New Disney Channel gives warning:

[Packerjohn]

Is Disney editing their own works or merely offering disclaimers? And if they are editing some offensive scenes, won't future generations be the better for it? Do we really need to continue showing hurtful stereotypes? What is to be gained?

Disney rarely wrote original stories for their feature-length animated films. Existing folk tales, fairy tales and published stories were rewritten, got some added spin and plenty of cultural biases (there were no crows in the original story of Dumbo), then turned them into those now famous cartoons.

As for burning history books and works of art, there's a big difference between rewriting history and choosing which contributions to honor and celebrate with statues on public lands.

If I were an African-American I would find statues of Confederate generals even more offensive than I find them as an American of European ancestry. After all, these officers were battling to continue the horror of owning and enslaving human beings. There's just no way to pretty that up.

I know my history pretty good since I used to teach the subject in the high school. Prior to World War II (which started in 1939), the Nazi used to burn books they didn't like & throw Jewish people off the 2nd floor balconey. Aren't the same things happening: movies & history being rewritten because some people don't like something in them. What ever happened to "freedom of speech?"

 

[Packerjohn]

One of my favourite all time TV series was "All In The Family". For you young ones in the crowd it was about a bigot named Archie Bunker who didn't like Jewish people, *****es nor gays. This series was viewed in the 1970. I'm proud to say I have viewed all the shows over the 9 years. There was even a follow up "Archie Bunker's Place". I have 1st year but 2nd year was never released. I wonder why? Great series but I know that it was all politically incorrect & that type of show wouldn't even be piloted today in our very politically correct, strait-jacked, conservative society.

 

[Pepper]

What ever happened to "freedom of speech?"

Freedom of speech MEANS, in this context, that Disney, as the owner of these properties, has the right to make disclaimers, butcher the product, or do anything else they want to it.

 

[CarolfromTX]

I am willing to go as far as saying some things are outdated, and possibly offensively so, and need to be put away. I think Song of the South may be one of those things. Some scenes are cringeworthy. But you can take things too far, IMO. And it's a two way street. I wish Hollywood would stop bludgeoning me with making sure there is at least one gay person (one very blatantly, flamingly gay person) on every TV show, especially reality shows, and I will tell you flat out I am not ready for gay sex scenes. So I don't watch that stuff. But Snow White? Gimme a break.

 

[Sassycakes]

Great ! I guess now they'll ban all the Godfather movies ! I'm Italian and I loved those movies and was never offend that they depicted Italians as gangsters ,murderer's etc!

 

[Keesha]

Of course OLD films and movies are going to be politically incorrectly outdated but film makers didn’t know about politically incorrect at the time of making them . Politically incorrect didn’t exist back then.

Disney made movies that sold to the mass population that people liked. If people didn’t like them they wouldn’t have been so popular. They made movies for the majority and have done a good job with keeping up with the times.

There are princesses of all colours and nationalities. Women in men’s traditional roles, men in women’s traditional roles and I think throughout history they’ve done a pretty good job of making enjoyable PG rated family movies. Of course they aren’t going to please everyone but that’s pretty normal.

They can’t undo what they made.
Like Mia Angelo says “ when they know better, they do better.” Don’t we all?

 

[applecruncher]

Hell No!

I'm already in enough trouble from that damned urban vs. rural thread.

Besides that, I've never see "Song of the South".

Okay, sorry. It was just a thought. My mistake.

 

[StarSong]

To be honest Starsong I’ve never seen that particular movie. Do you mean Dumbo or Song of the South? I’ve seen Dumbo.

Dumbo.

 

[Keesha]

Dumbo.

Ok

Now we are going to criticize the Dumbo movie?

Aren’t we as the adults the ones to add discriminatory overtones? As a child I never viewed any scenes as offensive. I was merely a child watching what I thought was an entertaining movie only now to discover as a senior citizen that it’s highly offensive material.

Of course OLD films and movies are going to be politically incorrectly outdated but film makers didn’t know about politically incorrect at the time of making them . Politically incorrect didn’t exist back then.

Disney made movies that sold to the mass population that people liked. If people didn’t like them they wouldn’t have been so popular. They made movies for the majority and have done a good job with keeping up with the times.

There are princesses of all colours and nationalities. Women in men’s traditional roles, men in women’s traditional roles and I think throughout history they’ve done a pretty good job of making enjoyable PG rated family movies. Of course they aren’t going to please everyone but that’s pretty normal.

They can’t undo what they made.
Like Mia Angelo says “ when they know better, they do better.” Don’t we all?

Since I can’t live stream on my phone and I don’t have Netflix or anything I will try to go to my local library and rent the Dumbo movie and watch with critical eyes. I’d like to point out that I’d be then doing what I first posted saying that unless people are ‘looking’ to be offended ........’

I will now view this movie from an adult perspective looking to be offended.

 

[StarSong]

Ok


Since I can’t live stream on my phone and I don’t have Netflix or anything I will try to go to my local library and rent the Dumbo movie and watch with critical eyes. I’d like to point out that I’d be then doing what I first posted saying that unless people are ‘looking’ to be offended ........’

I will now view this movie from an adult perspective looking to be offended.

Try instead to look at it from the perspective of a 7 year old child born in 2012, and read the cultural and behavioral messages. The drunk sequence as well as the crows come immediately to my mind, but there may be others.

 

[Keesha]

Try instead to look at it from the perspective of a 7 year old child born in 2012, and read the cultural and behavioral messages. The drunk sequence as well as the crows come immediately to my mind, but there may be others.

Ok I will do. I’m not opposed to being proved wrong.

 

[RadishRose]

"Dumbo" made me sad because he was separated from his mother. Same with "Bambi."

I loved "Fantasia", but the segment "Night on Bald Mountain" (Mussorgsky ) scared me out of my wits! Same with the Banshee segment in "Darby O'Gill"-terrified me for years.

 

[OneEyedDiva]

Someone once pointed out to me that in all the Disney movies, the mother (of the main character(s) is always dead. Anyone else notice that? I haven't seen all the Disney movies so I can't dispute that. If it's true...what kind of message does that send?

 

[RadishRose]

Someone once pointed out to me that in all the Disney movies, the mother (of the main character(s) is always dead. Anyone else notice that? I haven't seen all the Disney movies so I can't dispute that. If it's true...what kind of message does that send?

I also wondered. I think some of the Disney movies came from the fairytale by the Brothers Grimm. I know Cinderella was written in the 1600's.

It would be interesting to research this further.......

 

[chic]

But the Me-Too movement says the Prince kissed Snow White
while she was sleeping and he didn't ask for her consent
Oh what a foul sex scene that was...*shaking head, rolling eyes*

If I would become a princess upon awakening, I'd let any fool kiss me while I slept. Consent unnecessary.

 

[Keesha]

Try instead to look at it from the perspective of a 7 year old child born in 2012, and read the cultural and behavioral messages. The drunk sequence as well as the crows come immediately to my mind, but there may be others.

Unfortunately our library didn’t have either movies so I did my own research on these two movies and wrote a long note to copy for here but then forgot that this site won’t allow me to do that any more so I’m rewriting it.

I found this link which explains all the politically incorrect scenes including the crows and the baby elephant drinking champagne. Apparently Tim Burton’s new version of Dumbo addresses all of these issues.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/arts-entertainment/2019/03/29/original-dumbo-was-decried-racist-heres-how-tim-burtons-version-addresses-that/?outputType=amp

The movie Song of the South was deemed shockingly racist and I’d have to agree with them. It reinforces nostalgia for a plantation in the Reconstruction Era with its idyllic beauty , simple life lessons and harmonious racial hierarchies, yet the word slavery never gets uttered.

Disney released the movie over the objections of the NAACP and the American Council of Race Relations . Suggestions to soften its script were rejected.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.the...fficult-legacy-of-disneys-most-shocking-movie

Reading up on this movie and knowing the organizations who warned Disney about these problems has certainly changed my viewpoint.
Yes they are outrageously politically incorrect in today’s times but apparently for those times also.If reputable organizations needed to give a warning, that should have been enough for them to change it yet they didn’t. This puts a different spin on things entirely.

Having said that I can’t put myself back to a seven year old girl viewing them for the first time and notice all of this unless an adult is there pointing out discriminatory overtones because as a child I don’t know any better.

We learn racism from others and while I can look back and now realize how discriminating they were, I’ll still defend the premise that these movies were made for children and weren’t intended to be hurtful towards anyone. Hindsight is always better than foresight. Times are changing and while it’s a good thing to try and fix our mistakes from our past, we can’t erase them and nor should we. These films are great teaching tools to show how far the morale of civilization has advanced.

 

[StarSong]

Thank you for researching this and reporting back. Truly fascinating information.

Since I have grandchildren in the Disney movie age group, I'm seeing many of the 1940s - 1970s classics again. The Washington Post analysis that you linked (a rarity for the WP in that it wasn't behind a paywall) made the arguments far better than I could.

The thing about racist subtexts is that they have an additive effect, which is what makes them so insidious. Case in point are the Dumbo scenes. Subliminal racist messages reinforce other, undisguised statements of fear and hatred, and the next thing you know we've created another generation of racists.

Walt Disney and his crew may or may not have been racist, I've never heard evidence either way, but some of his movies sure do fan the flames. Intentional? Who knows? But the result is the same regardless of intent.

This is the full quote you referenced above from the late, great Maya Angelou:
“Do the best you can until you know better. Then when you know better, do better.”

We now know better. It's time we do better.

 

[Pepper]

Someone once pointed out to me that in all the Disney movies, the mother (of the main character(s) is always dead. Anyone else notice that? I haven't seen all the Disney movies so I can't dispute that. If it's true...what kind of message does that send?

I think it sends the message that one's mother is the most important person in life--she loves you like no other, protects like no other. Without her, life is fraught with dangers and obstacles one would not face, or face alone BUT even with this greatest of all possible losses, one Can Overcome and even Win. So glad you pointed this out!

 

[Pepper]

Ps
I suppose a case can also be made that the above renders the mother superfluous.

Pps
If I were back in school, I can see making a dissertation out of this topic, maybe even a book!
Thanks, Jersey Girl

 

[Lara]

I am shocked all old movies depicting blacks as dumb are still on the air...One black actor appeared in many movies and television as sadly stupid...Then there movies about prisons where blacks were a majority of the prison populations.

What about old movie depicting whites as stupid...Marilyn Monroe, Lucy Ricardo, Betty Boop, tons of white strippers and burlesque, many southern female actresses in say Gone with the Wind, and guys like Jerry Lewis and Dean Martin.

What about not-so-old movies depicting whites as stupid like black Producer Keenan Ivory Wayans and his brother dressing up as 2 really stupid "White Chicks"...complete with white faces!!

Sylvestor Stallone in Rocky Jim Carrey & Jeff Daniels, in Dumb & Dumber, Vince Vaughn, Gerard Butler, Charlie Sheen, Sharon Stone, etc All of the white women in "The Help" were shallow and spoiled and all of the blacks were smart with integrity, and so many more.

As far as black prisoners being the majority, that sadly is the reality of today but our government is addressing that and many low level offenders are being released.

 

[Keesha]

I think it sends the message that one's mother is the most important person in life--she loves you like no other, protects like no other. Without her, life is fraught with dangers and obstacles one would not face, or face alone

She does?

 

[Sunny]

I saw Song of the South as a kid, and from what I remember, I loved it. Racial stereotypes, etc. never entered my consciousness, I just loved the songs, especially Zippety-Do-Dah. The movie should probably be banned, based on its offensive material. But it's too bad the good, sunny, musical values can't be rescued and shared with a modern audience.

 

[Pepper]

She does?

Ideally and symbolically, not individually.

 

[Keesha]

Ideally and symbolically, not individually.

Unfortunately yes.

 

[Trade]

I don't know which group I hate the most.

The PC crowd, or the anti-PC crowd.

They both give me a case of the ass.