Race/Racism discussion

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I have posted that I grew up in an all white town then spent about 14 years traveling with the military. I've lived in Eastern N Carolina for 26 years. Eastern N Carolina is integrated. Anywhere you go including banks, grocery stores, school, restaurants there are black people. There is also a large community of Hispanic because of all the farms. A lot of my patients are black. The point is I live, work, communicate with, do business with black people everyday.
About 15 years ago we spent a week in western N Carolina. It was the Asheville, Waynesville, Cherokee area. I was in the grocery store and something just felt weird. Kept shopping and it struck me. There were no black people. None. I went back to our rental and told my husband and we had a chuckle.
For some reason when we went back to New England I didn't notice I guess because that's how it always was. I do notice now and my children notice. My daughter that lives in Atlanta just went up there to a funeral with me. She noticed and also said it was weird.
It's not bad not good just strange.
 

Having read some of the later posts, it strikes me that one way to break down racist thinking is to practise inclusivity everywhere. No more restricted whites only social clubs where Jews and coloureds are never admitted. Invite all the children in your child's class to her birthday parties. Make it illegal to have segregated public swimming pools.

Above all, break bread together. Australian schools in ethnically diverse locations often have days where the children bring a traditional dish to share with the rest of class. We also have a day labelled Harmony Day where all kinds of ethnic culture is displayed and unfamiliar food is available for tasting. Singing and dancing and traditional national costumes are worn.

Just about every Australian school child learns the Seekers song "We are one but we are many" which acknowledges our history and the many countries we have drawn on as our population grew. It highlights inclusivity and me heart swells every time I hear it sung by school children.

https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/seekers/iamaustralian.html
 
applecruncher said:
My purpose in starting this thread about race/racism is to hopefully have some honest, interesting, informative discussion. I'm aware that people of various races are/have been subjected to racism....in some form. This is not just about racism towards blacks in the US. I'd also like to try to clarify what is/is not racist.
If this discussion moves along, I'm going to be sharing some experiences, and I'd like input from others. This is not the applecruncher show.
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I re-read the OP, I'm glad you clarified that, I was starting to wonder. Are there "right" or "wrong" answers/responses here? I noticed several posters [apparently] being chastised for their post comments.
 
I can't blindly agree with/applaud everyone all the time. And if someone doesn't like being asked a simple question it's best they not post.
 
applecruncher said:
I can't blindly agree with/applaud everyone all the time. And if someone doesn't like being asked a simple question it's best they not post.
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Nobody said you had to agree or applaud, but you asked for candid comments from people who might have differing experiences and perspectives. But, a judgmental "finger wag" of disapproval hardly is conducive to advancing the conversation.
 
BobF said:
For you it may be BS, I am speaking of earlier days in Ohio and a bit further west. After 57 years away I am back and doing fine, we have a mixed population here still but no signs of race problem still.

Still not as nice as I remember my westward adventures of California, Nevada, Arizona, New Mexico, and an eastward Florida. Wish I had never moved back to Ohio a year and a half ago.

Of those states I have mentioned I would go back to southern Arizona, New Mexico, but none of the others. My brother livestock in Las Vegas, I have visited there but doubt I would like it. I have visited on different times in the Reno area but again not sure if I would like it there.

Smaller towns seem safer to me.
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BobF when you say you are back do you mean you settled back in the Cleveland area? I haven't been there in quite awhile, and only been to Cincinnati a couple times back when I was working. Quick trips both times.
 
This is such a sensitive subject. I would hate to see someone leave the conversation because they felt bated.
If I sense that when I ask a question I always follow up with "The reason I'm asking is " and a lot of times the reason is completely different from what the person thought.
On the other hand a forum is the best place to be brave and tell your thoughts and get things out in the open. Your comments may be taken out of context but who would now if you back out when it gets a little hot.
No veiled comments, no veiled replies, respect and seeking to understand would be best in my humble opinion.
 
applecruncher said:
BobF when you say you are back do you mean you settled back in the Cleveland area? I haven't been there in quite awhile, and only been to Cincinnati a couple times back when I was working. Quick trips both times.
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No, I am closer to Toledo.

Cincinnati was the first place I remember seeing segregation in public places. I have not been there since my first stop on my way to Ft Knox after joining the army in 1953.
 
Big Horn said:
Some people just won't accept reality.

Take a field trip to an area university where there are large numbers of different races. Wander through the dining areas at lunch time. Note how people form groups.
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So what? My High School was all white and the cliques that were formed were strictly "members only". If you sat down at the wrong table you would get dirty looks from Hell until you got up and left.
 
Trade said:
So what? My High School was all white and the cliques that were formed were strictly "members only". If you sat down at the wrong table you would get dirty looks from Hell until you got up and left.
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@Trade

hmmm. Then my "Rosa Parks of the High School Cafeteria" incident would not have gone over well, huh? :wink:

@Big Horn

Yes, as I already acknowledged people often form groups. But I'm not sure what you're trying to say.
 
applecruncher said:
@Big Horn

Yes, as I already acknowledged people often form groups. But I'm not sure what you're trying to say.
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I think Big Horn is trying to say the perception was that these groups formed because of their color, therefore, white kids felt unwelcome. That unwelcome feeling - unwelcome to chat or even say hello; to extend a hand in friendship - carried over to campus outside the lunchroom.
 
Why white people can’t face up to racism

Robin DiAngelo grew up poor and white. But it was years before she realized that despite living in poverty, she still had privilege because she was white.
“I had a very deep sense of shame and otherness growing up… But I had never looked at how, where in my life did I have an advantage? And where might I have been actually benefiting from the oppression of somebody else?” she says.


DiAngelo has been working on race and social justice issues for more than 20 years as a lecturer, consultant and trainer. She’s the author of the book, What Does It Mean to Be White? Developing White Racial Literacy.

She came to understand her advantage and privilege when she took a job as a diversity trainer. It was eye opening as she worked with mainly white clients who were uncomfortable with having to deal with the issue of race. It was through that work that she developed the concept of “white fragility” to explain why white people have such difficulty in talking about racism.


DiAngelo and I talked about her work and why it is important for white people to have a serious conversation about race in America today.
Here are some excerpts from our conversation.

Q: Let’s talk about white fragility. What is it?
A: If you try to talk to white folks about race in a way that just allows them to assert their opinions and perspectives unchallenged, that tends to go pretty well. But if you push back on it, that tends to go really poorly.

(more)

http://crosscut.com/2017/04/white-fragility-robin-diangelo-race/


 
applecruncher said:
@Trade

hmmm. Then my "Rosa Parks of the High School Cafeteria" incident would not have gone over well, huh? :wink:
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I don't know. High School is brutal even with the race issue. Even at my 50 year reunion the same cliques were for the most part still in effect. Even though I was welcome at a number of tables with my black wife, they were for the most part the "nerd"tables. I could tell I still wasn't welcome at the "cool kids" tables. And I don't think that had anything to do with my wife being black.
 
Congratulations on Being a Good Person, But That Doesn’t Excuse Racism.

[h=3]1. Stop creating false equivalencies.[/h]Saying “Black Lives Matter” does not mean that other lives do not. Standing in opposition to police brutality is not the same as hating all cops. Talking about racism is not the same as an indictment of a person’s character.


[h=3]2. Stop making excuses.[/h]We do not live in a “post-racial society.” Let me burst that bubble for you now. You may work, live and frequent places that have a little diversity, but if that is the case, there is a big world outside of your day-to-day life.


[h=3]3. Stop checking out of the conversation.[/h]Does talking about race make you uncomfortable? Living the realities of racial injustice is not exactly a walk in the park either. Everyone needs to be part of that conversation, no matter how uncomfortable it is. Yes, this includes you.

(full article)

http://educationpost.org/congratulations-on-being-a-good-person-but-that-doesnt-excuse-racism/
 
Shalimar said:
I think in order for people to be able to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps they must have boots.
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No that's not how it works. If one million salmon make it up a river to spawn every year, and then we build a dam on the river and the next year only 8 salmon make it up the river that means the other 999,992 were lazy and didn't apply themselves.
 
I have a question (@ you, applecruncher):

Imagine that a great majority of people (let’s say upwards of 80%) finally get it; they understand what racial prejudice is, how it propagates, the harm it's done. Racial prejudice exists only among tiny, insignificant groups, and they are fading fast.

Now that there is a clear understanding, what is the next step? How do we proceed, and what do we do to maintain the new normal?
 
Trade said:
No that's not how it works. If one million salmon make it up a river to spawn every year, and then we build a dam on the river and the next year only 8 salmon make it up the river that means the other 999,992 were lazy and didn't apply themselves.
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Gotta love Randian economics. Did you know, that la Rand was poor in her latter years and actually accepted money from the gov't?
 
A couple of terms I never hear anymore, but heard my parents use when I was very young (teen).

Splib - my father is the only person I every heard use this word. He sometimes would say to one of my younger brothers "Stop acting like a splib." What he meant was that brother was "messin' up", acting like one of the high school drop-outs who hung out with a group on a street corner.

splib/category.php?category=unknown
In the mid 60's, while in the Marine Corps, the term splib was used commonly among black and white marines. It was not used in a pejorative way by either blacks or whites but as a "hip", descriptive way of identifying a person, usually a male, of the ***** race, such as in the phrase "splib dude". Likewise the descriptive and non-pejorative term "chuck" was used to describe a white person, however it was also used to describe the Viet Cong (VC), such as in "Victor Charlie", "Charlie" or just "Chuck" In fact, one might get vanilla or chocolate creme filled cookies that were included in the field "C" rations. These were commonly referred to as "chuck" or "splib" cookies.


Hilligan - my mother used this term, but not very often. It's a combination of hooligan and hillbilly. Kinda like people Jeff Foxworthy referred to as rednecks.

Definition. Appalachian American. A PC term for any number of Americans who by region, decent or choice are hillbillies, hilljacks.
 
Cap'nSacto said:
I have a question (@ you, applecruncher):

Imagine that a great majority of people (let’s say upwards of 80%) finally get it; they understand what racial prejudice, how it propagates, the harm it's done. Racial prejudice exists only among tiny, insignificant groups, and they are fading fast.

Now that there is a clear understanding, what is the next step? How do we proceed, and what do we do to maintain the new normal?
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hmmm. I'll have to think on that.
 
YES it does make me uncomfortable to talk about race yet I'm fascinated. I do want to understand and I'm wise enough to believe what makes sense. That's why I'd rather talk to people than listen to what media tells me.
I've learned a lot in my small diverse world. Still learning.
There is a video circulating to explain white privilege. Everyone starts at the beginning then as questions are asked such as "Do you live in a household with two parents?". As the questions are asked more and more are left behind.
I'm genuinely asking why are there so many single parent families in the back community? What happened? It wasn't always that way was it?
 
Cap'nSacto said:
I have a question (@ you, applecruncher):

Imagine that a great majority of people (let’s say upwards of 80%) finally get it; they understand what racial prejudice, how it propagates, the harm it's done. Racial prejudice exists only among tiny, insignificant groups, and they are fading fast.

Now that there is a clear understanding, what is the next step? How do we proceed, and what do we do to maintain the new normal?
Click to expand...

Good question.
 

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