Russia doesn't sound like a military superpower????

[squatting dog]

The US has been supplying troops since about the beginning of this fiasco. Supposed to be a secret, but secrets are hard to keep these days. Mostly our troops have been supplying training, but they've also been fighting elbow-to-elbow with Ukranian soldiers.

The moment a Russian nuke squeaks, the US, UK, Europe and Japan will be all over it, with and/or without nukes, and the US will very likely be all over Moscow. It will be heartbreaking, in a way.

The other side of that coin, I'd suspect that if the US, UK, Europe and Japan officially joined the Ukraine, then China, N. Korea, India, Turkey, Pakistan, Myanmar, Venezuela, Cuba, and Nicaragua, would almost have to join the Russian side seeing that they are allies.
In this scenario, there are no winners.

 

[ElCastor]

The US has been supplying troops since about the beginning of this fiasco. Supposed to be a secret, but secrets are hard to keep these days. Mostly our troops have been supplying training, but they've also been fighting elbow-to-elbow with Ukranian soldiers.

The moment a Russian nuke squeaks, the US, UK, Europe and Japan will be all over it, with and/or without nukes, and the US will very likely be all over Moscow. It will be heartbreaking, in a way.

If the US was wholly into it with navy, air-force. and active duty Army and Marine units that would be one thing, but we are not. If NATO steps in we are IN. Under those circumstances if NATO troops are nuked we could be looking at Biden’s Armageddon.

 

[Murrmurr]

If the US was wholly into it with navy, air-force. and active duty Army and Marine units that would be one thing, but we are not. If NATO steps in we are IN. Under those circumstances if NATO troops are nuked we could be looking at Biden’s Armageddon.

Except we're not.

Biden's Armageddon, 'eh? Not Putins?

I'm pretty confident there won't be an Armageddon.

 

[Murrmurr]

The other side of that coin, I'd suspect that if the US, UK, Europe and Japan officially joined the Ukraine, then China, N. Korea, India, Turkey, Pakistan, Myanmar, Venezuela, Cuba, and Nicaragua, would almost have to join the Russian side seeing that they are allies.
In this scenario, there are no winners.

Maybe we'll see what kind of allies they are, but I'm thinking we won't. And I'm thinking they wouldn't be very active allies, anyway, despite Kim's desires. just my opinion

 

[squatting dog]

Maybe we'll see what kind of allies they are, but I'm thinking we won't. And I'm thinking they wouldn't be very active allies, anyway, despite Kim's desires. just my opinion

I understand and somewhat agree. However, who really wants to chance this? I guess there's not much you or I can do about any of this.

 

[Warrigal]

The other side of that coin, I'd suspect that if the US, UK, Europe and Japan officially joined the Ukraine, then China, N. Korea, India, Turkey, Pakistan, Myanmar, Venezuela, Cuba, and Nicaragua, would almost have to join the Russian side seeing that they are allies.
In this scenario, there are no winners.

I question the inclusion of India in that list. India is linked to US via the Quad Alliance. The four countries in the Quad are Japan, India, United States and Australia.

Fact Sheet: Quad Leaders’ Summit | The White House

However, it is not actually a defence agreement but according to the Times of India -

The informal alliance between four nations is expected to contain China’s growing military and economic clout in the Indo-Pacific region

 

[squatting dog]

I question the inclusion of India in that list. India is linked to US via the Quad Alliance. The four countries in the Quad are Japan, India, United States and Australia.

Fact Sheet: Quad Leaders’ Summit | The White House

However, it is not actually a defence agreement but according to the Times of India -

Possibly, but, India has emerged among the biggest buyers of Russian oil taking advantage of discounted barrels to provide relief amid elevated inflation and a record trade deficit, so, when push comes to shove, who can tell how another country will swing?
Data sourced from the commerce department showed that during April-July, India's mineral oil imports from Russia soared over eight times to $11.2 billion, compared with $1.3 billion in the corresponding period last year. (Sep 19, 2022)

 

[Warrigal]

Possibly, but, India has emerged among the biggest buyers of Russian oil taking advantage of discounted barrels to provide relief amid elevated inflation and a record trade deficit, so, when push comes to shove, who can tell how another country will swing?
Data sourced from the commerce department showed that during April-July, India's mineral oil imports from Russia soared over eight times to $11.2 billion, compared with $1.3 billion in the corresponding period last year. (Sep 19, 2022)

A more widespread hot war would make many countries to rethink alliances and trade agreements. Australia depends on trade with China and has military alliances with US. We tread carefully now but if push comes to shove we would align with US. India probably feels the same way about China.

 

[garyt1957]

I've been watching the news about Putin's buildup of 200,000. I see where these new troops are going for "training". Putin's exhausted his active military strength??? The number2 military power on the planet is out of men? This is a war on his own border, and he's having manpower issues?? I'm not a military scholar, but to me, it seems the Russian military is a far cry from the USSR, and it's toppling of Hitler's Germany. Ot has war gotten too costly to wage?

They're only a power because they have nukes.

 

[Murrmurr]

They're only a power because they have nukes.

Nukes are only a fraction of it. There's also its industrial capacity, the Bretton Woods Agreement of 1944 and global use of the dollar, global trade and interdependence, global investment, innovation, English as the international language in the air and on the sea, the USA as the world's foremost economic power, and believe it or not, it's speed, readiness, and ability to respond to humanitarian concerns globally - all factors in why the USA is considered a super power. And if there were no nukes, the USA would still hold that status.

 

[Mike]

Last week, the BBC reported that Ukraine had asked that
their application to join NATO, be fast tracked as they are
looking for other Countries for "Defensive Air Support" over
Ukraine, they have since been supplied with better "Anti-Missile",
defence systems.

No other country will set foot in Ukraine unless they are a member
of NATO.

I haven't' heard any more so far.

Mike.

 

[garyt1957]

Nukes are only a fraction of it. There's also its industrial capacity, the Bretton Woods Agreement of 1944 and global use of the dollar, global trade and interdependence, global investment, innovation, English as the international language in the air and on the sea, the USA as the world's foremost economic power, and believe it or not, it's speed, readiness, and ability to respond to humanitarian concerns globally - all factors in why the USA is considered a super power. And if there were no nukes, the USA would still hold that status.

Understood. As we've seen with the Ukraine war Russia is the bully who when challenged can't back it up. But nukes are the great equalizer and why other countries won't get involved. Take nukes out of the picture and NATO would drive Russia back home in weeks

 

[Murrmurr]

No other country will set foot in Ukraine unless they are a member
of NATO.

Openly. They won't set foot in Ukraine openly.

Thousands of Ukrainian soldiers and citizens are recording what's going on over there with their phones, and then posting on YouTube and Instagram and etc., and American and British troops are there. Russian official are seeing these recordings, too, so I'm sure the US and Britain are saying "humanitarian Aid" and whatnot.

 

[Murrmurr]

Possibly, but, India has emerged among the biggest buyers of Russian oil taking advantage of discounted barrels to provide relief amid elevated inflation and a record trade deficit, so, when push comes to shove, who can tell how another country will swing?
Data sourced from the commerce department showed that during April-July, India's mineral oil imports from Russia soared over eight times to $11.2 billion, compared with $1.3 billion in the corresponding period last year. (Sep 19, 2022)

This might explain the news I heard today on UATV; that back in late Sept, India and China gave Putin an ultimatum, end the war or suffer the consequences....which would be them buying those resources from the Middle-East?

(UATV- 24/7 international broadcaster that targets broad audiences around the globe. " objective, impartial, relevant ")

This report also said the buzz within Putin's inner-most inner circle, including his top military guys, is that they are so wealthy and powerful now, they don't need Putin anymore. They're saying openly that Russia has lost the war, and they refuse to take any of the blame. And they're not-so-secretly discussing whether Russia's new leadership should be shared powers (among themselves) or something like a practically powerless puppet dictatorship, with Putin being the puppet and them holding the strings.

 

[WhatInThe]

I'm all for second chances or optional forgiveness but people have to realize there are certain acts or things one dose their life/a "normal" life is. over.

Some people are a like a car that cannot be repaired or have enough salvage parts and should be sent to the scrap heap of life. There is no redeeming value or nothing they can do to make up for their acts for the victims or society. They are done and should be done. Game over for them period.

 

[Timewise 60+]

For my money, any country that has the capability to deliver a thermonuclear weapon to a country is in fact a military superpower. The old thought of invading a country with tanks and personnel using conventional weapons is really irrelevant. If they want to destroy a country, they can do it with nuclear weapons fairly easily.

 

[Nathan]

If the US was wholly into it with navy, air-force. and active duty Army and Marine units that would be one thing, but we are not. If NATO steps in we are IN. Under those circumstances if NATO troops are nuked we could be looking at Biden’s Armageddon.

...and would you have Biden just sit on his hands and do nothing? I would call that Putin's Armageddon as he is the aggressor.

 

[Paco Dennis]

It seems to me that Putin is out for revenge now. Yesterday he says he is not going to send in troops. Yea, right. For now he is pulverizing cities and destroying everything he can to make this winter unbearable for the Ukrainians. Power grids, energy sources, schools, homes, transportation, and as many civilians as possible. Monstrous tactics. This just turned my stomach. The Russians killed a musician ( conductor ) because he refused to take part in a concert that the Russians produced when they occupied Kyiv.

Russian troops kill Ukrainian musician for refusing role in Kherson concert

 

[ElCastor]

...and would you have Biden just sit on his hands and do nothing? I would call that Putin's Armageddon as he is the aggressor.

I would have us continue what we are doing now - supplying arms and ammunition to Ukraine, as well as training and military advice. What I would NOT do would be to put combat units on the ground for the purpose of directly engaging Russian troops. I would also NOT put US flown planes in the air and US manned ships in the sea - tasked with directly engaging the Russian military. The same goes for NATO. Ukraine is not a member of NATO. The introduction of NATO would be an invitation to WW3.

 

[Murrmurr]

For my money, any country that has the capability to deliver a thermonuclear weapon to a country is in fact a military superpower. The old thought of invading a country with tanks and personnel using conventional weapons is really irrelevant. If they want to destroy a country, they can do it with nuclear weapons fairly easily.

You're forgetting that, whether a country is capable of delivering nukes or not, if other countries continually advance their military technology after 1947, and the nuke-having country doesn't, it's pretty much an even playing field. It seems Putin thought what you're thinking, that being able to shoot nukes is enough. He's finding out he was wrong.

For one example, the USA, Britain, Germany, and Japan have developed the technology to program their weapons and anti-weapons...to literally download target coordinates using GPS....for absolute accuracy. Russia obviously has not. Putin wasn't even aware until now that that could be done. His army is still building tanks and stuff using WWll technology. His military leaders have apparently been sitting on their predecessor's laurels for 40-some years.

I heard that Iran offered to help Putin step into the 21st century, but I think its too late at this point.

 

[Don M.]

This coming Winter is going to be Very Harsh for the European nations and people. Without the fuels from Russia, just trying to stay warm is going to be a real challenge for millions. I'll be surprised if there aren't some major concessions given to Putin by Spring.

 

[Timewise 60+]

You're forgetting that, whether a country is capable of delivering nukes or not, if other countries continually advance their military technology after 1947, and the nuke-having country doesn't, it's pretty much an even playing field. It seems Putin thought what you're thinking, that being able to shoot nukes is enough. He's finding out he was wrong. He is only "wrong" right up until he does! God, I hope he doesn't, but I don't trust that he will not.

For one example, the USA, Britain, Germany, and Japan have developed the technology to program their weapons and anti-weapons...to literally download target coordinates using GPS....for absolute accuracy. Russia obviously has not. Putin wasn't even aware until now that that could be done. His army is still building tanks and stuff using WWll technology. His military leaders have apparently been sitting on their predecessor's laurels for 40-some years. Sources, I like reading this, but it is the only time I have read this? Stopping nukes is as much of a numbers games as a technology game. With submarine delivery technology and the short warning times for coastal cities, including DC, knocking them out would be a high risk plan I believe.

I heard that Iran offered to help Putin step into the 21st century, but I think its too late at this point.

 

[squatting dog]

You're forgetting that, whether a country is capable of delivering nukes or not, if other countries continually advance their military technology after 1947, and the nuke-having country doesn't, it's pretty much an even playing field. It seems Putin thought what you're thinking, that being able to shoot nukes is enough. He's finding out he was wrong.

For one example, the USA, Britain, Germany, and Japan have developed the technology to program their weapons and anti-weapons...to literally download target coordinates using GPS....for absolute accuracy. Russia obviously has not. Putin wasn't even aware until now that that could be done. His army is still building tanks and stuff using WWll technology. His military leaders have apparently been sitting on their predecessor's laurels for 40-some years.

I heard that Iran offered to help Putin step into the 21st century, but I think its too late at this point.

We have a classic case of all our eggs in one basket.
If your goal is just to affect the adversary’s ability to use Position, Navigation and Timing data (what GPS provides), you could just jam the signal on the ground. Some antennas are directed, meaning that the beam is very narrow and you have to be in the beam path/footprint to use/jam it. Directional antennas must be pointed at each other, with very little room for error. GPS receivers are omnidirectional, meaning they’ll take signals from any direction, and GPS transmitters have very wide footprints to hit as large of a portion of the earth’s surface at a given time. Because the receivers will accept signals from any direction, they are very easy to jam or spoof (trick with a fake signal). If you needed to prevent someone from getting a GPS signal, the easiest and cheapest option would be to jam the receiver.
China and other countries (Russia) have put satellites for their own regional navigation systems into orbit that work on different frequencies, which means that on a battlefield they could block U.S. signals without disrupting their own.

 

[Murrmurr]

We have a classic case of all our eggs in one basket.
If your goal is just to affect the adversary’s ability to use Position, Navigation and Timing data (what GPS provides), you could just jam the signal on the ground. Some antennas are directed, meaning that the beam is very narrow and you have to be in the beam path/footprint to use/jam it. Directional antennas must be pointed at each other, with very little room for error. GPS receivers are omnidirectional, meaning they’ll take signals from any direction, and GPS transmitters have very wide footprints to hit as large of a portion of the earth’s surface at a given time. Because the receivers will accept signals from any direction, they are very easy to jam or spoof (trick with a fake signal). If you needed to prevent someone from getting a GPS signal, the easiest and cheapest option would be to jam the receiver.
China and other countries (Russia) have put satellites for their own regional navigation systems into orbit that work on different frequencies, which means that on a battlefield they could block U.S. signals without disrupting their own.

That's not my point, but anyway, if Russia can scramble, intercept, or effect Ukraine's GPS technology, then why haven't they?

 

[Victoria]

Ity's crazy. I also over estimated what Russia can do. I read that they were grabbing homeless people off the street and making them join the troops.