hmm so no religious studies at all - not even the holy bible from moses?
LGBTQ books in public school libraries
- Thread starter Sunny
- Start date
I agree the world is changing - always does but does that mean we have to walk around with eyes closed and bump into each other?? - aren't we brighter creatures than that?
ElCastor
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern CA
My eyes are open. Are yours?
Rose65
Well-known Member
- Location
- United Kingdom
It's an important point indeed.
The UK is Christian country, with the monarch head of the Church of England. So yes I believe certainly basic Bible should be taught. Religious Studies also, from an academic point, so that children obtain knowledge of other religions and have a respect for them.
As for the rest of the things mentioned, leave it alone. Stop confusing children.
As are many other nations within the commonwealth umbrella eg Oz and Nz certainly would have religious studies and also smaller commonwealth nations but there are all mixes with newly arrived immigrants or long standing indigenous folk with their own religious beliefs - it can get quite complex? the complexities of commonwealth country living!!
Wayne
Senior Member
Per topic ?
I would be speaking to the school some things I approve of others I do not.
I would be speaking to the school some things I approve of others I do not.
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JustDave
Well-known Member
I have no idea what is different about Critical Race Theory than simply understanding that we are all created equal. In other words what is the fuss about? I guess I'll have to look it up and read what it is. How many hits on google will I have to go through that are not about what it is, but what is wrong with it? How many who have objected to it or support it know what it is? This has a political feel to me. When politicians get involved, truth and common sense go out the window. Time for some research.
ElCastor
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern CA
Really? What is “straight in from”? All on the Left side of your head? Whatever. This conversation is getting absurd. Count me out.
I googled Critical Race Theory definition and found a lot of hits. This one is from brittania.com. But once again, we seem to be way off the original subject
critical race theory (CRT), intellectual and social movement and loosely organized framework of legal analysis based on the premise that race is not a natural, biologically grounded feature of physically distinct subgroups of human beings but a socially constructed (culturally invented) category that is used to oppress and exploit people of colour. Critical race theorists hold that racism is inherent in the law and legal institutions of the United States insofar as they function to create and maintain social, economic, and political inequalities between whites and nonwhites, especially African Americans. Critical race theorists are generally dedicated to applying their understanding of the institutional or structural nature of racism to the concrete (if distant) goal of eliminating all race-based and other unjust hierarchies.
v
JustDave
Well-known Member
I wasn't kidding before. I actually googled it and then read the Brittanica piece and the Wikepedia one, which lifted a lot from Brittanica. Even in those, there was a lot of "supporters say," and "Opposers say." I suppose that's unavoidable, so now I'm thinking I really need a course study. I live in Rural Virginia. I doubt it's available around here, so it would have to be on line, but I can pretty much guess that I'll agree with most of it.
I've been saying that part for fifty years. The top anthropologists like Leaky have long since stated that there's really no such thing as racial divisions among humans. I had hoped that this century we would quit using race as a category or adjective at all. It would be harder for police profilers, real estate agents, and loan officers to discriminate against people based on race if we no longer used those terms or checked those boxes. What confuses me is how we are supposed to eliminate division based on race, while looking ever harder for racism in every aspect of life.
In other words I just don't understand CRT and I'm not sure how teachers will be able to teach it and and children understand it. I'm just afraid it will only make children more conscious of their classmate's "race" at a time when they are simply seeing one another as friends.
We should all realize that it is common to find a significant number of white supremacists in police departments and in the military. A declaration of skin color not being an indicator of race and/or that humans are not divided into races, will not stop white supremacists from seeing skin color and allowing it to influence them. There needs to be a well-developed program to identify white supremacists present among our police and military and remove them. Biased responses to public needs are not acceptable.
Your second concern, Della, pertains to CRT.
The actual situation is that, being a college-level elective course, CRT may have been, and may be, coursework for some teachers who may then rely on the principles of CRT to guide them in their work of teaching children. And that means that children may be taught our real history. They may be taught that white plantation owners bought and sold black people and often abused them in ways that were inhumane and would qualify today as crimes against humanity. The fear among some is that this factual history may cause today’s white children to feel guilt for what their race did to others some hundreds of years ago. And then all manner if fantasy and imagination has gone into speculations about what this guilt may cause in white children, including self-loathing, shame, etc. People with these concerns have reacted with protestations and demands that CRT be banned, and that children should not be taught that slavery was a reality as was the inhumane treatment and lynching of blacks. They feel that it is more positive to ban and deny and ignore these aspects of our history, hoping it will be forgotten, or for some (white supremacists mainly), the opposite, ––that it would be possible for this history of inhumanity to repeat itself. At least that is the fear of some who find this whole thing to be an unnecessary episode of covert agenda.
I think history should be taught with complete truth, not only insofar as what happened when, whether it's slavery, the holocaust, the treatment of Native Americans, exploitation of Chinese labor in building the railroads (it goes on and on), but they also should be taught the lasting effects of poorer schools for certain ethnic groups and laws limiting home and business ownership. Laws that resulted in wide spread poverty for some groups.
I just think these more complicated subjects, like this and explicit sex education, (back to the OP) should all wait until junior high school when students brains and bodies are better able to understand and not misinterpret the information.
I just think these more complicated subjects, like this and explicit sex education, (back to the OP) should all wait until junior high school when students brains and bodies are better able to understand and not misinterpret the information.
Knight
Well-known Member
I think the conversation veered off the OPS original post when someone began taking the topic from books in the library to classroom instruction.
As I've posted in answering the ops post. I'd discuss with my sons the contents of any books they brought home that dealt with what those parents are objecting to.
Back when my sons were in their early teens Playboy center fold with full frontal nudity was quite controversial. They somehow managed to get copies. Rather than pretend that the female nude body was something dirty that shouldn't be looked at, the approach I used of discussing the difference worked as a heathy way to educate them.
Do you trust the majority of parents and teachers to make sound decisions on what should be taught to students and what is appropriate for different age groups? Or do you believe a government official or governor with no training in education should make that decision?
Mitch86
Member
- Location
- Connecticut, USA
Society can censor certain books. For example, pro-Nazi and pro-Communist books are banned. Books promoting the overthrow of the US government are banned and so are many others containing anti-social and anti-government books are also banned. Books promoting perverted sex and promoting the expansion of sex SLAVES are also banned.
For an example see this link on sex slavery in the US.:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jul/19/us-modern-slavery-report-global-slavery-index
Books promoting prejudice against blacks and Jews are also banned.
For an example see this link on sex slavery in the US.:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jul/19/us-modern-slavery-report-global-slavery-index
Books promoting prejudice against blacks and Jews are also banned.
Can you find and quote The Guardian regarding a ban of books/writings on sex slavery in your link?
Regarding a “ban” on pro-Nazi books:
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=The+Turner+Diaries+by+William+Luther+Pierce&t=h_&ia=web
https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/340091.William_Luther_Pierce
Are you sure they’re banned?
ElCastor
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern CA
Sadly there are measurable IQ differences between races, with the highest scores not going to Whites, but rather to East Asians:
“The Worldwide Pattern of IQ Scores. East Asians average higher on IQ tests than Whites, both in the U. S. and in Asia, even though IQ tests were developed for use in the Euro-American culture. Around the world, the average IQ for East Asians centers around 106; for Whites, about 100; and for Blacks about 85 in the U.S. and 70 in sub-Saharan Africa.”
https://www.innovations-report.com/studies-and-analyses/report-43536/
The highest scores in the world go to Ashkenazi Jews, likely a result of Eastern European discrimination against Jewish immigrants. Albert Einstein being a fine example. Ironically this genetic trait of high intelligence is accompanied by an inclination toward several serious genetic diseases.
“Sex,” I was pretty sure, meant whether you were a boy or girl, and “sin” made Tante Jans very angry, but what the two together meant I could not imagine. And so, seated next to Father in the train compartment, I suddenly asked, “Father, what is sexsin?”
He turned to look at me, as he always did when answering a question, but to my surprise he said nothing. At last he stood up, lifted his traveling case from the rack over our heads, and set it on the floor.
“Will you carry it off the train, Corrie?” he said.
I stood up and tugged at it. It was crammed with the watches and spare parts he had purchased that morning.
“It’s too heavy,” I said.
“Yes,” he said. “And it would be a pretty poor father who would ask his little girl to carry such a load. It’s the same way, Corrie, with knowledge. Some knowledge is too heavy for children. When you are older and stronger you can bear it. For now you must trust me to carry it for you.”
- from The Hiding Place: The Story of Corrie Ten Boom
We are asking our children to carry loads that are way too heavy for them. They should not be forced, as children, to see and feel the world through the lens of adults. Innocence is worth protecting and worth fighting for. We need to do our part as teachers, parents and caregivers to carry certain things for them until they are old enough to bear the load.
For now
My little ones safely remain from this upside down world
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Knight
Well-known Member
The difference I see in this is the use of force isn't present. The topic is about library books available to read. I can only reply from what I would do as a parent realizing that exposer to all kinds of input is far different than the story which was written in 1971.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/561909
The Hiding Place is a 1971 book on the life of Corrie ten Boom, written by herself and John and Elizabeth Sherrill. The book begins with the ten
So if one of my sons came home with a library book that had the material the parents are objecting to I'd read what it was they were objecting to. I would decide whether to discuss the content with him.
IF he had already read the material & questioned me I would discuss it in a factual manner. The amount of "Objectional" material possible for kids to View, Hear & Read now boggles my mind. Even internet access with parental con troll isn't foolproof.
Maybe forgotten in all this is there is historical reference to differences in the bible. And for those with faith that a God has a plan for all of us wouldn't the plan include gender change as mankind progresses. Or should that be denied & be shamed as we all know took place due to good Christians interpreting the bible passages to the detriment of human beings?
Oh, I know @Knight
I jus' saw how off topic things were going on this thread and ventured another stray bullet
Forgive me
I'm old
I pee alot
Censorship/book banning is a nebulous adventure on a slippery slope.
It's much like legislating morality
Somewhere there's a cliff edge to 'freedom'
Not sure where that is.....
'Progresses'....good one
A plan
yes
Genesis;
'And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.'
Then the flood came
'and took them all away'
Pretty sure we're gettin' there with our 'progress'
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Knight
Well-known Member
Definitions from Oxford Languages ·
verb
3rd person present: progresses
/prəˈɡres/
move forward or onward in space or time.
"as the century progressed, the quality of telescopes improved"
Or as my post intended to show medical advances to help People.
Better one
Then the flood came 'and took them all away'
Benevolent being caring for his creation the only way known? Kill them all but save a family. WOW just WOW mankind not the creator figured out that incest would cause problems. Now that is progress.
But the omnipotent being didn't get it right obviously since mankind according this
Quote
Pretty sure we're gettin' there with our 'progress'
So now with progress the backward thinking good Christians are learning that people have different feelings about themselves & are Finally being able to openly express how they feel. With the ccaveatthat there still are backward thinking good Christian people wanting to do those people harm.
hearlady
Every Day is a New Day.
- Location
- N Carolina
It's not progress if mankind dies not remain decent and selfless whilst progressing.