Some see Mangione as a hero?

I think he's become a folk hero because he took out the CEO of an agency who who legally murders people every day by denying their claims and treatment. If health care is allowed to hurt us / kill us so, haven't we the right to self defense? He made people aware of the level of corruption here. That in and of itself is something. People matter. Not just millionaire billionaire health industry CEOs.
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Mangione is more of a hero than Daniel Penny is.

How many people did Brian Thompson hurt compared to how many hurt by Jordan Neely? At the very least, the severity of hurt caused by Thompson is atrocious.
 
ohioboy said:
It not only amazes me but also makes me sick to my stomach how people have been idolizing a cold blooded murderer. :mad:
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Same thing with those two brothers in California .

I said it about that case, and I will say it again here. We[as a nation] do not have a law/laws, in place that allow for revenge , which it appears what might have been the cause here.
 
I almost remember the name of that New York subway killer from pre-internet years way back when I was in my 30s, who hung out on lonely platforms, and when muggers threatened him, he would shoot them. He was an icon for years, and caused a lot of debate. He was convicted of murder, but he's probably out of jail by now. I don't remember anyone feeling sorry for the muggers.
 
fuzzybuddy said:
I would not put money on Mangione's conviction. After seeing him, ranting away as cops bring him into the station. I think there will be a John Hinkley, Jr. type defense.
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I've wondered if that ranting is part of a strategy to bring attention to unethical insurance practices, or if he's suddenly in a panic after his arrest. It seemed to me, he made little effort to avoid arrest. No matter what defense his lawyer comes up with, I'm doubtful I will ever actually know the precise purpose of his actions beyond the killing.
 
JustDave said:
I almost remember the name of that New York subway killer from pre-internet years way back when I was in my 30s, who hung out on lonely platforms, and when muggers threatened him, he would shoot them. He was an icon for years, and caused a lot of debate. He was convicted of murder, but he's probably out of jail by now. I don't remember anyone feeling sorry for the muggers.
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Bernhard Goetz
 
rgp said:
Same thing with those two brothers in California .

I said it about that case, and I will say it again here. We[as a nation] do not have a law/laws, in place that allow for revenge , which it appears what might have been the cause here.
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True. I wonder if someone killed a CEO of a tobacco company because of how many people died a year from smoking, would they be a hero?
 
ohioboy said:
True. I wonder if someone killed a CEO of a tobacco company because of how many people died a year from smoking, would they be a hero?
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The difference in that scenario is, tabacco is purely a luxury item. You can choose to not smoke. Whereas you can't choose to not have health insurance; it's a necessity. Granted, you can go without insurance and then face enormous debt and pain and suffering from untreated illnesses and injuries if something happens to you.
 
This subject of Billionaires is top news now. The new cabinet for the new administration is worth $375 billion. Is this using mega-rich backers for positions that will give them power to cut spending on public services? This seems to be on everyone's mind. A bunch of billionaires making policy would be a lot different if they had average incomes I bet. It feels like these decisions will be made with impunity in regards to the general public. So much will affect the masses, and these policies will be advantageous to the haves, not the have nots. This murder was because of this injustice. :(
 
HermitHogan said:
The difference in that scenario is, tabacco is purely a luxury item. You can choose to not smoke. Whereas you can't choose to not have health insurance; it's a necessity. Granted, you can go without insurance and then face enormous debt and pain and suffering from untreated illnesses and injuries if something happens to you.
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We are talking about anger and revenge, regardless of causation. The law, moral or legal, does not justify his killing. What if that was your son that was murdered, would you support Mangione?
 
Paco Dennis said:
I wonder if the defense will be allowed to submit anecdotal evidence of clients that have been royally screwed in the recent past?
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I think the judge will contain as much of that as possible. With the media this case is getting, I don't think the defense needs to bring it up, not that it matters from a legal standpoint. As it comes to trial, the media will describe motives, so this isn't going to sleep anytime soon.

Edit: Now that I think about it, isn't motive considered evidence? On crime shows, the DA seems to be concerned about motive a lot, like it's important. I actually think that's important evidence too. But motive doesn't necessarily exonerate. It helps to convict. Good question.
 
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JustDave said:
I think the judge will contain as much of that as possible. With the media this case is getting, I don't think the defense needs to bring it up, not that it matters from a legal standpoint. As it comes to trial, the media will describe motives, so this isn't going to sleep anytime soon.

Edit: Now that I think about it, isn't motive considered evidence? On crime shows, the DA seems to be concerned about motive a lot, like it's important. I actually think that's important evidence too. But motive doesn't necessarily exonerate. It helps to convict. Good question.
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From his manifesto, the motive is clear, but is never required to prove guilt. Would it help in any case, sure.
 
This is absurd. We know the US healthcare system is a mess. But all insurance companies deny claims. If they didn't, they would be bankrupt within a week. Medicare denies many claims, as do other state run health systems.
 
ohioboy said:
We are talking about anger and revenge, regardless of causation. The law, moral or legal, does not justify his killing. What if that was your son that was murdered, would you support Mangione?
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While it's true that statutory laws prohibit the killing of someone like Brian Thompson, an argument could be made that it may be morally justified.

When someone is causing enormous harm to society, such as with Thompson, and there don't seem to be any effective avenues of redress, isn't it to be expected that some blood will be spilled?

What if your son died because he wasn't able to receive treatment for a curable illness due to UnitedHealthcare's business practices? They wanted to increase their profits and paying for treatment wasn't cost effective, so your son died. Would you think that Thompson's murder was justified in that case?
 
HermitHogan said:
What if your son died because he wasn't able to receive treatment for a curable illness due to UnitedHealthcare's business practices? They wanted to increase their profits and paying for treatment wasn't cost effective, so your son died. Would you think that Thompson's murder was justified in that case?
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And just who in particular would I blame? If the claim rises to the third review, and still denied, how many people must die?
 
NO! And being the head does not impute legal or moral justification to be murdered. Responsible for my son's death? If he was personally directly presented with the actual medical facts, assuming he could approve it by the evidence, and then did not. Yes I would say he was responsible. Here I am assuming arguendo, all the facts are in my favor for debate purposes here. I still would not murder him. Does A CEO personally review every single claim filed?
 
I think it's a sign of how degraded our moral compass is (along with another recent event) that someone who committed cold blooded murder is being praised as a hero. I understand being totally frustrated and angry even, with what the healthcare industry does to patients in need of care, but this young man took it too far. One big problem with that is that there will be copycats. Even though no one else has carried out the threats yet, including a woman who was arrested, insurance workers have been getting death threats. Praising Luigi for his actions will only encourage copycats.
 

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