A Basic Income for Every Adult

David777 said:
I am greatly enjoying, that recent news (political so will avoid at depth) shows US politicians are actually starting to talk about clamping down on Wall Street real estate corporations and their financial banks, that as undeserving greedy outsiders, for years have been skewering the rest of us, effectively stealing our incomes, despite not being the source of wealth like foul parasites they are. A prime reason, so many of those at the lower end, increasingly need income help.

Of course, newspapers stories from their media puppets are in a frenzy now, given the prospect they will be shut out from their inconsiderate, selfish, feeding frenzy.
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IMO that is just smoke and mirrors, nobody is going to ever kill a cash cow.
 

SeaBreeze said:
The money has to come from taxpayers, citizens who have worked for years and had money taken out of their paychecks for taxes, and pay taxes for all their purchases, etc. I think that people need to take some responsibility for themselves and their families in America, not just sit back and wait for the nanny government to dole out our hard earned tax dollars to those not willing to help themselves...bad example for the youth growing up also.

The poor shouldn't be in jails, unless they are criminals committing crimes. I don't think the poor are to be thought of as mentally ill either, so why would they be in psychiatric hospitals? :confused: Also, why would everyone get the $2800, even the richest that do not need it at all, that doesn't make any sense either.

I think that people who are willing to work, will find a way to become employed, but that desire needs to be present. Why would they even bother to be responsible and work for a living if they were handed checks for doing absolutely nothing. Maybe if the poor would actually spend the money they're given on health insurance, food and "necessary" clothing, it wouldn't be so bad. But, I've known of people, way back in the day, who traded their food stamps for cigarettes, alcohol and drugs. The welfare check is spent on cell phones, name brand clothing, manicures, etc...instead of diapers for the baby, health insurance, etc. etc.

I'm against it, my mother told me long ago that there was no free lunch. This nation will spiral downwards even faster with more free money gifts going to those who do not deserve it, or are not willing to help themselves. 💵
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Right on! You totally nailed it, thanks.
 
This solves nothing.... never will. many not all are in situations because of personal choices.
It would be same if a basic income some would spend wisely and provide basics others it would be gone before the day it is deposited. some the cushion may help them with their finances and be a step up.

This approach has been tried in many places. The results I find in reading articles is dependent on who sponsored the study.
Below is a study of 2 years in Finland. The title sums it up.

Basic income experiment stuns, finds NO IMPACT on crime rates, shaking poverty-crime link: study​

"Using comprehensive administrative data on police reports and district court trials, we estimate precise zero effects on criminal perpetration and victimization."
Basic income experiment stuns, finds NO IMPACT on crime rates, shaking poverty-crime link: study
 

A basic income for everyone is an utopian dream of Socialists and Communists, which never will happen. We would need a society in which everyone gets a work for the earnings. The problem are so many (not only) young people who want to work but don't get a job. The second problem is fair wages. Give everyone who works enough money that he or she can live from it.

But don't feed the lazy with a basic income!
 
Irishdude said:
By the way, we are close to $40 trillion in debt, so someone explain how this would be financed. And please don't say "taxes on billionaires."
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That's the question I'd have, too.

I wonder how it works in countries that already have it..
(possibly mentioned in an earlier post that I didn't see.)
 
Jeni said:
This solves nothing.... never will. many not all are in situations because of personal choices.
It would be same if a basic income some would spend wisely and provide basics others it would be gone before the day it is deposited. some the cushion may help them with their finances and be a step up.

This approach has been tried in many places. The results I find in reading articles is dependent on who sponsored the study.
Below is a study of 2 years in Finland. The title sums it up.

Basic income experiment stuns, finds NO IMPACT on crime rates, shaking poverty-crime link: study​

"Using comprehensive administrative data on police reports and district court trials, we estimate precise zero effects on criminal perpetration and victimization."
Basic income experiment stuns, finds NO IMPACT on crime rates, shaking poverty-crime link: study
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Not surprising- people don't commit crimes because they're poor.. people commit crimes because they're criminals!
 
George1959 said:
A basic income for everyone is an utopian dream of Socialists and Communists, which never will happen. We would need a society in which everyone gets a work for the earnings. The problem are so many (not only) young people who want to work but don't get a job. The second problem is fair wages. Give everyone who works enough money that he or she can live from it.

But don't feed the lazy with a basic income!
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Too many individuals get those terms mixed up..
The 'communist' approach is essentially everybody who isn't dead should be working. In a previous location, I was looking through a little leaflet that was left in a phone booth.. thought I was going to 🤮
 
Sunkist said:
Not surprising- people don't commit crimes because they're poor.. people commit crimes because they're criminals!
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Hm no during WWII when there was a huge famin in Holland I've heard stories like a parent would steal some potatoes from their stingy fatzo neighbour to feed their kids and what about Jews they hid? Everyone got coupons, but Jews didn't, so the resistance would steal coupons. But now indeed it's nonsense to steal food when you can simply take it from the garbage behind a supermarket. It's illegal, but I don't see that as a crime.

This guy asked women on the street out for a fancy dinner from the trash can. One girl said yes.

 
When AI does away with 80% of the jobs the Uber rich elites will hoard all of the additional wealth for themselves with the great unwashed masses starve.
Irishdude said:
By the way, we are close to $40 trillion in debt, so someone explain how this would be financed. And please don't say "taxes on billionaires."
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Taxes on multi millionaires and billionaires.

Either that or when AI does away with 80% of the jobs the uber rich elites will hoard all of the additional wealth for themselves while the great unwashed masses go hungry. And hungry people are dangerous.

 
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Dr.Colosso said:
Hm no during WWII when there was a huge famin in Holland I've heard stories like a parent would steal some potatoes from their stingy fatzo neighbour to feed their kids and what about Jews they hid? Everyone got coupons, but Jews didn't, so the resistance would steal coupons. But now indeed it's nonsense to steal food when you can simply take it from the garbage behind a supermarket. It's illegal, but I don't see that as a crime.

This guy asked women on the street out for a fancy dinner from the trash can. One girl said yes.

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I don't know what was going on there, but during WW2 the individuals I referred to were in various parts of the U.S.

On a side note- something confusing in some of your posts- where are you from/located?
 
Trade said:
When AI does away with 80% of the jobs the Uber rich elites will hoard all of the additional wealth for themselves with the great unwashed masses starve.


Taxes on multi millionaires and billionaires.

Either that or when AI does away with 80% of the jobs the uber rich elites will hoard all of the additional wealth for themselves while the great unwashed masses go hungry. And hungry people are dangerous.

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I don't know.
If you get a famin and war and there are no groceries to buy, what use are their billions and will the poor guy who grows some vegetables help them?

From AI:
money's value relies on a stable society and the availability of goods, which collapse during extreme scarcity like a famine, shifting value to essential resources like food, water, and barter, as fiat money loses its agreed-upon worth when basic survival needs are paramount. During a famine, the time value of money becomes irrelevant; a dollar can't buy food if food isn't available, making direct resources far more valuable than currency, highlighting money's function as a medium of exchange that breaks down without underlying production.
Why Money Loses Value in a Famine:
  • Breakdown of Trust: Money (especially fiat money) holds value because people agree it does, acting as a medium of exchange. In a famine, this social contract breaks down as survival becomes the priority.
  • Shift to Intrinsic Value: Goods with intrinsic value (food, medicine, tools) become paramount, while money, which has little intrinsic value, becomes secondary or useless.
  • Barter Economy Emerges: People resort to bartering, exchanging goods directly (e.g., a tool for food) because money can't guarantee access to essentials.
  • Hyperinflation/Worthlessness: If money is still in circulation, its purchasing power plummets as people hoard real goods, essentially becoming worthless for acquiring necessities.
Historical & Modern Context:
  • Historical Examples: Events like the Russian Revolution or Zimbabwe's hyperinflation showed money becoming useless as goods disappeared.
  • Biblical Parallels: Stories like Joseph in Egypt (Genesis 41:36) highlight saving physical food reserves for famine, a tangible alternative to monetary savings.
In essence, money is a proxy for wealth, but in a true crisis, it fails as a universal medium, and direct access to survival resources becomes the ultimate currency.
 
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I’m not sure that it would cost much if we rethink some of the traditional benefits that we’ve become used to.

If the guaranteed income replaced things like the income tax standard deduction, childcare tax credits, food stamps, welfare, social security disability, unemployment insurance etc…

I do however believe that it would be inflationary, fraught with fraud and abuse, and never be enough.
 
Sunkist said:
That's the question I'd have, too.

I wonder how it works in countries that already have it..
(possibly mentioned in an earlier post that I didn't see.)
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I see a lot of stuff about Switzerland taking care of it's people - a basic income as needed kind of thing. Most places that have something akin to this seem to be a LOT smaller than the USA and strict on their immigration policies.

Places like Sweden seem to be changing their rules due to too much immigration, now you have to work to get benefits.

Elon Musk keeps talking about this as a solution after AI / automation takes all the jobs --- but like a few here, I can not imagine our government (USA) doing a good job of this and ole richest man Elon never says WHERE the money will come from........
 
Some places they are trying UBI. Here is the results so far in Kenya.

The GiveDirectly program in Kenya is the world’s largest and longest-running study of Universal Basic Income. Launched in 2017 and scheduled to run until 2028, it provides a unique "laboratory" for understanding how unconditional cash changes lives over a decade.

As of early 2026, several key findings have emerged regarding its impact on employment, poverty, and the local economy.

1. Impact on Work: "The Idleness Myth"​

One of the most significant findings is the debunking of the "laziness" concern.

  • No Decrease in Labor: Researchers found no evidence that recipients stopped working or became "idle."
  • Shifting Work Types: Instead of working less, people changed how they worked. There was a notable shift from low-wage, manual labor (like agricultural "ganyu" work) toward self-employment and entrepreneurship.
  • Entrepreneurship Boom: In villages receiving long-term payments, the number of small businesses increased by roughly 34%. Business revenues saw even more dramatic jumps, with some reports showing a nearly 100% increase in net revenue for recipient-owned enterprises.

2. Poverty and Financial Resilience​

The program acts as both a "floor" (safety net) and a "ladder" (investment capital).

  • Food Security: Long-term recipients saw a 10% increase in food consumption and improved nutrition, specifically in protein intake.
  • Psychological Well-being: There was a 17% decrease in depression rates. The "mental bandwidth" freed up by not worrying about survival allowed parents to focus more on their children’s education and long-term planning.
  • Asset Growth: Households invested heavily in "hard assets" like metal roofs (replacing thatch), livestock, and bicycles, which are used as motorbike taxis (bodaboda).

3. The "Multiplier Effect" on the Economy​

The study measured not just the recipients, but the entire local ecosystem.

  • The 2.5x Multiplier: For every $1 given to a poor household, the local economy grew by roughly $2.50. This happened because recipients spent their money at local shops, who then hired more staff or bought more stock, creating a "flywheel" of economic activity.
  • Inflation: Despite a massive influx of cash (sometimes exceeding 15% of local GDP), local inflation remained remarkably low—averaging only 0.1%. Local supply chains were able to expand quickly enough to meet the new demand.

4. Lump Sum vs. Monthly Payments​

The Kenya study is unique because it compares different delivery methods:

  • Lump Sums ($500 at once): Best for "escaping" poverty. These allowed people to make major investments (like buying a cow or a motorcycle) that immediately increased their earning potential.
  • Monthly Payments ($22/month): Best for "stability." These were more effective at improving day-to-day nutrition and reducing the stress of seasonal income fluctuations.
 
Paco Dennis said:
Some places they are trying UBI. Here is the results so far in Kenya.

The GiveDirectly program in Kenya is the world’s largest and longest-running study of Universal Basic Income. Launched in 2017 and scheduled to run until 2028, it provides a unique "laboratory" for understanding how unconditional cash changes lives over a decade.

As of early 2026, several key findings have emerged regarding its impact on employment, poverty, and the local economy.

1. Impact on Work: "The Idleness Myth"​

One of the most significant findings is the debunking of the "laziness" concern.

  • No Decrease in Labor: Researchers found no evidence that recipients stopped working or became "idle."
  • Shifting Work Types: Instead of working less, people changed how they worked. There was a notable shift from low-wage, manual labor (like agricultural "ganyu" work) toward self-employment and entrepreneurship.
  • Entrepreneurship Boom: In villages receiving long-term payments, the number of small businesses increased by roughly 34%. Business revenues saw even more dramatic jumps, with some reports showing a nearly 100% increase in net revenue for recipient-owned enterprises.

2. Poverty and Financial Resilience​

The program acts as both a "floor" (safety net) and a "ladder" (investment capital).

  • Food Security: Long-term recipients saw a 10% increase in food consumption and improved nutrition, specifically in protein intake.
  • Psychological Well-being: There was a 17% decrease in depression rates. The "mental bandwidth" freed up by not worrying about survival allowed parents to focus more on their children’s education and long-term planning.
  • Asset Growth: Households invested heavily in "hard assets" like metal roofs (replacing thatch), livestock, and bicycles, which are used as motorbike taxis (bodaboda).

3. The "Multiplier Effect" on the Economy​

The study measured not just the recipients, but the entire local ecosystem.

  • The 2.5x Multiplier: For every $1 given to a poor household, the local economy grew by roughly $2.50. This happened because recipients spent their money at local shops, who then hired more staff or bought more stock, creating a "flywheel" of economic activity.
  • Inflation: Despite a massive influx of cash (sometimes exceeding 15% of local GDP), local inflation remained remarkably low—averaging only 0.1%. Local supply chains were able to expand quickly enough to meet the new demand.

4. Lump Sum vs. Monthly Payments​

The Kenya study is unique because it compares different delivery methods:

  • Lump Sums ($500 at once): Best for "escaping" poverty. These allowed people to make major investments (like buying a cow or a motorcycle) that immediately increased their earning potential.
  • Monthly Payments ($22/month): Best for "stability." These were more effective at improving day-to-day nutrition and reducing the stress of seasonal income fluctuations.
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That's interesting!
I do believe there'd be more benefits than drawbacks.
 

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