Evidence of the Afterlife - Scientific Research

I’m not religious.
I didn't post that you were. Just pointing out that religion or religious beliefs are associated with after life as in once dead & buried there is an afterlife.

http://www.religiousmovements.org/views-on-death-according-to-different-religions/

What others believe or not has nothing to do with brain activity up to 10 minutes after actual death has been pronounced. What 1300 people experienced while still alive & the brain was still active for me is not scientific proof of anything. Interesting to read, just doesn't convince me that when you die there is nothing more that happens.
 

A few years ago I had a conversation on this topic with a younger (late 20's or so Maybe 30ish) who was a very devout Christian. I am a passable Christian. He did not believe in an afterlife of any sort. We were talking about how some folks see things they see as "signs: that the departed are watching over them , ie seeing cardinals (the bird) or finding a penny, or dreaming about a departed. He did not feel we were being sent a sign.

I gave him the but what if argument...but what if seeing a cardinal outside my window gives me comfort that maybe it is a visit, who does it hurt. He had no answer.

I would like to believe there is a place called Heaven where we go after. Where we meet our departed loved ones again and all. But, as others have said here, we do not know, and those who do know are not coming back to tell us.
 
A few years ago I had a conversation on this topic with a younger (late 20's or so Maybe 30ish) who was a very devout Christian. I am a passable Christian. He did not believe in an afterlife of any sort. We were talking about how some folks see things they see as "signs: that the departed are watching over them , ie seeing cardinals (the bird) or finding a penny, or dreaming about a departed. He did not feel we were being sent a sign.

I gave him the but what if argument...but what if seeing a cardinal outside my window gives me comfort that maybe it is a visit, who does it hurt. He had no answer.

I would like to believe there is a place called Heaven where we go after. Where we meet our departed loved ones again and all. But, as others have said here, we do not know, and those who do know are not coming back to tell us.


At the time of Christ, there were two major groups of scholars in the temple... the Pharisees and Sadducees.
The major difference between the Pharisees and Sadducess: The Sadducees did not believe in any afterlife ever.
The Pharisees believed in the resurrection of the dead. Those were the only two options. As I posted previously,
Jesus and His disciples believed in the resurrection of the dead, without which there is no afterlife given in the Bible.
A good way to remember "Sadducee"... they were "sad you see" because they didn't believe in the resurrection.

Of course, today most churches preach a non-Biblical "going to either heaven or hell" immediately after death.
In the Bible, hell is the grave [not Dante's version of neverending punishment] and the only immortality is in
the resurrection of the dead.
 

I didn't post that you were. Just pointing out that religion or religious beliefs are associated with after life as in once dead & buried there is an afterlife.

http://www.religiousmovements.org/views-on-death-according-to-different-religions/

What others believe or not has nothing to do with brain activity up to 10 minutes after actual death has been pronounced. What 1300 people experienced while still alive & the brain was still active for me is not scientific proof of anything. Interesting to read, just doesn't convince me that when you die there is nothing more that happens.

I’m sorry! Yes you are right and that link was a great read. Thank you.

Apparently most religions believe in the Afterlife. I don’t know as much about religion. It’s something I wish I’d taken in school while I had the chance. Today, on Dr. Oz I learned that even the Jewish believe in reincarnation. It was news to me.

Its interesting that most religions believe in it but not many want to admit it or talk about it.

In an anonymous poll conducted , over 70% of people showed to believe in the spirits of their loved ones. This in itself speaks volumes because it inadvertently shows that people DO actually believe in the Afterlife.
 
A few years ago I had a conversation on this topic with a younger (late 20's or so Maybe 30ish) who was a very devout Christian. I am a passable Christian. He did not believe in an afterlife of any sort. We were talking about how some folks see things they see as "signs: that the departed are watching over them , ie seeing cardinals (the bird) or finding a penny, or dreaming about a departed. He did not feel we were being sent a sign.

I gave him the but what if argument...but what if seeing a cardinal outside my window gives me comfort that maybe it is a visit, who does it hurt. He had no answer.

I would like to believe there is a place called Heaven where we go after. Where we meet our departed loved ones again and all. But, as others have said here, we do not know, and those who do know are not coming back to tell us.
Even if it’s not true, it sure is a wonderful thing to ponder about. It seems to be very common for us humans to want to believe that we live eternally and will all meet us each at one time. Perhaps that’s another reason why religion was created. There certainly was an emotional need for it.
 
Evidence of the Afterlife - Scientific Research

"documented information from over 1,300 patients who have had near death experiences."

Near death or even dead doesn't mean the brain stops functioning immediately or at least this article which is to long to cut & paste explains that up to 10 minutes there is activity

Brain activity may continue for more than 10 minutes after the body appears to have died, according to a new study.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-death-after-eeg-study-research-a7620131.html

Afterlife is a religious belief that hasn't been proven. Evidence of brain activity after death has. Since brain activity continues just like it does while asleep. I'm happy to wait until 1300 dead and buried show up to explain what to expect.
This link was also interesting thank you. In the documentation Dr. J. Long conducted one person was deceased for over 14 hours .
There are other similar situations that were documented with patients who actually had been dead for hours and were brought back to tell about it. It’s interesting stuff.
 
Once your brain is dead. You are dead. Without the brain functioning you are dead. There's no more functioning once you are gone. It has been proven billions of times over and over again.

From dust you have come and unto dust you shall return.
 
This link was also interesting thank you. In the documentation Dr. J. Long conducted one person was deceased for over 14 hours .
There are other similar situations that were documented with patients who actually had been dead for hours and were brought back to tell about it. It’s interesting stuff.

They were not dead. It seemed like they were dead but they were not dead because if they were they could not be brought back.

There are all kinds of frozen bodies in this world hoping to be brought back to life. It's not going to happen.
 
My point is simply this (and has nothing at all to do with religion or lack of it):

The fact that people have similar experiences when in a "near" death state proves nothing about what comes after real, final, death.

I am a Lutheran and I do believe in a life after death on earth; however, I still do not believe that these similar "near" death experiences either prove or disprove it. Being near to falling off a cliff is not actually falling off a cliff, and being "near" death is not being actually dead. The fact that these people were resuscitated means to me that they were not really really dead and that enough life spark or whatever you care to call it was still present for them to be brought back from the edge, or "near" death.
 
My point is simply this (and has nothing at all to do with religion or lack of it):

The fact that people have similar experiences when in a "near" death state proves nothing about what comes after real, final, death.

I am a Lutheran and I do believe in a life after death on earth; however, I still do not believe that these similar "near" death experiences either prove or disprove it. Being near to falling off a cliff is not actually falling off a cliff, and being "near" death is not being actually dead. The fact that these people were resuscitated means to me that they were not really really dead and that enough life spark or whatever you care to call it was still present for them to be brought back from the edge, or "near" death.

Obviously true. However, since this is a place we are all eventually going to land it isn't unreasonable to want to know more about what comes next. Since we have no scientifically verified accounts of anyone coming back from the other side, experiences recounted by the near-dead are the closest we have thus far.

I happen to believe that these people have experienced a taste of the afterlife because like, Rose, I feel the heart (actually the soul) goes on and on.
 
Obviously true. However, since this is a place we are all eventually going to land it isn't unreasonable to want to know more about what comes next. Since we have no scientifically verified accounts of anyone coming back from the other side, experiences recounted by the near-dead are the closest we have thus far.

I happen to believe that these people have experienced a taste of the afterlife because like, Rose, I feel the heart (actually the soul) goes on and on.

How dead do these people have to be to be verified dead?
Do they have to come crawling out of the grave as proof?

I agree wholeheartedly. The soul or spiritual soul of humanity lives on forever.
For me, this not only speaks truthfully but it ‘feels right’ at a core level in MY soul.
Its a ‘without a doubt’ instinctual thing.
 
How dead do these people have to be to be verified dead?
Do they have to come crawling out of the grave as proof?

There is no such thing as how dead. Either a person is dead or he/she is not. They do not have to come crawling out of the grave, whatever that means. If they are declared dead by a
medical professional, and they do not "come back to life" because the medical professional was in error, then they are dead.

Being in a "near death" state is not the same thing as being dead. Otherwise, how would we feel about burying or cremating people who are in a near death state?
 
There is no such thing as how dead. Either a person is dead or he/she is not. They do not have to come crawling out of the grave, whatever that means. If they are declared dead by a
medical professional, and they do not "come back to life" because the medical professional was in error, then they are dead.

Being in a "near death" state is not the same thing as being dead. Otherwise, how would we feel about burying or cremating people who are in a near death state?

I don't see anybody debating this point.
 
How dead do these people have to be to be verified dead?
Do they have to come crawling out of the grave as proof?

I agree wholeheartedly. The soul or spiritual soul of humanity lives on forever.
For me, this not only speaks truthfully but it ‘feels right’ at a core level in MY soul.
Its a ‘without a doubt’ instinctual thing.
Aren't the soul & spirit separate in meaning? Which if either of those live on and in what form? Since near dead has been established isn't dead and the brain according to medical documentation can function for about 10 minutes after true death. the "scientific" proof book sounds to me like a nice money making read that gives hope to those that need to believe something takes place once we are dead.
 
How dead do these people have to be to be verified dead?
Do they have to come crawling out of the grave as proof?

I agree wholeheartedly. The soul or spiritual soul of humanity lives on forever.
For me, this not only speaks truthfully but it ‘feels right’ at a core level in MY soul.
Its a ‘without a doubt’ instinctual thing.

That's what I choose to believe, too. And if I'm wrong, how disappointed do you guess I'm going to be? :)
 
Anyone ever see the 1987 movie Made in Heaven? Starred Timothy Hutton and Kelly McGillis. Hutton plays a young man who drowns while trying to save a family from a car that went into a pond. He ends up in Heaven. Meets a few family and neighbors. Meets Kelly..who is a "new soul", she has never been to Earth. They fall in love. Then she gets called to go to Earth. He deals with the guy in charge to follow and go back as a baby as well, so he can find her. Good story. Sappy, but good. Anyway, HIS version of heaven is the one I would like to go to. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093467/


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There is no such thing as how dead. Either a person is dead or he/she is not. They do not have to come crawling out of the grave, whatever that means. If they are declared dead by a
medical professional, and they do not "come back to life" because the medical professional was in error, then they are dead.

Being in a "near death" state is not the same thing as being dead. Otherwise, how would we feel about burying or cremating people who are in a near death state?
It was stated tongue in cheek

I don't see anybody debating this point.
Nope

Aren't the soul & spirit separate in meaning? Which if either of those live on and in what form? Since near dead has been established isn't dead and the brain according to medical documentation can function for about 10 minutes after true death. the "scientific" proof book sounds to me like a nice money making read that gives hope to those that need to believe something takes place once we are dead.
Ok.
 
Anyone ever see the 1987 movie Made in Heaven? Starred Timothy Hutton and Kelly McGillis. Hutton plays a young man who drowns while trying to save a family from a car that went into a pond. He ends up in Heaven. Meets a few family and neighbors. Meets Kelly..who is a "new soul", she has never been to Earth. They fall in love. Then she gets called to go to Earth. He deals with the guy in charge to follow and go back as a baby as well, so he can find her. Good story. Sappy, but good. Anyway, HIS version of heaven is the one I would like to go to. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093467/


View attachment 54532
I did see that and it was so tender and sweet. What a heart wrenching story and very well done. I’d forgotten about that movie. I quite liked it.
 
Scientists ( not science ) tend to hate anything they can’t explain without religious connotations. Anything unknown by science is often considered religious in nature. The problem being that most scientists start with the premise that there is NO GOD and that everything can be explained naturally and scientifically however man has failed miserably in doing so.


The Big Bang theory is full of holes , the discovery of black holes was incorrect, that Pluto is not actually a planet. We were told the oil spills in the Gulf of Mexico would destroy the coasts and poison fish for decades however the oil was somehow absorbed back into the ocean like it always does. There are oil spills that happen in the world ALL the time but since this one was a ‘man made’ spill, it was supposed to be an irreversible disaster.


Whether you call it God or Mother Nature whatever you call it, it’s far more powerful a force than man is or ever will be. Perhaps its arrogance on our part to ever try and explain this.


Could it be that the things man is trying to study is at a subatomic level of physics that’s out of the range of our limited five physical senses?What about our sixth sense? Our intuition? Most of us know we have it and occasionally get glimpses of it in either dreams or déjà vu.


How do we possibly explain the ability humans have of understanding everything that’s taking place around them without ANY brain activity? Their brains have been scientifically tested and have zero possibility of understanding anything yet here we are reading account after account of it happening.


Isn’t it human nature to fear anything we don’t understand? If we take a trip through the last few centuries, we have an endless list of things we thought we knew for certain but were wrong. Why as humans do we HAVE to think we know everything or understand everything in order to believe it?


Science needs to look beyond what it can physically qualify and measure in order to understand. Just because something can’t be measured doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. And what about things that CAN be measured? Some things we STILL have a difficulty dealing with, like water being two different types of gases. It may very well be gases at a subatomic level but to our five senses, it definitely has fluidity that we can drown in.


Isn’t what can be measured defined by our level of advancement? Why can’t people entertain the idea that some phenomena might in fact exist beyond the current reach of science? Isn’t curiosity, the contemplation of the unknown, philosophy, and metaphysics the lifeblood of cutting edge science?


How long do we need to be dead in order for it to be verified as clinically dead?
Even members here make this question seem like a ‘no brainer ‘ yet how many coffins have been dug up with nail marks under the lid? Please remember that these people had to WAIT for their DEATH to be clinically verified by a DOCTOR.
 
Scientists ( not science ) tend to hate anything they can’t explain without religious connotations. Anything unknown by science is often considered religious in nature. The problem being that most scientists start with the premise that there is NO GOD and that everything can be explained naturally and scientifically however man has failed miserably in doing so.

Keesha, although there are many things in your note that are inviting responses, I'll restrict mine to your first paragraph, otherwise this will turn into an encyclopedia.

Where did you get the idea that scientists "hate" anything? Hate is totally irrelevant to scientific inquiry. And actually, some scientists are religious. Scientists freely and often announce that at the
present time, something or other is "unknown." That does not mean they hate it, or that religion has anything to do with it. If the cause of something is unknown, that is all it means: it is unknown.
Someday it probably will be understood, if we don't wipe ourselves out first.

I have never heard or read any scientist saying that everything can be explained scientifically. Only physical phenomena can be so explained. The philosophical underpinnings, if they exist, are outside
of the realm of science. Philosophy (you can call it religion) does not even come into the picture, from the point of view of science. It only becomes a conflict when some people are so afraid to have
their old misunderstandings shaken up that they create an enemy out of science, in the name of religion. The Bible has lots of wisdom; it also has lots of nonsense, as it was written at a time where
many physical phenomena were not understood at all. So then you have a battle between science and ignorance. Example: the people who still insist that the earth is about 5,000 years old and was created in 6 days.

About your statement that the discovery of black holes was incorrect, where in the world did you ever get that idea? For an eye-opening explanation of black holes, and they are truly astounding, see if you can find the series "How the Universe Works" on the Discovery channel. It's absolutely fascinating, and has one entire episode on black holes, explaining how we know they are there (billions of them!) and how they work.

Saying that something is true merely because science can't demonstrate that it isn't, is false reasoning. We can always get back to our old friend, the Tooth Fairy. Most sane people, over the age of 6 or so, do not believe in her, although science has not proven that she does not exist. Anyone claiming that there is some sort of consciousness after death has the burden of proof that this is so;
it is not up to the scientists to prove that it isn't. The burden of proof is always on the person making the assertion, not the person saying, "Why should I believe it? Prove it!"
 
Scientists ( not science ) tend to hate anything they can’t explain without religious connotations. Anything unknown by science is often considered religious in nature. The problem being that most scientists start with the premise that there is NO GOD and that everything can be explained naturally and scientifically however man has failed miserably in doing so.


The Big Bang theory is full of holes , the discovery of black holes was incorrect, that Pluto is not actually a planet. We were told the oil spills in the Gulf of Mexico would destroy the coasts and poison fish for decades however the oil was somehow absorbed back into the ocean like it always does. There are oil spills that happen in the world ALL the time but since this one was a ‘man made’ spill, it was supposed to be an irreversible disaster.


Whether you call it God or Mother Nature whatever you call it, it’s far more powerful a force than man is or ever will be. Perhaps its arrogance on our part to ever try and explain this.


Could it be that the things man is trying to study is at a subatomic level of physics that’s out of the range of our limited five physical senses?What about our sixth sense? Our intuition? Most of us know we have it and occasionally get glimpses of it in either dreams or déjà vu.


How do we possibly explain the ability humans have of understanding everything that’s taking place around them without ANY brain activity? Their brains have been scientifically tested and have zero possibility of understanding anything yet here we are reading account after account of it happening.


Isn’t it human nature to fear anything we don’t understand? If we take a trip through the last few centuries, we have an endless list of things we thought we knew for certain but were wrong. Why as humans do we HAVE to think we know everything or understand everything in order to believe it?


Science needs to look beyond what it can physically qualify and measure in order to understand. Just because something can’t be measured doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. And what about things that CAN be measured? Some things we STILL have a difficulty dealing with, like water being two different types of gases. It may very well be gases at a subatomic level but to our five senses, it definitely has fluidity that we can drown in.


Isn’t what can be measured defined by our level of advancement? Why can’t people entertain the idea that some phenomena might in fact exist beyond the current reach of science? Isn’t curiosity, the contemplation of the unknown, philosophy, and metaphysics the lifeblood of cutting edge science?


How long do we need to be dead in order for it to be verified as clinically dead?
Even members here make this question seem like a ‘no brainer ‘ yet how many coffins have been dug up with nail marks under the lid? Please remember that these people had to WAIT for their DEATH to be clinically verified by a DOCTOR.

Why are you picking on science, Keesha? The very definition of that field demands that it remain separated from religion and spiritual beliefs. Can you imagine what would be taught in our schools if that were not so? I shudder to think...

For something to move from a scientific theory it must pass rigorous peer review and be reproducible by another set of scientists. What happens after death remains theoretical. Some scientists believe in God and the afterlife, others don't. The existence of God can (so far) be neither proved nor disproved by scientific method.

I'm ok with that because most of us base our lives on more than science. Or religion, for that matter.
 
...Whether you call it God or Mother Nature whatever you call it, it’s far more powerful a force than man is or ever will be. Perhaps its arrogance on our part to ever try and explain this....

...Why as humans do we HAVE to think we know everything or understand everything in order to believe it?...

...Science needs to look beyond what it can physically qualify and measure...
Yes, Yes, and Yes. I agree Keesha. We aren't suppose to have all the answers to creation...the who-what-when-why-where of it all. If we knew all the answers then there would be no such thing as "Faith".

Faith is essential in order to exercise our created free-will to choose our intelligent designer- creator or choose the belief of life just happening from chaos. Faith is essential for God to have a relationship with humanity. Otherwise we would be all-knowing loveless robots that he created. You can't have a real relationship without love and respect by choice.

Plus, we are to "study God's Word to show ourselves approved" [for His Kingdom]. There's nothing to study if we know all the answers. It's part of the on-going relationship with our creator.

Of course I don't know this for sure. And of course no one else does either. But I'm exercising "faith" based on my studying and what I've experienced throughout my relationship with God and through prayer...and by faith I DO know.
 


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