Paco Dennis
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I know that the Security Council had to do something... but I fear it is just an opportunity for Hamas to regroup. They don't "play nice" and they don't listen to anyone's "demand." What is too often forgotten, I think, is that this isn't our granddaddy's war. This isn't one nation against another. This is a terrorist organization. They don't kiss and make up. Oh, they'll most likely lay low and bide their time for a while... maybe a long while, but they're not going to roll over and they're not going to go away.By the way Hamas will ignore anything coming from the UN...! Therefore, Israel must continue the fight!
Me too... but the wars we've known for thousands of years have been nation vs. nation... man vs. man... religion persecution... and this nation/world vs. terrorist organization is new. At least nations can generally play by some of the rules of engagement. This one is so different from even Russia vs. Ukraine... that's two nations no matter what the backstory is or if one side is playing dirty.War on this earth has been going on for thousands of years. And it's naive to believe it will end soon. But I hope so.
I know that the Security Council had to do something... but I fear it is just an opportunity for Hamas to regroup. They don't "play nice" and they don't listen to anyone's "demand." What is too often forgotten, I think, is that this isn't our granddaddy's war. This isn't one nation against another. This is a terrorist organization. They don't kiss and make up. Oh, they'll most likely lay low and bide their time for a while... maybe a long while, but they're not going to roll over and they're not going to go away.
If we had such terrorists attacking Americans in California, you can bet the USA would enter Mexico and kill terrorist while chasing them away from our border. If Mexico did not stand and protect our border from being attacked, I bet we would occupy part of Mexico to stop access to our borders. This area could become a permanent occupation if it was necessary! It is not about the land; it is about the security...whatever it takes!The fundamental issue is whether one see's the opposition are anything better than terrorists. I won't link to the videos of children posting videos in the hope it will protect their family, only to all die due to the israeli incursion. And you will see, israel will use this as an excuse to grab land. It goes beyond Hamas.
Weren't the Crusades examples of what you're talking about here? French, German, Italian and English knights who travelled to the ME to wreak havoc and mayhem and kill those who weren't Christians? So much killing in the name of Jesus who said 'the meek shall inherit the earth' among other things. Bizarre what has been done in the name of religion. Always reminds me of that Carl Sagan video, The Best Speech About Humanity, otherwise known as 'The Pale Blue Dot'."I think it is so sick that they use their religion to justify murdering people who aren't members of their religion."
Not only is is sick HoneyNut...it's downright blasphemous! Islam forbids the killing of innocents and suicide is also a major sin, as is using Allah's (God's) name to justify their heinous actions. So suicide bombers are committing three major sins. And those fools think they will see paradise! These terrorists groups are the main reason people hate Muslims and Islamaphobia is so prevalent! I hate that this is the case and hate those groups!
Islam does not allow killing innocents
People need to take things into context, however. Centuries ago, talk of fighting and killing came about because Muslims faced holy wars from those who rose up against them to keep them from practicing our religion peacefully. So they fought to protect their families and their right to religious freedom. Many Muslim lives were lost. I think many know that there have also been holy wars involving non-Muslims throughout history.
In the case of Israel, it's also about the land. Without a doubt. That's exactly why they're encouraging people to emigrate there with their Birthright Israel trips among young people and giving Palestinian homes to new Jewish immigrants when they arrive or allowing settlers to take over the 1967 lands supposedly set aside for Palestinians. And exactly why some of those government hawks are talking about taking over Gaza and allowing settlers back on that land too! Can you imagine 2.5 million people squeezed into even less land than Gaza is right now?If we had such terrorists attacking Americans in California, you can bet the USA would enter Mexico and kill terrorist while chasing them away from our border. If Mexico did not stand and protect our border from being attacked, I bet we would occupy part of Mexico to stop access to our borders. This area could become a permanent occupation if it was necessary! It is not about the land; it is about the security...whatever it takes!
If we had such terrorists attacking Americans in California, you can bet the USA would enter Mexico and kill terrorist while chasing them away from our border. If Mexico did not stand and protect our border from being attacked, I bet we would occupy part of Mexico to stop access to our borders. This area could become a permanent occupation if it was necessary! It is not about the land; it is about the security...whatever it takes!
So why did Hamas attack on Oct 7?And you will see, israel will use this as an excuse to grab land. It goes beyond Hamas.
The current situation in Palestine is NOT simply about security. And what is going on now goes beyond demands for security. It's been obvious from the beginning. Civilians are reported to be starving to death this morning. You don't starve women and children to death for your own security.
One thing that gets lost in the shuffle is that Oct.7th wasn't when all this started. It all started back in 1948 and has just gotten worse and worse leading up to Oct.7th. That 'pretty good ceasefire' still left the Palestinians with minimal food, water and medical care and no hope for a real future for their families.So why did Hamas attack on Oct 7?
I don’t understand. If a person or group is concerned that people are not eating well, you provide food for them. You don't build underground tunnels and bunkers, stockpile weapons of war, and then blow up what was a pretty good cease fire.
Why did Hamas attack if it’s so obvious Israel would use it as an excuse to grab land?
And why don’t starving grown men count as victims of this war?
Why has Hamas stopped having democratic elections after they came to power?
Why don’t the people who want a new government in Israel also demand a new democratic government in Gaza?
I absolutely agree with your points Debrah. And obviously the rest of the world is starting to also and they are speaking out about it. Very true that pointing out that women and children are casualties will tug at the heart strings. And hopefully Washington would not bomb and otherwise kill off innocent civilians just to root out a dangerous gang. It is also true that Hamas has not done right by the Palestinian people. But do people really expect a terrorist group to have that mindset?! What they are doing is so wrong on all levels.One thing that gets lost in the shuffle is that Oct.7th wasn't when all this started. It all started back in 1948 and has just gotten worse and worse leading up to Oct.7th. That 'pretty good ceasefire' still left the Palestinians with minimal food, water and medical care and no hope for a real future for their families.
I heard another fellow suggest that with the Abraham Accords that were arranged during the Trump administration, Hamas was beginning to worry that the Palestinians plight was being glossed over and ignored.
The Abraham Accords have nothing in them for the Palestinians according to an article I read. That agreement if accepted provides for trade and peace and safe travel between Israel and all the other Arab nations in the region but no mention is made of the Palestinians, where they can be safe, how they can move forward, etc. So that attack was something of a reminder that Israel is not in complete control I would guess. And they probably didn't expect to see so many in the Israeli administration and supporters, publicly suggesting once again taking over Gaza (to the further detriment of the Palestinians).
As far as the men suffering, they are counted, but let's face it, the people of the world are more likely to have their heart strings tugged on if you mention women and especially all the little kids suffering because of this.
It's quite obvious that Hamas was not seeking to set up a legitimate, democratic country within a country so to speak. It was purely a power grab by a terrorist group. And that is why there haven't been elections again since 2006. And while everyone outside of Gaza (and I'm sure a lot of Palestinians inside Gaza) would like to see a real governing body that works to make the people's life better in that tiny region, Hamas is not going to just turn over a new leaf and become that. So Israel is right to want to root them out, but I think they are going about it in a way that is designed to cause casualties among the civilians.
If LA was suddenly taken over by gang violence, would Washington send in the military and bomb that region to rubble? Not likely. They'd infiltrate, spy, take out individuals, force them to talk about their partners in crime.... And the innocent civilians would be protected so that there'd be a city after the effort was ended. History is going to look back very harshly on this whole catastrophe.
I think Israel is making a huge mistake in another way that they probably didn't expect and that is that they are losing the support of allies. I saw a video that showed a recent Gallup poll regarding the question of 'if Israel hasn't gone too far this time' (or something to that effect), and in the USA at least, the numbers are changing.I absolutely agree with your points Debrah. And obviously the rest of the world is starting to also and they are speaking out about it. Very true that pointing out that women and children are casualties will tug at the heart strings. And hopefully Washington would not bomb and otherwise kill off innocent civilians just to root out a dangerous gang. It is also true that Hamas has not done right by the Palestinian people. But do people really expect a terrorist group to have that mindset?! What they are doing is so wrong on all levels.
But Netanyahu is not without fault either. From the day he and his administration ignored the intel (I still want to know why) to sending the Palestinians south....then destroying the area(s) they were sent to, then on and on, it has led to terrorism in yet another form. Something is rotten and it ain't in Denmark!