Where does the desire to mate come from?

Elsie said:
If the audience doesn't know there is good repport between the actor and little person with dwarfism, how can they know that the actor's asparagus joke is not hurtful to the little person? To laugh, or not, is the question.
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If the audience doesn't know it, you'd be right. But the series and the actors are so well known and so popular, that the people know it from articles in magazines and numerous imterviews on TV. And the purpose of these jokes is, that the people should think about it, if they could be offensive or hurtful.

The same with a female comedian who makes jokes on women and men. She is very popular too. At first there must be the shock, then the relief.
 

@Paco Dennis post is most relevant. The dopamine neural reward system evolved in animal nervous systems from some of the earliest, most primitive life forms including highly studied c. elegans, a worm, for the purpose of ingesting nutrients and then evolved for other positive for species survival purposes like mating in higher vertebrate and invertebrate species.

Where does the desire to mate come from?

The roles of dopamine and related compounds in reward-seeking behavior across animal phyla

Frontiers | The Roles of Dopamine and Related Compounds in Reward-Seeking Behavior Across Animal Phyla
 
I asked Bing ai about the male preying mantis and male black widow for if they have any clue about their fate after crossing home plate. There is some information about them looking to jump her bones after she has already had dinner or is somewhat preoccupied, so they seem to know they are crossing into the danger zone.
 
1961....the "sex talk" that Freshman girls got every year from the gym teacher:

We were told that boys think about sex "all the time" because their sex organs were on the outside of their bodies and they see them often. When they see them, they think about sex.

Girls, on the other hand, have sex organs that are on the inside of our bodies, so we don't think about them as much. Thus, we were responsible for "controlling" the situation with boys, because "boys just couldn't help themselves", y'know?

Honest to God, this was "sex education" in the early 60's.
 
It's in our nature. Are there any creatures that do not mate? I believe I heard ot a species that self replicates, no mating necessary. I was shocked to see two flies doing it on my patio ledge years ago!
 
Paco Dennis said:
I put this whole post into perplexity.ai...

Well,

Nature's drive for reproduction is deeply ingrained in animal behavior, but the role of pleasure varies across species. For many animals, neurological rewards like dopamine and oxytocin provide motivation and reinforcement for mating behaviors, especially in mammals and birds[1][4][7]. In species like primates, sexual pleasure is well-documented and can even serve social functions, such as bonding or dominance[9][10].

For fish and other species with external fertilization, the experience of pleasure is less clear. While fish respond to sensory cues like pheromones and visual stimuli to trigger spawning, there is no definitive evidence that they experience pleasure akin to mammals. Hormonal and neural mechanisms likely drive their behavior without requiring a subjective sense of enjoyment[2][5].

In many cases, reproduction is instinctual rather than consciously understood. Animals are "programmed" by evolution to prioritize reproduction through innate behaviors, often without awareness of its purpose. For example, salmon endure extreme physical hardship to spawn, driven by hormonal changes rather than any concept of future offspring[2][5]. Similarly, turtles lay eggs and leave without parental involvement because their reproductive success depends on sheer numbers rather than nurturing care.

Ultimately, while some animals may experience pleasure as a "bribe" for reproduction, others are simply compelled by biological imperatives.

Citations:
[1] Copulation (zoology) - Wikipedia Copulation (zoology) - Wikipedia
[2] Neural and hormonal mechanisms of reproductive-related arousal in ... Neural and hormonal mechanisms of reproductive-related arousal in fishes - PMC
[3] Women and Economics. - UPenn Digital Library Women and Economics.
[4] Exploring sexual activity in animals - Rosewell Exploring sexual activity in animals
[5] Do fish enjoy reproducing? | Science Questions - The Naked Scientists Do fish enjoy reproducing?
[6] Aelian, Characteristics of Animals - ToposText ToposText
[7] Animal sexual behaviour - Wikipedia Animal sexual behaviour - Wikipedia
[8] Fish reproduction - Wikipedia Fish reproduction - Wikipedia
[9] Primate Sex and Its Role in Pleasure, Dominance and Communication Primate Sex and Its Role in Pleasure, Dominance and Communication - PMC
[10] Do animals have sex for pleasure? - BBC Do animals have sex for pleasure?
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This is the first post in this thread that has mentioned evolution.
The earliest organisms on earth included single celled creatures such as amoeba and other protozoans. Their method of reproduction was, and still is, by simple cell division. The one cell produces two identical one celled individuals. Evolution requires differences before survival of the best adapted can occur so there is evidence that single celled organisms sometimes come together and swap DNA. It is not exactly sexual reproduction but it does introduce a degree of variation that strengthens the chance of a very slow form of evolution.

Sexual reproduction, as defined by the production of male and female gametes does offer some protection of a species when the environment is undergoing change. When coral spawns in the ocean millions of male and female gametes from colonies of coral are released simultaneously and fertilisation is entirely random. Natural selection determines which polyps survive to build new reefs. Pleasure doesn't come into it, it's just a matter of luck most of the time. Again, evolution of coral tends to be very slow. Modern corals are not much different to corals preserved in ancient limestone formations.

In land animals behaving like corals is hardly a practical way to continue the species unless you happen to be a frog. Instinct plays a big part and in males the sex drive is extremely strong. Pleasure is an added bonus, especially for the female of the species. Mating rituals that include courtship behaviour tend to create bonds that last longer than the sex act itself. This is very evident in birds. Some avian couples mate for life, others are more promiscuous with the females copulating with multiple males and the chicks have greater genetic variation and therefore have different chances of survival.

We humans have an extended time as children and teens and need extended parenting before becoming fully mature. During that time we learn from our parents, our tribe and our culture. In the face of disease, famine and war there is an imperative to produce as many children as possible because early death was, until recently, inevitable for many. The male sex drive tended to take care of that need and women tended to be drawn, or co-opted, to men who were able bodied, muscular and healthy. Of the children born in such hard circumstances, the term survival of the fittest is most appropriate.

Today, because of our extended lifespan we do not need to produce dozens of offspring to be a successful species. Survival of the species, or of a culture, requires less children but more education. We live in complex societies that are in competition with each other for world dominance. We need adults who are strong, straight of limb and healthy but we can also value people with agile minds.

Courtship, once requiring extended time before confirming a union to bring children into the world is becoming a thing of the past. Apparently, I am informed by my daughter, who was informed by her youngest daughter, the protocol of modern dating is that sex in expected on the third date. Modern contraception makes this change possible but it is probably not the best way to forge the kind of relationship that is necessary to raising a family for the 20 - 25 years that is optimal. Sexual pleasure is still a motivation for casual and fleeting connections, but the fertility rate suggests that it is not enough for the lengthy period of nurture that homo sapiens seems to require for thrive and evolve.

At least, that is how I see it. Instinct is the driver, pleasure is a bonus.
 
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bobcat said:
Still leaves you wondering though. In early evolution as cell division began to happen, there wouldn't have been any pleasure centers or neurological reward, as there were no neurons to reward.

Even for fish, there was no need for whoopee organs. The eggs would remain moist and all you gotta do is put a little secret sauce on them. However, after fish learning that growing a pair of limbs and hanging out on the beaches might be a cool way to live, the whole process of the traditional egg thing just wouldn't fly anymore, as the eggs would dry out.
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Sexual desire as experienced in humans is a latecomer to evolution. Why did the first cells divide? Why did cells decide to share materials? I don't know the answer to that, but basic chemistry tells us that certain elements are attracted to other elements and combine to form compounds, and it's as natural as falling off a log. I suspect that a similar clumping may play a role in early reproduction. No thought or desire is required. It was a natural characteristic of matter.

The difference between reproduction in single cells and humans is mostly that humans make a big deal out of it. Institutions, both religious and governmental, even weigh in to regulate it. It's a natural life process than only humans can react to in that way.
 
JustDave said:
Sexual desire as experienced in humans is a latecomer to evolution. Why did the first cells divide? Why did cells decide to share materials? I don't know the answer to that, but basic chemistry tells us that certain elements are attracted to other elements and combine to form compounds, and it's as natural as falling off a log. I suspect that a similar clumping may play a role in early reproduction. No thought or desire is required. It was a natural characteristic of matter.

The difference between reproduction in single cells and humans is mostly that humans make a big deal out of it. Institutions, both religious and governmental, even weigh in to regulate it. It's a natural life process than only humans can react to in that way.
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It still seems a bit mysterious as to why the different sexes first evolved. Single cell division still happens today, so it must be a successful way to reproduce. However, there are advantages to sexual reproduction, but how would single cell organisms know that?
Maybe it all comes back to Darwin's findings. If something works in evolution (Mutation), it will continue, and if something else works better, it will tend to dominate. I guess both single cell division and sexual reproduction don't have to be exclusive. Both seem to have a place in today's world.
 
bobcat said:
It still seems a bit mysterious as to why the different sexes first evolved.
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I guess you had to be there to see it. I've wondered about how female and male were able to evolve independently, but in a way that would allow them to share DNA.

bobcat said:
Single cell division still happens today, so it must be a successful way to reproduce. However, there are advantages to sexual reproduction, but how would single cell organisms know that?
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Single cells don't need to know anything. Like humans and fish, they have no idea where they are going, and evolution doesn't work that way. Even evolution has no planned path to a viable species. It has no idea what is better and what is worse. What is better is a factor of outside forces, the environment mostly. Your next quote describes just that.
bobcat said:
Maybe it all comes back to Darwin's findings. If something works in evolution (Mutation), it will continue, and if something else works better, it will tend to dominate. I guess both single cell division and sexual reproduction don't have to be exclusive. Both seem to have a place in today's world.
Click to expand...
 
David777 said:
@Paco Dennis post is most relevant. The dopamine neural reward system evolved in animal nervous systems from some of the earliest, most primitive life forms including highly studied c. elegans, a worm, for the purpose of ingesting nutrients and then evolved for other positive for species survival purposes like mating in higher vertebrate and invertebrate species.

Where does the desire to mate come from?

The roles of dopamine and related compounds in reward-seeking behavior across animal phyla

Frontiers | The Roles of Dopamine and Related Compounds in Reward-Seeking Behavior Across Animal Phyla
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The ONLY effective med for us Parkinson's diseased folks is dopamine.
Guess what? .. It
























































































































































































































































































































































































































































increases libero






























































































in many, including me.
Just sayin...
David777 said:
@Paco Dennis post is most relevant. The dopamine neural reward system evolved in animal nervous systems from some of the earliest, most primitive life forms including highly studied c. elegans, a worm, for the purpose of ingesting nutrients and then evolved for other positive for species survival purposes like mating in higher vertebrate and invertebrate species.

Where does the desire to mate come from?

The roles of dopamine and related compounds in reward-seeking behavior across animal phyla

Frontiers | The Roles of Dopamine and Related Compounds in Reward-Seeking Behavior Across Animal Phyla
Click to expand...
Dopamine is the primary prescription for Parkinsons Disease (PD) patients such as me.
I can personally attest that it increases my libido.
So here I am taking dopamine every 4 hours getting horny.
78 years old and living alone.. funny I guess ...
 
David777 said:
@Paco Dennis post is most relevant. The dopamine neural reward system evolved in animal nervous systems from some of the earliest, most primitive life forms including highly studied c. elegans, a worm, for the purpose of ingesting nutrients and then evolved for other positive for species survival purposes like mating in higher vertebrate and invertebrate species.

Where does the desire to mate come from?

The roles of dopamine and related compounds in reward-seeking behavior across animal phyla

Frontiers | The Roles of Dopamine and Related Compounds in Reward-Seeking Behavior Across Animal Phyla
Click to expand...
A common side effect of dopamine in Parkinson's Disease patients such as myself is increased libido.

So here I am, 78 years old, living alone, taking dopamine (equivalent of ******) every 4 hours.
too funny I guess.
 
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