There are two basics facts which need to be accepted.

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"they plucked their eyebrows and shaved their legs and he was a she and said, hey, babe take a walk on the wild side., and the colored girls said do ta do do ta doodoo dootoadootoa..

or


I not dumb but I can't understand why she walks like a woman and talks like a man, said my Lola,L O L A Lola...


sorry my head is full of old odd rock songs...
 
Until recently I hadn't considered the concept of changing one's ethnicity. But I read about several people that strongly identified to ethnicities to which they did not belong.

As to changing one's gender, I have a sense of compassion for those who feel they were born to the wrong gender. Genotypically (at the level of our genes), gender change can't occur. However, phenotypically (how we look) can change.
 
Jeni said:
The whole process.... if they are trying to change is not as easy or simple as they try to suggest.

I recently had the opportunity to read/ hear the story of a young woman.
She was in her words confused and mentally distressed .... she began the process and had her breasts removed..... started taking the hormone regimen and that is when the trouble began ........
Many end up with severe heart/ kidney and liver issues from taking the opposite hormones...... this is true of almost all people starting to take the opposite sex hormones.
Having to stop the drugs she found counseling and now is hoping to recover her health enough to get implants to correct this as she put NIGHTMARE.
She begged anyone who listens to make sure if they know someone to get serious mental health help before making the errors she did...
Never had it been so clear as to why so many attempt or even succeed committing suicide.
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I was thinking along this line for some. I don't think it speaks for all. I started watching a channel on YouTube started by a guy who was at Evergreen State College in Olympia WA when they had those student "protests." (hive mentality break with reality IMO) but anyway, for some reason he has also interviewed people who have been trans and de-transitioned. I really really feel bad for the ones who had taken hormones. It appears to have permanently changed their bodies and voices.

One woman who gratefully didn't take hormones but started to identify as male had been sexually abused as a child. Some of these people need extensive counseling but it appears some just want to do the virtue signaling support and not look at possible underlying causes.

I don't think this is true for all of coarse but for some.
 
Lavinia said:
1) You cannot change the gender you are born with.

2) You cannot change your ethnicity.

If everyone just accepted those two biological facts and got on with their lives in the body that nature gave them, life would be much less complicated and confusing for all of us.
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Others have been very courteous in their responses re: your claim in #1. I will not be so courteous. Every post from you is negative and offensive and I will gladly challenge you re: changing gender. There are many who feel they are born in the wrong body and see the need to change gender to feel better about themselves. Good for them.

Between your disparaging comments about America and now this, I will continue to call you out on your posts. They are only meant to create controversy.
 
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What’s the downside if these “two basic facts that need to be accepted” are not accepted? Also, who needs to accept them and why? There are people who don’t accept that the earth is a sphere. Look up The Flat Earth Society. Good luck convincing others that they need to accept anything at all. I’d be interested to know how that works out. I may change my species identity from porcine to bovine just because I can. And if I do, you don’t have to accept it but that doesn’t make it any less real to me. I’d love to change the world but I don’t know what to do. I just know how to change me. Moo! 🐷 ~ 🐮
 
win231 said:
But the amount of muscle & strength they lose can vary with the doses of female hormones they take. They can appear female & they would still have an unfair advantage.
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I agree and they don't really "appear" female either. This problem of allowing biological males who identify as female freedom to compete in female sports could destroy said sports. If a man goes through puberty as a biological male, his bones will be longer and denser and his upper body strength could still overwhelm a female even if he is on hormone therapy. He will also be taller, very likely, especially if he is an athlete.

It sounds to me as though some men who fail in sports when competing against other men, have found a way to claim fame and wealth by growing their hair long, saying they are trans and competing with biological female in women's sports where they will always have an advantage. This does not make them female and I wish those with the authority to prevent this abuse would do so.
 
Don M. said:
Transgender Men competing in Women's sports is becoming a concern...
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If this were the only problem we'd be pretty close to ok. It does not effect many people, most don't compete in sports at a level for it to matter.

Seems to me to just be an easy target for attack and makes good press.

The simplest thing would just be to define, for highly competitive sports only, gender by XX or XY, and then focus on the many more important issues.
 
chic said:
It sounds to me as though some men who fail in sports when competing against other men, have found a way to claim fame and wealth by growing their hair long, saying they are trans and competing with biological female in women's sports where they will always have an advantage. This does not make them female and I wish those with the authority to prevent this abuse would do so.
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If you're saying a man would cut off his best friend to win at sports you must be wrong. It is deeper than that, for goodness sake.
 
As for the claim about changing ethnicity surely someone cannot change where there heritage is from, but certainly they can and have all the right to do as much research on a heritage if they please if that interests them to become a part of that heritage if they want. In my opinion that is really not hurting anyone and people should be more accepting to those things.

As for the second claim, I feel there are many people who feel they were born into this world as the wrong gender and this circumstance has made life for these people quite difficult to live an enjoyable life. This being said, I feel everyone has the right to live out their lives the way that they feel will make them happy. Whether that be changing ones gender then that is what it will be. I myself, don't fully understand that because my mindset has never felt dissatisfied about the gender I am. That is certainly not the case for many people.
 
Nathan said:
Not a problem, always interested in current genetics research. :)
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That, in and of itself, is an interesting sentence. LOL

I saw a post wherein you'd found some information and I meant to go back and read it, but the day took a downturn and now I've lost it and am not savvy enough with the SF controls. When you have a moment, @Nathan, would you mind sending it to my profile, pretty please? And thank you. :)

Genetics, eugenics... cannabalism, et al, interests me as well.
 
chic said:
The gender issue is becoming an albatross. If our chromosomes don't determine our sex I don't know what does. 🤔 I'm XX. This makes me a woman and no one, no matter how much they might wish to be XX can be a woman if they were born XY. They are biological males.
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While I agree with you and you're absolutely right, you're talking about a person's sex, not gender.
 
john19485 said:
I don't mind what people change in their life, Just quit trying to push into my life , where you have no bussiness.
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I'm asking this with respect and out of sheer curiosity, but who/where/how is this happening to you, people trying to push their personal changes into your life?
 
Nathan said:
Here's what I'm finding, so far:
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Found it. And found it enlightenting. Thank you. :)

Isn't there something somewhere about a rise in homosexual behavior in primates when the populations get too high? Or did I dream that? LOL I'll look into it when I'm feeling better. -- Well, what's a quick Google search going to cost me in energy?

This is thought-provoking:
https://www.news-medical.net/news/2006/10/23/1500-animal-species-practice-homosexuality.aspx
but doesn't speak to homosexuality for the purpose of population control.

And of course, there's always Bonobos to consider, but it seems they use sex as a means of keeping the group unified and congenieal.
 
I believe that future research will prove that the chemical, BPA, can affect the development and genetic makeup of a fetus and perhaps even young children as they are developing. It was originally developed as a hormone replacement/artificial estrogen. Whoever thought putting it into the food chain was a good idea?
 
Alligatorob said:
If this were the only problem we'd be pretty close to ok. It does not effect many people, most don't compete in sports at a level for it to matter.

Seems to me to just be an easy target for attack and makes good press.

The simplest thing would just be to define, for highly competitive sports only, gender by XX or XY, and then focus on the many more important issues.
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Actually, @Alligatorob, that could work; I mean that seems like a sensible, viable solution to what, I agree, is at present a very small aspect of the whole, but still... good idea.
 
Medusa said:
While I respect your opinion, the fact is that a person can change their gender; many, many have and more continue to do so. (I'm not using the more appropriate "sex" here because a person cannot change their chromosomes.) Not simply for those who were, as it is said, "born in the wrong body," but those born, for example, hermaphrodites or intersex. What are they supposed to do? Ignore the fact they can be helped (if they choose to) in favor of "nature?" I mean, that is or those are the sex(s) they were born with.

A person cannot change their chromosones, but they can certainly change their gender. And why shouldn't they? Every person has the right to feel comfortable and happy in their own skin.
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I strongly disagree. A person can not change their gender.
Yes, you can chop body parts off, but the a persons gender will ALWAYS be the same as that which they were born with.
Yes, a person may be convinced they were born with the wrong body, but that does not change the chromosomes XX or XY and chromosomes are the ONLY determining factor in identifying gender.

Look at it this way. A man may be convinced he is Napoleon, but does that mean he IS Napoleon ?
 
senior chef said:
I strongly disagree. A person can not change their gender.
Yes, you can chop body parts off, but the a persons gender will ALWAYS be the same as that which they were born with.
Yes, a person may be convinced they were born with the wrong body, but that does not change the chromosomes XX or XY and chromosomes are the ONLY determining factor in identifying gender.

Look at it this way. A man may be convinced he is Napoleon, but does that mean he IS Napoleon ?
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I respect your opinion, but again, you are referring to sex here, not gender.
 

Questions About Sex in Sport and Sports Policies​

These data and comparisons explain why competitive sport has traditionally separated biological males (people with male bodies) from biological females (people with female bodies), and also why legal measures like Title IX in the United States require institutions to set aside and protect separate and equal funding, facilities, and opportunities for women and girls.

Still, society is being pushed in this period to reconsider both importance of separate sport compared to other values, and the way the girls’ and women’s category is protected. As a result, the conversation includes four general categories of policy options:

1. Keeping girls’ and/or women’s sport only for females.

2. Keeping the two categories but allowing males to compete in girls’ and women’s events (a) where they identify as girls and women, and/or (b) because they want the opportunity for some other reason, e.g., they are swimmers and their high school has a girls’ but not a boys’ swim team.

3. Keeping the two categories but allowing males to compete in girls’ and women’s events only if they identify as such and they transition their testosterone levels to within the female – ovarian – range.

4. Erasing the categories – no divisions by “male” and “female” however these are defined – and featuring only “open” sports and events where everyone competes together, or else in sports and events based on different classifications like height or weight.

Our goal in developing and presenting the data and comparisons in TABLES 1- 4 is to provide some of the facts necessary to evaluate these options and to help answer the overarching question: what would happen if we stopped classifying athletes on the basis of sex or else allowed exceptions to that rule? More specifically, we hope that the data and comparisons are useful as people think about the following questions:

How important is sport, its particular events, and goals?

Should societies and sports governing authorities continue to be committed to equal sports events and opportunities for boys and girls, men and women?

Are there good reasons to ensure that biological females (people with female bodies) are included and visible in competitive sport, and if so, does it matter how they are visible? For example, is it enough that they are given an opportunity to participate at some point in development sport, or is it important that they are competitive for the win so that we see them in championships and on the podium?

In general, the goals of the identity movement are to ensure that people who are trans and intersex are fully and equally included in society’s important institutions on the basis of their identity, not their (reproductive) biology. In cases of conflict between the goals of the identity movement and sports’ traditional goals for girls’ and women’s sport, what should our priority be: equal opportunity in sport for girls and women or the ability of each individual to participate in sports on their own terms?

Should our priorities depend on the sporting context, for example, is or should the priority be different in elementary school, junior high school, high school, college, and professional sport?

If we want to have it all – to respect everyone’s gender identity and still to support girls’ and women’s sport by making a place for athletes with female bodies in competition – what’s the best way forward? What’s the best compromise position? Ultimately, this is the most important question for sports policymakers in this period.

A. Is it acceptable to include everyone but still to classify on the basis of sex, like we do already on the basis of weight in wrestling and boxing? For example, could the Olympic Committee have required Bruce Jenner - before he became Caitlyn and transitioned physically - to compete as a man in the men’s decathlon?

B. Would it have been more or less acceptable to have required Jenner to compete in the men’s decathlon, but not to prescribe how she expresses her identity as a woman?

C. If Jenner before her physical transition had wanted to compete in the women’s heptathlon, would it have been acceptable for the Olympic Committee to have required her first to transition physically, at least her testosterone levels, so that – although she would still be competing with a lot of developed male traits useful for athletics – all competitors would compete on equal footing in terms of steroid levels?

D. If none of these options strikes the right balance between the two important competing interests, is there another option that does?

https://law.duke.edu/sports/sex-sport/comparative-athletic-performance/
 

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