Chicago : Shooter on store roof kills six and injures 18

Close to 50% of all the guns in the world are in the U.S. There's something very wrong with that.

Getting more control over who is allowed to own a gun, and what kind of gun, might be sort of like locking the barn door after the horse is out. In other words, too late. But better than nothing.

It occurs to me that it's interesting that the same people who are horrified by the profits the pharmaceutical companies are (supposedly) making from a life-saving vaccine, those same people think it's perfectly OK for gun dealers and gun manufacturers to make their profit from aiding in the murder of innoceent people.
 

oldman said:
You don’t understand the concept. The question is, “Have you ever threatened to harm anyone or kill anyone?” You answer “No.” But, it doesn’t stop there. It’s a background check, so the questionnaire is handed off to an agent who goes out and speaks with the neighbors, former classmates, etc. If you were truthful, you get the gun. If you lied. You get the door. If there wasn’t someone checking the applicant’s answers, everyone would lie if they knew they had a black mark in their past.

I have had to complete many background checks. I just finished doing three background checks for NCAA basketball as an official. State Police, FBI and Children’s Protective Agency. I must pass all three.
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Sorry, but it's still laughable.
No one is going to pay an "Agent's" salary to speak with neighbors & former classmates. And gossipy neighbors & classmates also won't tell the truth for various reasons. If they don't like the person, they'll say negative things about him. If they like the person, they'll say positive things about him. A person's right to own a firearm should not rely on gossipy neighbors; it's asinine.
Years ago, a co-worker applied for a police officer job. A plain-clothes police officer walked into the store we both worked at, identified himself to me, showed me his badge & asked me questions about my co-worker - what type of person he was, etc. My co-worker was an assistant manager at the store. There were some things I didn't like about him. One was his temper. I wasn't about to get myself fired or cause a ruckus with someone I had to work with, so I said, "He's a nice guy, etc." I also don't consider myself qualified to evaluate someone's suitability for a career in law enforcement.
 
Sunny said:
Close to 50% of all the guns in the world are in the U.S. There's something very wrong with that.

Getting more control over who is allowed to own a gun, and what kind of gun, might be sort of like locking the barn door after the horse is out. In other words, too late. But better than nothing.

It occurs to me that it's interesting that the same people who are horrified by the profits the pharmaceutical companies are (supposedly) making from a life-saving vaccine, those same people think it's perfectly OK for gun dealers and gun manufacturers to make their profit from aiding in the murder of innoceent people.
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As you noted, it's "locking the barn door after the horse is out." There are millions of guns in the hands of people who shouldn't have them.
And, it's easy for anyone to get anything they want - whether it's legal or not. Does anyone have problems getting cocaine or any illegal drug it they want it?
That's why it's not "better than nothing." It IS nothing.
 

Chet said:
If crazy people want to harm others they will find a way. It doesn't have to be with a gun. The shooter had a car. He could have driven straight into the parade.
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Yes. He could have pushed a refrigerator off the top of the building, too. The thing is cars and refrigerators are needed for many good reason. There really aren't any good reasons for the average person to need something which has only one purpose -- to kill.
 
This is how the killer dressed hoping he could mingle with the crowd and not be noticed..

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win231 said:
The reason you do not understand why anyone not in the military needs a semiautomatic rifle is because you lack knowledge.
Here are a couple of reasons: Note 5 home invasion robbers. Not everyone is OK with being at the mercy of criminals. No other defensive weapon would do in such a situation with multiple assailants.
Please feel free to comment:

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Okay, I have a better understanding of it now.:rolleyes:
 
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Transpires the killer was already known to the police ...

Police have revealed new details about the attack, including the fact that the suspect was previously known to police after he made threats against his own family. Investigators said at a Tuesday press conference that they had first encountered Crimo when he tried to take his own life in April 2019, prompting a call to authorities who treated the case as a mental health emergency.

Then, in September of that year, a relative of Crimo called police and reported that in his family home he had threatened “to kill everyone”, said Chris Covelli, the leader of a police taskforce investigating major crimes in Lake county, which includes Highland Park. That report prompted police to remove 16 knives, a dagger and a sword from his home.

Even though Highland Park’s municipal government banned assault-style guns within city limits in 2013, Covelli said Crimo managed to legally obtain two rifles – including one styled after an AR-15 – and at least three other guns in the general Chicago area, many parts of which do not enforce such restrictions.

He had apparently planned the attack on the Fourth of July parade for weeks and allegedly posted dozens of videos with ominous songs showing images of himself or cartoon figures holding rifles with threatening messages, including one reading: “Everything has led up to this. Nothing can stop me, even myself.”

About 10.15am Monday, when Highland Park’s Fourth of July parade was about three-quarters through, he aimed the AR-15-like rifle at strangers, fired more than 70 times, and struck roughly 45 people, Covelli said.

details are continuing to emerge about the victims of the attack, with six of the seven killed now identified – all between the ages of 35 and 88.

Five of those six were from Highland Park: Irina McCarthy, 35; Kevin McCarthy, 37; Jacquelyn Sundheim, 63; Katherine Goldstein, 64; and Stephen Straus, 88. Nicholas Toledo Zaragoza, 78, was from Mexico’s state of Morelos.

A local news outlet reported that a toddler found wandering alone after the shooting was the son of Irina and Kevin McCarthy, who were both killed.
A seventh person wounded at the parade died on Tuesday after being taken outside a hospital in Lake County, officials said, and that person’s identity wasn’t immediately released.

The shooting comes barely a week after Joe Biden signed into law a bipartisan gun bill intended to prevent dangerous people from accessing firearms.

Biden’s vice-president, Kamala Harris, was headed to Highland Park on Tuesday evening to make remarks about the previous day’s killing.

The fact that Crimo legally purchased so many weapons despite seemingly glaring warning signs that he could be a danger to others has reignited the nationwide debate about whether the US is doing everything it can to rein in access to high-capacity guns.

 
If there are any valid arguments against "red flag" laws, this idiots actions should negate those points. This thug apparently had been planning this attack for some time, and had posted such comments all over social media sites. If we have the technology to track people on the Internet, for advertising purposes, that same technology should be able to alert the authorities about these kinds of people.
 
Anyone else see a pattern of radicalization--for lack of a better word, among these kids? I don't know if it's social media, sensationalist slanted news, religion, a culture that glorifies violence, isolation, or what. Maybe all of it? Seems a lot like what happens with other terrorists attackers. If guns and ammo are easy to get that will be what is used, if not I think they're going to find another way.
 
Been There said:
In several cases these mass shooters were loners with no friends and dropouts. I had no family and few friends during high school and didn't really come out of my shell until I spent time at the Naval Academy in Annapolis. I went onto Officers Training School and then onto flight school. You learn to make friends on the way at each step. You don't get very far without have social contacts and friends when you are trying to reach your goals.

These mass murderers have no interest in much of anything. No goals, no friends and no one to encourage them to do better. Their mind becomes confused and they don't know what their purpose in life is. They have no ambition to do positive things. In the end, they hate people that have passed them by or overlooked them. They decided it's easier to hate than it is to love and instead of looking for the positive things in life, they decide they only deserve the worse that life has to offer. They haven't accomplished anything while here on earth and figure they have nothing to lose. These are things I learned in Psychology and Sociology classes. I don't think it's a one size fits all thing, but each mass murderer or serial killer has some of these traits. Someone really screwed with their minds during their growing years. I am not saying that we should pity these poor bastards, but in one way or another, they are all mentally defective.

Society needs to sort these people out before someone sells them a gun and I am all for each individual applying to buy a weapon should be mentally tested. This includes if someone wants to buy a weapon at a gun show. There are people smarter than me that can figure out a way to sort out the bad eggs, but we can't keep doing nothing. After each mass murder, we find out the shooter was in someway screwed up in the head. These are the people that need to be sorted out before they purchase a weapon.
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Well said. I also believe that Social Media has exacerbated these mass shootings. The crazies follow other crazies on Social Media. This guy had lots of posts/videos indicating he was nuts and dangerous.

As @Don M. said, why can algorithms track our purchasing patterns on Social Media but not the tendency to kill people? No money in it, I suspect.
 
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There's a theory floating around that since the father was or was about to run for mayor he probably minimized the incidents by not pursing them any further ie refer his son for counseling or let the state do it.

Also just 'a' coincidence but the scum bag coward Buffalo killer had parents that worked for the state and I can't help but think they used their connections to find out how and/or coach their son through the system/investigation of his prior school threats.

In both cases politics and political connections may have played a roll.

If an adult 18-20 wants to buy a gun they should sign a waiver giving access to school and criminal records that normally would be considered sealed with that information being used for that purpose only. Once 21 it's their adult record only like all others.
 
Don M. said:
If there are any valid arguments against "red flag" laws, this idiots actions should negate those points. This thug apparently had been planning this attack for some time, and had posted such comments all over social media sites. If we have the technology to track people on the Internet, for advertising purposes, that same technology should be able to alert the authorities about these kinds of people.
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Well, no. Red flag laws are ripe for abuse. Ex wives, jilted lover, angry neighbor, etc. What would stop me from contacting the authorities in your state and initiating a red flag action against you, based solely on your posts on here. They come to your house, take any/all weapons, and you have to go to court to get them back. No thanks.

As for taking away our guns, let me remind folks of a couple of numbers. 40% of American households have at least on gun owner living in it. Put another way, about 80 million Americans are gun owners, and the average gun owner has 5 weapons. That about 400 million weapons. If you try to take those weapon away, some will comply, maybe most, by some will not. What if only 10% put up a fight? That's 8 million people. Are you willing to kill 8 million Americans in order to "make them safe"?

How many of you remember My Lai? We had to destroy the village in order to save it....

Rant over. Have a great day.
 
From what I understand, in all but California, none of the background checks, etc, apply to private sales. The problem is how do you know what another is going to do with a gun. Is he going to rob a bank, blow his brains out, kill his wife's lover, or safely keep a weapon? I can't figure out how you can fire a gun at someone, if you don't have one

BTW, we have a lot of Brits and Aussies in the Forum. Almost all countries have had a mass shooting, but what would you say is the common opinion of the US and its gun violence?
 
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The shooter did have a history of violence and instability, so it was necessary for the father to co-sign in order for the shooter to be able to purchase the guns.

Uh, boy. :rolleyes:
 
SeniorBen said:
The shooter did have a history of violence and instability, so it was necessary for the father to co-sign in order for the shooter to be able to purchase the guns.

Uh, boy. :rolleyes:
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If the father did co-sign, does this mean there could be lawsuits against him?
 
Jules said:
If the father did co-sign, does this mean there could be lawsuits against him?
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Given this shooters history, if his father aided in the purchase of firearms, that father should be tried as an "accessory" to these killings.

If these killings weren't bad enough, this killer will likely be sent to prison for the rest of his life.....and suck up millions of taxpayer dollars that would be far better spent on good people. All he deserves is a quick execution.
 
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