Income inequality threatens democracy: agree or disagree?

Irwin

Irwin

Well-known Member
Location
Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
Income inequality during the past two decades is about what it was during the 1920s—just before the Great Depression. Some analysts believe that was a leading indicator. It didn't seem to affect our democracy, though, as far as I know. This time may be different.

So... do you believe that income inequality threatens democracy?
 

Not a threat!

Those not satisfied with their income can put all their skill & ability into starting their own business. Then when doing a booming business pay their employees wages to amount to a little less annually than what they make as owners. That should solve the question of income equality. I know that isn't possible & I don't think I've ever read a research report identifying the underlying various reasons for income inequality.

But it never ceases to amaze me how many people come to America both legally & illegally thrive & are able to do this.
https://www.voanews.com/americas/mexican-migrants-sent-home-record-40-billion-2020

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remit... States is currently,the largest in the world.
 
raybar said:
I can not imagine a functional economy where there is income equality all across of society.
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There is always going to be income inequality unless you live under communism. The issue here is, at what point is it out of control?

Currently, the top 10 percent control more wealth than the bottom 90 percent. Money is power, so the country is governed by only 10%. That's not how democracies are supposed to work.
 
Irwin said:
There is always going to be income inequality unless you live under communism. The issue here is, at what point is it out of control?

Currently, the top 10 percent control more wealth than the bottom 90 percent. Money is power, so the country is governed by only 10%. That's not how democracies are supposed to work.
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Tell that to the French! :ROFLMAO:
 
Irwin said:
Income inequality during the past two decades is about what it was during the 1920s—just before the Great Depression. Some analysts believe that was a leading indicator. It didn't seem to affect our democracy, though, as far as I know. This time may be different.

So... do you believe that income inequality threatens democracy?
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Very often many delusional people who succumb to archaic and narrow minded notions subscribe to the mythic ideal that those who believe that the unequal distribution of property is the cause of violent factionalism in society is a commie, a radical, a pinko, or worse. However, such misbeliefs are based on ignorance. Anyone who knows their history is fully aware that the idea of unequal distribution of property as the cause of factionalism was first promulgated by that "Marxist" known as James Madison (4th president of the USA) in his essay # 10 of the Federalist Papers.


According to Madison, the cause of factionalism is the unequal distribution of property in society.

James Madison on Majority Rule, Factionalism, and the Common Good | by Bruce Gatenby | Apr, 2021 | Medium





Unlike so many "leaders" and "thinkers", President Madison was willing to die for that belief.





If Madison was alive today he, like Marx, Marcuse, Teddy & Franklin Delano Roosevelt, and many others would tell that it is the ever growing wealth gap that is the cause of the problems we have in this society today.
 
I guess when it comes to choices I'd have to have a list of what choices I'm denied. As of right now I don't know of anything that impacts the choices I make. I come & go as I please, I enjoy the fruits of my labor. What the ultra wealthy do or don't do hasn't impacted me.
I just don't see the utopia that comes with equality in every aspect of life ever happening. I can't begin to imagine the chaos if we didn't have a democracy by representation. We elect people to represent our needs, so far that has been happening.

If America was lacking then why are there so many trying to gain access every day?
 
I don't begrudge those who become wealthy via their hard work and innovative ideas. What I dislike is the hundreds of pages in our IRS tax code that allows the wealthy to pay a lower percentage of their incomes than someone in the Middle Class. This, IMO, is the biggest contributor to our increasing Disparity of Wealth. There are numerous examples of billionaires having paid NO income tax.

https://www.propublica.org/article/...ds-reveal-how-the-wealthiest-avoid-income-tax

At the same time, I have NO sympathy for those who think the world owes them a living.

If this gap between the rich and the poor continues to widen, I can see the day when our nation erupts into a war between the Haves, and the Have nots.
 
Income inequality was most likely not a problem in the hunter/gatherer/forager tribes in which humankind lived for at least 25,000 years--some scientists think it was closer to 50,000--after we became homosapiens. And since we can get an idea of that kind of living from some of what was witnessed by the first Europeans who came to the Western Hemisphere and who happened to write it down--some of which has been found in the basements of museums in Europe--we can see that that socialist (gasp!) kind of lifestyle was being practiced in recent (relatively as history goes) times. Some European visitor to America wrote of a Native American tribe, I think it was Senecan, in which the chief of that tribe was expected to give gifts of some kind to the other members of the tribe frequently since they were aware that leaders being too greedy was not a good idea. So greed and acquisitiveness are human nature but it's also human nature to have the capacity to try to figure out how to channel it and find a workaround to keep things closer to equal. As Derrick Jensen put it: "Nobody rich + nobody poor = everybody happy." And as Jane T. Godfrey puts it: "Dying with the most toys = you're still dead."
 
Poverty causes multiple social issues, crime, health issues, and life issues. And enough poverty leads to authoritarian governments, which does not address the poverty, but increasingly to corrupt, restrictive, more authoritarian regimes, and then, of course, revolutions, which do not address the poverty., which lead to more authoritarian governments, .which leads.....................
 
Don M. said:
I don't begrudge those who become wealthy via their hard work and innovative ideas. What I dislike is the hundreds of pages in our IRS tax code that allows the wealthy to pay a lower percentage of their incomes than someone in the Middle Class. This, IMO, is the biggest contributor to our increasing Disparity of Wealth. There are numerous examples of billionaires having paid NO income tax.

https://www.propublica.org/article/...ds-reveal-how-the-wealthiest-avoid-income-tax

At the same time, I have NO sympathy for those who think the world owes them a living.

If this gap between the rich and the poor continues to widen, I can see the day when our nation erupts into a war between the Haves, and the Have nots.
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I read the article to see if it described the way the average citizen could avoid higher taxes.

Quote
"The IRS records show that the wealthiest can — perfectly legally — pay income taxes that are only a tiny fraction of the hundreds of millions, if not billions, their fortunes grow each year.


Their wealth derives from the skyrocketing value of their assets, like stock and property. Those gains are not defined by U.S. laws as taxable income unless and until the billionaires sell."

So like the rest of us they use what is legally available. For me the IRA's we have rise & fall in value I like those aren't taxed until drawn on. It seems fair to me to not pay taxes on assets until real money is put into circulation.


Quote
"But few specifics about individuals ever emerge in public. Tax information is among the most zealously guarded secrets in the federal government. ProPublica has decided to reveal individual tax information of some of the wealthiest Americans because it is only by seeing specifics that the public can understand the realities of the country’s tax system."

The reality is using the tax laws legally & information zealously guarded is as it should be. Again from a personal standpoint I don't want my financial information available to the world.

The article for me lacks info I can use to lessen my taxes. It does present how the tax laws used legally make a difference in amounts paid. It's mind boggling to me to read how some have assets that exceed the GDP of some 3rd. world countries.
 
Irwin said:
Income inequality during the past two decades is about what it was during the 1920s—just before the Great Depression. Some analysts believe that was a leading indicator. It didn't seem to affect our democracy, though, as far as I know. This time may be different.

So... do you believe that income inequality threatens democracy?
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This possible infrastructure is a mess! and I really hope and pray this G7 goes better that the rest of this molarchy!
 
chic said:
Because the French adhered to this system prior to 1789 and we all know how that worked out. You can't sustain such a level of gross socio economic inequality. Something will rupture. Usually in revolution.
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Inequality in the U.S. today rivals what it was in France in 1789. Inequality in France today is comparable to what it was in the U.S. back in 1980 before the rich got so much richer—thanks to our economic policies and tax rates. That's also when our federal debt began to skyrocket, which is rapidly approaching $30 trillion.

The difference here, though, the majority of those hit hardest by income inequality support the polices that cause the inequality.
 

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