Are we in the beginning of the next Great Depression?

QuickSilver said:
Do you not believe a person should be able to Will their money to their heirs? OR.. since no heirs have earned it.. maybe we should make all inheritance illegal and simply transfer all our money to the government when we die.
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:lol1::clap:
 

fishfulthinking said:
there will be an obvious strain put on our seniors care, housing, and health due to the mass called the "baby boomers" here. I feel our Canadian government is ill prepared. Seniors will be victims.
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This will certainly happen in the future. As more are living longer, and the younger peoples wages remain stagnant, our social programs are going to become increasingly stressed. Here, in the U.S., Medicare will be the first program to feel the pinch....probably within the next 8 or 10 years. Governments just keep pushing these issues further down the road, with no long term plans for adjusting for demographics.
 

Don M. said:
This will certainly happen in the future. As more are living longer, and the younger peoples wages remain stagnant, our social programs are going to become increasingly stressed. Here, in the U.S., Medicare will be the first program to feel the pinch....probably within the next 8 or 10 years. Governments just keep pushing these issues further down the road, with no long term plans for adjusting for demographics.
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yes with the onslaught of ~71 million over the next 20 or so years hitting the "senior" age, it's going to get painful. I know in this city we have a serious lack of senior's housing. Both assisted and independent, so where does this leave the seniors who can't live in their own homes? I know we have a huge strain already on our hospitals, and our health care is going to be hit hard as these "boomer/seniors age. Old age pension is barely covering food, never mind rent/mortgage payments (lets face it not all seniors are going to be mortgage free) and health care (outside of what our healthcare covers and worse for those in the USA). Nobody wants to hire a senior so what about programs for seniors oh right, our Canadian government would rather legalize pot. Perhaps it will just be a bunch of pot smoking old folks out there in another few years.
 
fishfulthinking said:
there will be an obvious strain put on our seniors care, housing, and health due to the mass called the "baby boomers" here. I feel our Canadian government is ill prepared. Seniors will be victims.
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I have a question for our non-American members.. Who pays for Seniors long term care in nursing homes?
 
The answer depends on the means of the individual senior.

There is a government subsidy for most, and the level of subsidy depends on the level of care - high dependency beds attract the highest level of subsidy in line with the extra cost of the care.

The resident is required to make a co-payment, again depending on their means. For people without assets such as a home of their own whose only income is the aged pension, the co-payment is 85% of the pension, The remaining 15% is for personal expenses. My auntie was one of these. My mother on the other hand was better off. She had two income sources - Dad's state superannuation pension which continued after his death for the rest of her life and a part aged pension. Her co-payment was higher than 85% of the full pension but she still had enough left over for her personal needs and to pay for private health insurance.

Her house was sold and most of the cash assets were then deposited as an accommodation bond with the care provider. They were entitled to keep the interest on the bond plus they were allowed to take up to $13,500 over 5 years in 6 monthly installments. It was this income from the accommodation bonds that was used to fund new beds and up grades to older facilities.

When she died, what was left was returned to her estate.

This system works well. All care providers receiving government subsidy are required to make available a certain number of beds for poorer pensioners.
 
Finally, a serious look at how granny's care should be paid for that is fair to granny and the government. We should look at adopting this system...
 
I agree.. Granny SHOULD be required to have some cost.. but seriously, NH care is around $5000 a month.. Our system requires those with some assets to pay the full amount, until they have nothing. It doesn't take long before everything granny has saved over the years is gone.. Is it a wonder granny tries to hide her assets? As I said.. this is nothing more than a systematic transfer of wealth from the middle class up to the top.
 
No, it is a systematic transfer of money to children who didn't earn it and shouldn't be entitled to it...
 
Ralphy1 said:
No, it is a systematic transfer of money to children who didn't earn it and shouldn't be entitled to it...
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That's Bull$hit and you know it. Better the Uber wealthy get it to transfer their billions to their entitled spoiled brats like Paris Hilton who do NOTHING.. than for average people to inherit their parents small nest eggs by comparison... People who would use it to educate their kids.. and other useful things. Blow it Ralphy. You are just baiting now... and you know it. Since when did you become a shill for the "for Profit" health industry?
 
Not baiting, just continuing to force people to look at their complicity in making all of us pay for their mom or granny. Continuing to point the finger at others, who should be regulated better, does not absolve them...
 
She is only a victim of her greedy children or her own lack of concern for the taxpayer who will foot her bill...
 
For my mothers case, she lived into her nineties but when in her late 70's, while living in a elder shelter place after selling her house, she fell and could no longer live independently. So my sister took mom to several places and helped her decide on which to take. It was a nice place, built for such use and designed properly.

To get in mom had to give her SS, insurances, banks accounts, and become poor. That meant that some money she had set aside to distribute to the five kids was gone too. No biggie at all, just a fact. So that was something that should have been set aside without her name on it years earlier.

I lived half way across the US but every chance I got I would go visit her. She seemed to enjoy the surroundings and care. Her doctor would come and visit on a frequent schedule. I was there one afternoon when he walked in. A pretty nice man to talk to.

They were fed well, accommodated well, had frequent laundry and fresh sheets on a schedule. They were taken into the shower frequently. Occasionally they had trips on the homes buses to go see the 'colors' of the fall, or blossoms of spring. It was in general a very nice place for all. There was on section for those of mental failures where they were kept locked in with supervisors to care for them.

I was pleased for her keeping and had no problems that she had to become technically poor in order to be able to enter. At her age in the 80's I doubt that the never exposed amount she had set aside for the five of us was really too great. If anyone was wrong it was her financial adviser that did not make sure she distributed prior to the cut off date. Knowing that mom and dad grew up through the depression, 2 world wars, days when houses were in the below $10,000 prices but now selling for higher that $100,000 (same house), 5 kids, any thing they had set aside would be small compared to the current prices of things. Knowing they had our interest in mind was the important thing for me.

She was well cared for, lived to 97, seemed to be OK until her last year or so when we could see her fail.

So for me. Do I blame my mother? Not at all. Do I blame the system? No. She did quite well within the system. Should things be changed? Maybe. Depends on how it might be changed. Nothing should be changed to where nobody has to plan ahead. Everybody gets to have the same care for free is wrong. Too many variables that need sorted out. But how?

Wealthy can afford to hide wealth, the lower income can not. Not a healthy way to go. How do we get the lower income folks to set aside funds for after they retire by choice or by law? No way. No guarantee that all will live alike while working or in retirement. Really don't want that type of government to be in charge either. I see no place in this world where all can live alike except in pure poverty conditions. We don't really want that to be the only way for all to live.
 
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Still don't understand why you think the kids should get some assets while others have to pay for mom's care. This has eluded this conversation and continues to do so. However, I appreciate your family's story and I will share one with you. Yesterday I made a visit to my demented sister who lives in the grandest nursing home in the state and it reminds me of an elegant hotel. She and her late husband did very well and had well over two million in assets. She had to promise the home so much up front before they transferred her to Medicaid, and I am not privy to the amount. However, she got about two million out of her name which was split between adult children now in their fifties and are doing very well The only difference in her great care, and almost constant entertainment, is that she has to share a room whereas before she had a private one. I have told my relatives that this is wrong, as the guy cleaning the toilets in the place is helping to,pay fort their mother's care, but this falls on deaf ears...
 
Ralphy1 said:
Still don't understand why you think the kids should get some assets while others have to pay for mom's care. This has eluded this conversation and continues to do so. However, I appreciate your family's story and I will share one with you. Yesterday I made a visit to my demented sister who lives in the grandest nursing home in the state and it reminds me of an elegant hotel. She and her late husband did very well and had well over two million in assets. She had to promise the home so much up front before they transferred her to Medicaid, and I am not privy to the amount. However, she got about two million out of her name which was split between adult children now in their fifties and are doing very well The only difference in her great care, and almost constant entertainment, is that she has to share a room whereas before she had a private one. I have told my relatives that this is wrong, as the guy cleaning the toilets in the place is helping to,pay fort their mother's care, but this falls on deaf ears...
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For beginners, you quote me wrongly. I never said we kids deserved to get inheritance at all. I commented that it was my mothers advisers that failed to advise her to do that. All of us are doing OK on our own ways of working, investing, saving, insurance plans, and hopes to be able to finish our lives at home, even if sick. Big problem these days is that without family living close by it may not be possible to do as in the older days, family took over the care of the sick and helpless. My mother took in her father and tended him when he became helpless. He died in her home. Now that would be a big relief for the government if we fell back on those older ways of doing things. And yes, after many years of tending for herself after dad died, she did end up sharing a room. It did not seem to bother her one bit.

Those rules are intended to keep the well to do ones from ripping off the government taxpayers inputs when not needed. I guess in some ways it works but in other ways not so much. Things to consider to be changed. Seems that the very rich could be able to purchase a insurance plan that would eliminate all the selling and such and just have a decent retirement that includes medical help at the same time. My older brother was one that had such a insurance for himself and his wife in Texas. I went to visit him and his wife for their 50th anniversary. It was a fine residence where people were living, coming and going, quite freely. If they became handicapped they would be taken care of. If they became sick they would be moved to a healthy care part of the operation and would have access to daily watching, doctors, transport to hospitals, funerals could be arranged. Quite an operation going their. Wish I had my brothers arrangements but he was much better paid than many of us. He worked for the US government agencies for many years and had gone up the pay scale for quite a bit more pocket money and personal improvements like access to such insurances.

I am happy with what I have been able to do for myself, wife, and kids. Myself and my son and daughter also worked for the government, but it was called military duty. My older brother also worked military in Korea times but then he got an opportunity to work in the political types of government work like FAA.
 
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One can stay at home with supportive services coming in if they can afford them, such as a maid service, Meals on Wheels, etc. However, dementia makes that impossible. Long term care insurance has to be bought at a fairly young and is very expensive. A facility that will take you from independent living to nursing home care is one that you mentioned, but you must provide the facility with a small fortune. May we all die in our sleep before we have to face leaving our homes...
 
Absolutely, as I have two older sisters with dementia. I seemed to have not been fated for dementia (fingers tightly crossed) and want to stay where I am hiring a minimum amount of help at some point, and living in a condo means that I don't have to worry about taking care of the outside of the building or the grounds, though I have done a lot of gardening in the past and supervise the help on the trimming and pruning of the shrubs and trees that I have put in over the years with the approval of the condo board. So, as long as I can dress and bath myself, I want to live, but when I can't, I hope to be gone, one way or another...
 
I firmly believe that there is no point anticipating something unless by doing so we can make a positive difference. My family history would indicate that if I don't have a fatal heart attack or stroke I will probably descend gradually into senile dementia. It doesn't actually worry me because I've travelled that journey already with my mum and mother in law. It's not as bad as we imagine provided the care is good.

If you are worried I suggest that you start looking around at available facilities to educate yourself about the standards of care. Talk to your doctor too because you could be worrying excessively about your likely future.

Your plan to stay where you are is a sound one. Take advantage of any help that you need and enjoy every day as it comes.
 
I have also been visiting nursing homes over the years starting with my mother, who spent several years in one after breaking a hip in her eighties. I noticed then, and it holds true today, that there are few men there, as our life expectancy is much lower, thank goodness. I have no desire to wind up in one with the best of care, and it couldn't be any better than my sister's. If I have the courage, I will self deliver should I face a lingering and totally dependent end...
 
Thanks, and I enjoy myself to the max as a hedonist, and the visits to the nursing home are just a reminder to do so...
 

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