Is it in the governments best interest to let older people die of the virus?

Aneeda72

Aneeda72

Well-known Member
I think it is.

The government then gets to keep our social security and save a lot of money through reduced Medicare costs. I think reopening everything; and then tellIing the younger generation not to expose us is deflection tactics. I think the government would be just as happy to lose the older, somewhat expensive, somewhat dependent generation.

What do you all think?
 

I think that the cost/value of end of life care is a discussion that we need to have as a nation.

We are all going to die and spending huge sums of money to purchase a few months or years of relatively poor quality of life seems like a bad investment to me.

I would prefer that we move towards palliative/hospice care and let nature take its course.

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Depends on what you mean by "the government," Aneeda. Some states do seem to have that attitude; those are the states where the bottom line of business is more important than mere human lives.

And for those who are opposed to social security, sure, it makes sense to just kill off everybody over age 65.
 

This is an election year in the US. EVERYTHING is seen in that lens. The virus is crippling the world's economy with losses that haven't really come home to roost, as yet. How do you equate the death of a 92 year old with the pain of poverty? I don't know. Is giving an 88 year old a month more of life worth financial devastation? The fact is saving one means loosing the other.
 
Our generation hasn't experienced a deadly, disabling communicable illness like this in our lifetime. We've had it pretty good. Vaccines and immunizations have taken care of all the former ones. Now we have this. We get mixed messages from the government. Who knows what's going on. Mostly it looks to me like no one knows exactly what's going on, or what to do, except to try and keep the public from flying into full panic mode
 
Aneeda72 said:
I think it is.

The government then gets to keep our social security and save a lot of money through reduced Medicare costs. I think reopening everything; and then tellIing the younger generation not to expose us is deflection tactics. I think the government would be just as happy to lose the older, somewhat expensive, somewhat dependent generation.

What do you all think?
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Considering hospital/ICU costs for Covid patients, the amount paid by Medicare probably outweighs any SS savings.
 
Aside from ethical considerations, part of what is wrong with this whole question is that Covid is not a disease that only attacks the elderly. It also is devastating to people with weakened immune systems, and others in less than robust health. And the news articles keep saying how "surprising" it is when a young person dies of it, or when children get that other syndrome that sometimes follows a Covid infection. So we aren't only talking about the old here.

If all people in this country over a certain age are to be thrown on the scrap heap, it should be made clear that we are also throwing the sick, the weakened, and some of the children. All this in the name of rescuing the economy.
 
Sunny said:
Aside from ethical considerations, part of what is wrong with this whole question is that Covid is not a disease that only attacks the elderly. It also is devastating to people with weakened immune systems, and others in less than robust health. And the news articles keep saying how "surprising" it is when a young person dies of it, or when children get that other syndrome that sometimes follows a Covid infection. So we aren't only talking about the old here.

If all people in this country over a certain age are to be thrown on the scrap heap, it should be made clear that we are also throwing the sick, the weakened, and some of the children. All this in the name of rescuing the economy.
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So you don't believe we need to consider the economy??? People are losing their livelihoods and everything they have worked for. These are scary times and NOT just because of illness.
 
StarSong said:
Considering hospital/ICU costs for Covid patients, the amount paid by Medicare probably outweighs any SS savings.
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I included the cost savings that Medicare would get if we simply died when I said “save a lot of money through reduced Medicare costs.” Even if someone older lingered a few weeks with ICU treatment and then died, in the long run vs another 15-30 years, the death of the elderly person would save money In Medicare payments and SSI.

Also it would depend on what level of SS payments they were receiving Plus other government benefits like food stamps, supported housing, etc. The cost of social workers etc. it adds up to a great deal of money. Which is why I think we are expendable as far as the government is concerned. It’s always about the money.
 
Aneeda72 said:
I think it is.

The government then gets to keep our social security and save a lot of money through reduced Medicare costs. I think reopening everything; and then tellIing the younger generation not to expose us is deflection tactics. I think the government would be just as happy to lose the older, somewhat expensive, somewhat dependent generation.

What do you all think?
Click to expand...
You can't put a price-tag on the value of human lives.
 
Aneeda72 said:
I think it is.

The government then gets to keep our social security and save a lot of money through reduced Medicare costs. I think reopening everything; and then tellIing the younger generation not to expose us is deflection tactics. I think the government would be just as happy to lose the older, somewhat expensive, somewhat dependent generation.

What do you all think?
Click to expand...

I think inevitably this is what will have to happen, the economy or what is left of it, will have to be reopened whether people die or not. Otherwise no one will be left employed to pay for senior's entitlements. And then what?

I don't think we ever should have shut down to begin with, but should have taken steps to protect the vulnerable to the best of our ability.

Now everyone is just going to be in a mess not of their making. Everyone I talk to is scared, stressed beyond bearing, and can't wait to get back to normal. But normal is beyond us once you shut down or lock down because as soon as you try to come back from it people will get hit with the virus all over again. And this is what is happening.
 
C'est Moi said:
So you don't believe we need to consider the economy??? People are losing their livelihoods and everything they have worked for. These are scary times and NOT just because of illness.
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The economy could completely collapse, for sure, as people begin to loose their houses. Bank who carry a great many mortgages would fail. People who rent would be evicted. We would have a huge homeless population.

This is why the country tried to reopen-to prevent a complete disaster. This is why older people are at even greater risk. The reality maybe that our generation has to die to save the country. Bummer. C’est Moi is so right -these are really scary times.
 
JaniceM said:
You can't put a price-tag on the value of human lives.
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We put a price tag on human lives all the time. The uninsured do not receive the same expensive medical treatments as the insured. Even the insured, with not very good plans, are denied good care. I could go on, but won’t. It’s always about the money.
 
Knight said:
Maybe a better approach would be to allow euthanasia & assisted suicide in all 50 states./QUOTE]

I would support that. If a person has been diagnosed with a terminal illness, with little or no hope of recovery, they should have the option of ending their misery on their own terms....rather than facing weeks/months of treatment that does little other than pad the pockets of the doctors and hospitals.
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JaniceM said:
Or consider it this way:

Eliminate the elderly.. the infirm.. the disabled... etc... and no one left but "survival of the fittest"- a concept in the animal kingdom, not for humans.
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But we are part of the animal kingdom whether we like it or not. I did not say, btw, eliminate the elderly. 😂 I am elderly. I simply said the reopening was done despite the risk to the elderly and the federal government has made our survival our problem.
 
I'm probably the only old 'Trekky' here, but the reason that I watch the various series is because they address issues like this in the guise of science fiction. It was purely by coincidence that I just watched watched Star Trek Voyager Season 7, Episode 5 entitled "Critical Care." It addresses the issue of government's view to protect all of society by healing the most productive and powerful versus making equal medical care available to all. I didn't necessarily agree with the conclusion, however.

Personally, only in the most ideal of situations could we afford to medically treat everyone on an equal basis. In today's situation, some prioritization is necessary. Voluntary assisted suicide and euthanasia should be on the table, in my opinion.
 
Em in Ohio said:
I'm probably the only old 'Trekky' here, but the reason that I watch the various series is because they address issues like this in the guise of science fiction. It was purely by coincidence that I just watched watched Star Trek Voyager Season 7, Episode 5 entitled "Critical Care." It addresses the issue of government's view to protect all of society by healing the most productive and powerful versus making equal medical care available to all. I didn't necessarily agree with the conclusion, however.

Personally, only in the most ideal of situations could we afford to medically treat everyone on an equal basis. In today's situation, some prioritization is necessary. Voluntary assisted suicide and euthanasia should be on the table, in my opinion.
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My whole family are trekkies, 😂, I wish I could watch the new series but I don’t want to pay for an extra channel. Pickard should come out on dvd. I have not seen discover yet but I heard it’s really good as well.

The problem with suicide is, it is against many religions, so you have to refuse treatment.
 
Em in Ohio said:
Voluntary assisted suicide and euthanasia should be on the table, in my opinion.
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It is in one form or another but not in all 50 states. My post #6.

Reading what the NHS does & the cost difference between the US health care system & the NHS maybe that should be in the mix of trying a new approach
 
C'est Moi said:
So you don't believe we need to consider the economy??? People are losing their livelihoods and everything they have worked for. These are scary times and NOT just because of illness.
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C'est Moi, where did I ever say that I don't believe that we need to consider the economy? Boy, you are a master at reading what you want to in things!

OK, turning your own logic back on you, so you don't believe that we need to consider the lives of our loved ones, anyone over 60, anyone who is sick, disabled, or those kids who are unlucky enough to get it? Collateral damage, eh?

Go ahead and volunteer to get thrown on the scrap heap if you like. I am not ready to make such a sacrifice. I enjoy living too much. Between me and some billionaire's bank account, I'll take me any time. 😋

(But this is NOT the same thing as saying I don't care about the economy, for pity's sake!)
 

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