Men, I need some advice

Murrmurr said:
(Might surprise some people, but...) After I turned 60, I started finding older woman attractive. Very attractive, actually. I became intrigued with their mature wisdom and seasoned sense of humor and openness. Older women (generally speaking) are less inhibited; they know what they want and they don't hesitate to tell you.

Also, they don't put up with any bullshyte.

It was so refreshing.
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💯
 
Murrmurr said:
My oldest son, Grant, is 46. We were leisurely browsing at a shop where he buys scrap metals when he told me he's not sexually attracted to his wife anymore. She's 2 years older than him, but that's never mattered at all.

I didn't have a whole lot to say about it because I never had that experience; until just recently, I was single most of my adult life.

Am I right to assume this is a common midlife thing for married men? I was a single dad, and I feel like I was always there for my kids, but I really didn't know what to say.

Grant and his wife have been married for over 2 decades. I think it might be significant that his hair is thinning and he kind of obsesses over a bald spot, he's put on some extra pounds, and he's been working the same type of job since he was 22. He has a really good hobby, though. He builds custom bicycles, frames, and parts, and he makes a little money off them. He also has an excellent income, but that could actually be a down-side, if you know what I mean.

He's pretty depressed about this sort of sudden lack of attraction to his wife. That attraction used to be all he talked about. Now he's talking about going outside his marriage. I told him to hold off on that while we both think this thing through. But, like I said, I'm at a loss.

So, any of you guys been there, or have any advice I can give him?
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With me, it was my wife (remember that incredibly GREAT song?) who lost interest. I've been incel for more than 20 years.
People wonder why I want to die.
 

Open and honest communication is key. It's important to create a safe space for both partners to express their feelings and concerns without judgment. Empathy, understanding, and the willingness to seek professional help if needed are also crucial components of navigating this delicate issue. When it comes to family dynamics, fostering open lines of communication can help address any potential impacts and maintain understanding among all family members involved.
 
I am kinda surprised you already know as much as you do about their sex life, that your DIL can be "adventurous"........l don't see you as having a need to know this at all. Eventually, it will be between them only, theirs to figure out. I'm almost sorry you have this information; yet I'm so very glad Grant is close to you and you have trust between you. Que sera, sera. Hoping whatever happens is for their best interests.

How wonderful to grow up with YOU as Dad. Your kids are lucky in that department. So is my grandson. Lucky to have a great dad. I think of mine every single day, more than once. I feel him always with me, caring; just like you to Grant.
 
First tell him to never compromise his integrity. He either chooses to work on the marriage or end it, there should be no testing the waters until things are resolved.

I'm also not as keen on forever working on a struggling marriage, I tried that approach and wasted fifthteen years of my life. Sometimes we need to accept we have grown in different a direction than our spouse, if your son is unhappy in his marriage I'm not sure how you get past that.
 
C50 said:
First tell him to never compromise his integrity. He either chooses to work on the marriage or end it, there should be no testing the waters until things are resolved.

I'm also not as keen on forever working on a struggling marriage, I tried that approach and wasted fifthteen years of my life. Sometimes we need to accept we have grown in different a direction than our spouse, if your son is unhappy in his marriage I'm not sure how you get past that.
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I have found couples counseling to an utter waste of time. I spent four fcuking weeks, thrice a week, and all the "counselor" did was try to get me to change my mind about kids. Nope, I blew off two marriages because the spouse decided they "changed their minds."

Never looked back, never relented. When it comes to kids, never had 'em, never will. #ChildFree
 
Murrmurr said:
What's puzzling to me is that Grant's wife was always sexually adventurous (according to him) and he says she still is. I mean, they've both slowed down some, but he knows that's normal.

What he's saying is he's not physically attracted to her. And she hasn't changed much at all since they married.
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I have to say, I think your son is seeking permission to go out and get some strange. Send him up to Carson City for a professional experience.
 
@Murrmurr

Any of this sound like Grant?

The 'male menopause'
Some men develop depression, loss of sex drive, erectile dysfunction, and other physical and emotional symptoms when they reach their late 40s to early 50s.

Other symptoms common in men this age are:

mood swings and irritability
loss of muscle mass and reduced ability to exercise
fat redistribution, such as developing a large belly or "man boobs" (gynaecomastia)
a general lack of enthusiasm or energy
difficulty sleeping (insomnia) or increased tiredness
poor concentration and short-term memory
These symptoms can interfere with everyday life and happiness, so it's important to find the underlying cause and work out what can be done to resolve it.

The 'male menopause'
 
If he were my son, I think I would have told him to have the conversation with his wife, probably not to say that he isn't attracted to her anymore but rather that he feels the marriage is losing the physical closeness which they once had and enjoyed. The conversation may upset his wife but, on the other hand, she might welcome the opportunity to sit down and have a grown-up conversation. One thing is for sure, I think, if he isn't honest with his wife and if he does stray, the chances are his wife will find out sooner or later and then the decision will no longer be your son's to make. I hope they can work this out (y)
 
fuzzybuddy said:
Murrmurr, Grant is 46. That age is THE age for a midlife crisis, and all that entails. The only thing you can do is be a dad. It's his problem, not yours to fix.
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True, and he didn't ask me to fix it. I'm sure he knows I can't. But he told me about it for a reason. Input, I suppose. Insight, at best.

I had nothin. 🤪
 
Knight said:
@Murrmurr

Any of this sound like Grant?

The 'male menopause'
Some men develop depression, loss of sex drive, erectile dysfunction, and other physical and emotional symptoms when they reach their late 40s to early 50s.

Other symptoms common in men this age are:

mood swings and irritability
loss of muscle mass and reduced ability to exercise
fat redistribution, such as developing a large belly or "man boobs" (gynaecomastia)
a general lack of enthusiasm or energy
difficulty sleeping (insomnia) or increased tiredness
poor concentration and short-term memory
These symptoms can interfere with everyday life and happiness, so it's important to find the underlying cause and work out what can be done to resolve it.

The 'male menopause'
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Thank you, Knight.

Grant's carrying 15-20 extra pounds, he's losing his hair, and he hates being assigned to the labor crews...but after making foreman 17yrs ago and design engineer not long after, and with over 25 years experience in various aspects of the field, who wouldn't?

He's nearing 50, so he knows he's in midlife. I'm closing in on 70, so he figures I'm on my way down the other side of that hill and I ought to know a thing or two.

Well, I know some things.
 
A marriage is an accomplishment. To bail on one is a lack of accomplishment.

It's a promise to be there no matter what. During the process we fall in and out of love but the commitment to that promise makes you a better person in the long run. It teaches you unselfishness.
 
It's so hard when your adult kids are going through shit @Murrmurr .
You can't fix this. You're the shoulder. You're the Dad. You're the listener. And you know some things and some you don't.
Sorry you have to experience this. Kid issues are the worst.
 
Trish said:
If he were my son, I think I would have told him to have the conversation with his wife, probably not to say that he isn't attracted to her anymore but rather that he feels the marriage is losing the physical closeness which they once had and enjoyed. The conversation may upset his wife but, on the other hand, she might welcome the opportunity to sit down and have a grown-up conversation. One thing is for sure, I think, if he isn't honest with his wife and if he does stray, the chances are his wife will find out sooner or later and then the decision will no longer be your son's to make. I hope they can work this out (y)
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And that's excellent advice. In fact, it's what I told him to do; sit down with Kat and discuss.

You know that sound you make when you draw in a long breath through clenched teeth? That's the sound I heard after giving him that bit of advice.

Kat is very sensitive. If you ask me, she's too sensitive. No one should be that sensitive, but I assume she has reason to be, so I don't question it. Early in their marriage, she explained to Grant that, from her perspective, sarcastic humor is extremely hurtful, and not only to her, but in general, sarcasm and insult are the same thing.

Well, sarcastic humor is basically a Murr family trait. For his wife's sake, Grant broke that cycle.
 
Pepper said:
I am kinda surprised you already know as much as you do about their sex life, that your DIL can be "adventurous"........l don't see you as having a need to know this at all.
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Believe me, I didn't ask. Thank god he didn't go into a lot of details, but still, I never looked at her quite the same way.

But honestly, I was grateful she made Grant so ecstatically happy....well, until recently. And the issue isn't in the, um, details he left out of those conversations. The issue is "I'm just not attracted to her anymore." Like, full-stop.

I don't even know if that's fixable.
 
Murrmurr said:
And that's excellent advice. In fact, it's what I told him to do; sit down with Kat and discuss.

You know that sound you make when you draw in a long breath through clenched teeth? That's the sound I heard after giving him that bit of advice.

Kat is very sensitive. If you ask me, she's too sensitive. No one should be that sensitive, but I assume she has reason to be, so I don't question it. Early in their marriage, she explained to Grant that, from her perspective, sarcastic humor is extremely hurtful, and not only to her, but in general, sarcasm and insult are the same thing.

Well, sarcastic humor is basically a Murr family trait. For his wife's sake, Grant broke that cycle.
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I have to admit, I do agree about sarcasm, it's a dodgy area! It's usually funnier for other people than the person it is directed at although, sarcasm which is off the cuff and not directed at anyone can be very funny.

I understand your son's hesitation but the only choice he has is to talk about it or not. If he chooses the latter, they will likely drift apart and it will become too late for talking, especially if he has looked elsewhere.

You come across as emotionally intelligent and I am sure, with your advice, he will appreciate that the way to approach it is by not expressing his lack of attraction towards her because, I think, that is just a symptom of his current mood. If he can present it as an opportunity to talk about their marriage and how they regain the fun and closeness they have shared in the past, I think he may well also rediscover the feelings he feels he has lost. It's worth a shot 🤞
 
Trish said:
I have to admit, I do agree about sarcasm, it's a dodgy area! It's usually funnier for other people than the person it is directed at although, sarcasm which is off the cuff and not directed at anyone can be very funny.
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That's true, and an interesting topic (imo). Both my sons inherited (if you will) my sarcastic sense of humor, and all 3 of my youngest son's daughters got it from him. His youngest daughter's sarcasm is the sharpest, and by that I mean she's hilarious but she can be kind of cruel. She never targets anyone with, like, disabilities, or who's less fortunate than her, or in some inescapable circumstance, but once in a while, she hurts someone unknowingly, and then she's all puzzled about it. But then, she's only 13.

I suspect she'll lose a number of friends before she figures this whole thing out.

An example of Ariel's sarcasm and Kat's sensitivities: After Thanksgiving dinner a few years ago, we were all having dessert when Ariel made a wisecrack to her mom about fat. Her mom, who'd been maintaining a weight-loss of over 20 pounds for about a year, laughed until her ribs hurt.

On the other hand, Kat burst into tears and ran into the bathroom. She literally cried for like an hour on Ariel's mom's behalf. And we all looked at each other like "WTF just happened?" (or, in some cases, "The pumpkin pie any good?" 😜 )

All except for Grant.
 
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Murrmurr said:
That's true, and an interesting topic (imo). Both my sons inherited (if you will) my sarcastic sense of humor, and all 3 of my youngest son's daughters got it from him. His youngest daughter's sarcasm is the sharpest, and by that I mean she can be kind of cruel. She never targets anyone with, like, disabilities, or who's less fortunate than her, or in some inescapable circumstance, but once in a while, she hurts someone unknowingly, and then she's all puzzled about it. But then, she's only 13.

I suspect she'll lose a number of friends before she figures this whole thing out.

An example of Ariel's sarcasm and Kat's sensitivities: After Thanksgiving dinner a few years ago, we were all having dessert when Ariel made a wisecrack to her mom about fat. Her mom, who'd been maintaining a weight-loss of over 20 pounds for about a year, laughed until her ribs hurt.

On the other hand, Kat burst into tears and ran into the bathroom. She literally cried for like an hour on Ariel's mom's behalf. And we all looked at each other like "WTF just happened?" (or, in some cases, "The pumpkin pie any good?" 😜 )

All except for Grant.
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A lot depends on how well you know someone and how secure you are in your relationship with them. Ariel's mum not only shares that sense of humour, she knows her daughter means no harm but, obviously not everyone will react that way. I have a friend who is known for making inappropriate and sometimes nasty comments. She thinks she is has a great sense of humour which, to be honest, is what I find funniest.

Kat does sound very sensitive and your post above where you say everyone laughed except for Grant, do you think he was upset to see Kat hurt or because he finds her sensitivity irritating? Kat sounds very caring but, it can be wearing if you are in a relationship with someone who is too thin skinned.
 
Trish said:
A lot depends on how well you know someone and how secure you are in your relationship with them. Ariel's mum not only shares that sense of humour, she knows her daughter means no harm but, obviously not everyone will react that way. I have a friend who is known for making inappropriate and sometimes nasty comments. She thinks she is has a great sense of humour which, to be honest, is what I find funniest.

Kat does sound very sensitive and your post above where you say everyone laughed except for Grant, do you think he was upset to see Kat hurt or because he finds her sensitivity irritating? Kat sounds very caring but, it can be wearing if you are in a relationship with someone who is too thin skinned.
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Grant knew Kat's empathic nature made her cry, not so much Ariel's wisecrack. Grant used to have the sharpest sarcastic humor in the family before Kat *enlightened* him.

Those asterisks are qualifiers, but that's me; Grant really does feel his wife has enlightened him about a number of things, including politics, so that's a topic he and I rarely discuss anymore. And that's fine. What makes Grant happy is always very fine.

And maybe Kat helped Grant find himself; his authentic self, as she would put it. Or maybe not. I think it's possible Grant is finding himself now, in midlife, as many of us do.
 
Murrmurr said:
Grant knew Kat's empathic nature made her cry, not so much Ariel's wisecrack. Grant used to have the sharpest sarcastic humor in the family before Kat *enlightened* him.

Those asterisks are qualifiers, but that's me; Grant really does feel his wife has enlightened him about a number of things, including politics, so that's a topic he and I rarely discuss anymore. And that's fine. What makes Grant happy is always very fine.

And maybe Kat helped Grant find himself; his authentic self, as she would put it. Or maybe not. I think it's possible Grant is finding himself now, in midlife, as many of us do.
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Oh that's interesting isn't it?
 

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