Paco Dennis
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- Mid-Missouri
Some basics
- Thread starter Paco Dennis
- Start date
Warrigal
SF VIP
- Location
- Sydney, Australia
Exactly.
mike4lorie
SF VIP
- Location
- Brockville, Ontario, Canada
That is exactly true, Through the hardships, they are going through since covid, and it's not even since covid. But it is wrong that grocery stores, and banks all get richer off our backs. It's totally wrong. I know you open a business to make money, but there's making money, and getting very rich off the backs of your employees and customers, is very very wrong...
Alligatorob
SF VIP
I think there is truth to that. Rich folks can only become rich by taking advantage of the work of many people. Usually they have to work hard to do that, but it takes a lot of brains, ambition, entrepreneurialship, and often being cut throat.
On balance I think we are better off with people like Bill Gates, arguably without his leadership genius we would not have computers that work as well today as we have. Not saying they should not be taxed, or regulated, that is necessary.
One thing I think we really need is a higher inheritance tax on the very rich. I have no problem with people like Bill Gates accumulating a lot of money, he has probably earned it, but not his heirs. I am not talking about the middleclass, small businesses or small farmers, that is different. But for the ultra rich there need to be inheritance limits. Bill Gates family could be quite rich and comfortable with only a fraction of his fortune. Don't mean to pick on Gates, he is just one example.
On balance I think we are better off with people like Bill Gates, arguably without his leadership genius we would not have computers that work as well today as we have. Not saying they should not be taxed, or regulated, that is necessary.
One thing I think we really need is a higher inheritance tax on the very rich. I have no problem with people like Bill Gates accumulating a lot of money, he has probably earned it, but not his heirs. I am not talking about the middleclass, small businesses or small farmers, that is different. But for the ultra rich there need to be inheritance limits. Bill Gates family could be quite rich and comfortable with only a fraction of his fortune. Don't mean to pick on Gates, he is just one example.
oldlongwalker
Member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
Playing a bit of devil's advoate here. The vast majority of billionaires are such because of the stock market, and not directly from exploiting the labor of those who work for them. There are some billionaires who made their riches owning private companies, but they are a small minority.
On the other hand, take an example like the Pritzkers who own the Hyatt hotel company. By 2016 all of them were wealthy, but not billionaires. In order to resolve some family disputes, they went public, and then became billionaires. You might argue that they wouldn't have been able to launch such a successful IPO had they already not been exploiting their workers for all those years.
On the other hand, take an example like the Pritzkers who own the Hyatt hotel company. By 2016 all of them were wealthy, but not billionaires. In order to resolve some family disputes, they went public, and then became billionaires. You might argue that they wouldn't have been able to launch such a successful IPO had they already not been exploiting their workers for all those years.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
That is probably true, and while I don't pretend to really understand the stock market I am not sure that is bad. As I understand it the stock market is where companies get funds to support and grow their businesses. I think we are better off if the more successful businesses get more funding. So rewarding folks for being smart and choosing the right companies to give funds to only make sense.
In my case most of the stock buying decisions I have made went south, so I'm certainly not one of those...
Subject to my concern that the individuals who make those decisions should benefit, but not their heirs so much.
Wigglestein
Member
- Location
- Wisconsin
This is just like when politicians say they created jobs!!! "In my first term I created 25,000 jobs". BS! Politicians never create jobs unless they own a business of their own. They may find ways to improve the economy or change regulation that allows employers to create jobs, but that's pretty much it. Oh and they can throw money at employers and ask them to create them.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
In the long run I suspect that creates fewer jobs than just reasonable regulation and taxation... and by misspending our tax dollars maybe a net cost of jobs...
spectratg
Senior Member
- Location
- Adamstown, MD
And what would be the alternative to capitalism? It's worked reasonably well for the USA (and western Europe) so far. Many workers (sure not all) make a good living for themselves and their families.
Knight
Well-known Member
Always a choice.
1.Take your talent & ability to start & business. Grow the business to the point that workers make you rich.
2. Be a worker that applies for the job that makes those that grew a business rich that makes it possible for you to earn the wage you agreed to work for.
3. Move to where government runs all businesses
Basically for me this applies.
post number 2855 in general humor
1.Take your talent & ability to start & business. Grow the business to the point that workers make you rich.
2. Be a worker that applies for the job that makes those that grew a business rich that makes it possible for you to earn the wage you agreed to work for.
3. Move to where government runs all businesses
Basically for me this applies.
post number 2855 in general humor
Last edited:
oldlongwalker
Member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
With regard to the stock market, when a company decides to go public and issue stock, it is the owners of the company who are usually the principal beneficiaries. They will normally hold about 10% of the issued shares. Employees often get nothing, or at best an opportunity to buy on the open market at the issue.
I think this should be changed. Since it is the employees who got the company to the point where they were able to go public, they should also benefit.
I think this should be changed. Since it is the employees who got the company to the point where they were able to go public, they should also benefit.
oldlongwalker
Member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
I think you have left out some options. For instance, the Scandinavian countries which have a mixed economy. They are capitalist but with restrictions and a large social system funded with taxes that ensures good healthcare. They also make every effort to ensure citizens don't become impoverished as they age. They consistently rank highest on the overall "happiness" scale--taken for whatever it is worth.
I find that in the US the key element we lack is a stronger shared idea of the common good. We give much greater preference to individual rights.
Knight
Well-known Member
Quote
"I think you have left out some options. For instance, the Scandinavian countries which have a mixed economy. They are capitalist but with restrictions and a large social system funded with taxes that ensures good healthcare. "
A good explanation of that tax system is in this site
https://taxfoundation.org/scandinav... tax rates,of Scandinavian income tax systems.
I don't think that system of taxes would be happily accepted in America. Especially the VAT tax on top of the wage tax.
Then there is this.
Scandinavia is attractive but not an easy option
However, moving to Denmark, Norway or Sweden as an American citizen is not easy. Unless you are fortunate enough to fall in love with a Scandinavian, you'll need to excel in your field to obtain a work permit and master the local language to stay long-term.
https://www.google.com/search?q=How...kQIHQyWA6IQzmd6BAgeEAU&biw=1280&bih=881&dpr=1
What percentage of Americans work in service industries?
Most American workers are employed in the service sector.
107.8 million people (71% of all nonfarm payroll employees) worked in private service-providing industries, according to the BLS's most recent employment report.
Note that you'll need to excel in your field to obtain a work permit and master the local language to stay long-term. So while pointing out that quality of life in Scandinavia is great not likely unskilled stand a cance of being accepted.
As for health care I have no complaints. Early on no health care coverage but no health care issues either. Later BCBS point of service was employment benefit. Our Medicare Advantage plan has been exceptional. Eye care, dental 3k per year coverage. $840.00 a year to spend for health care needs. Recently my wife was seen in the hospital emergency section. Out of pocket expense $90.00 on a bill a little over 42k.
Population differences, skills, job types, employment opportunities, wages & benefits all play a role in how one perceives their quality of life.
All in all my life experience working for someone that was able to build a business to the point of hiring people to grow more has been very satisfying.
"I think you have left out some options. For instance, the Scandinavian countries which have a mixed economy. They are capitalist but with restrictions and a large social system funded with taxes that ensures good healthcare. "
A good explanation of that tax system is in this site
https://taxfoundation.org/scandinav... tax rates,of Scandinavian income tax systems.
I don't think that system of taxes would be happily accepted in America. Especially the VAT tax on top of the wage tax.
Then there is this.
Scandinavia is attractive but not an easy option
However, moving to Denmark, Norway or Sweden as an American citizen is not easy. Unless you are fortunate enough to fall in love with a Scandinavian, you'll need to excel in your field to obtain a work permit and master the local language to stay long-term.
https://www.google.com/search?q=How...kQIHQyWA6IQzmd6BAgeEAU&biw=1280&bih=881&dpr=1
What percentage of Americans work in service industries?
Most American workers are employed in the service sector.
107.8 million people (71% of all nonfarm payroll employees) worked in private service-providing industries, according to the BLS's most recent employment report.
Note that you'll need to excel in your field to obtain a work permit and master the local language to stay long-term. So while pointing out that quality of life in Scandinavia is great not likely unskilled stand a cance of being accepted.
As for health care I have no complaints. Early on no health care coverage but no health care issues either. Later BCBS point of service was employment benefit. Our Medicare Advantage plan has been exceptional. Eye care, dental 3k per year coverage. $840.00 a year to spend for health care needs. Recently my wife was seen in the hospital emergency section. Out of pocket expense $90.00 on a bill a little over 42k.
Population differences, skills, job types, employment opportunities, wages & benefits all play a role in how one perceives their quality of life.
All in all my life experience working for someone that was able to build a business to the point of hiring people to grow more has been very satisfying.