJECT? Not necessarily.

I'm not trying to tell ANYONE to leave their church and see things my way. THIS IS MY PERSONAL JOURNEY. These are the problems I have with so many churches. I just posted this prompt to see what others think and find out if others also feel they have a spiritual life, but they have a hard time finding a church.

And I do genuinely believe one can have "church" all by themselves because we are never alone with God on our side. Many a prisoner in solitary confinement for years has only had God for companionship. (Nelson Mandela is one notable example.) However, that is a lonely journey.
 

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