Is the stock market slide over?

oldmontana

Member
Location
Montana
Original Poster
no you have it backwards ..it is you trying to disprove what I post with either no facts , wrong facts, or you try to post things like a 100 year chart that have zero To do with anything I said.

believe me I do my homework ..I talk facts and figures and if the numbers show what I say there is nothing to argue but yet you do it anyway
Gold vs. Stocks and Bonds
When evaluating the performance of gold as an investment over the long term, it really depends on the time period being analyzed. For example, over a 30-year period, stocks and bonds have outperformed gold, and over a 15-year period, gold has outperformed stocks and bonds.1 2

Over the past 30 years, the price of gold has increased by around 280%.2 Over the same period, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) has gained 839%.1

If we look instead over the past 15 years, the price of gold has increased by 278%, roughly the same as the 30 year.2 Over the same period, the DJIA increased by only 173%.1

So, over the longer term, stocks seem to outperform gold by about 3-to-1, but over shorter time horizons, gold may win out. Indeed, if we go way back to the 1920s through today, stocks blow gold away.

Turning to bonds, the average annual rate of return on investment-grade corporate bonds going back to the 1920s is around 5.25%. That indicates that over the past 30 years, corporate bonds have returned around 450% - nearly double that of gold. Over a 15-year period the return on bonds and gold has been fairly comparable.

============================================

These are facts..look at the 30 year. I like facts.

I think this board is about people expressing what they think ...opinion..and facts. I do both. If you do not like what I post like I said ..so be it.
 

mathjak107

Senior Member
Which was not being discussed at All for for a variety of reasons ...I SPECIFICALLY SAID THE LAST TWO DECADES ....GOLD WAS NOT A MAIN STREAM INVESTMENT PRIOR ...NOR WERE THERE MANY PORTFOLIOS UTILIZING GOLD IN THOSE DAYS ...THERE WAS ONLY ONE I KNOW OF ...

the data is very skewed 30 years ago for an asset like gold which is why I won’t even discuss 30 years ago. ...your chart of 100 years ago as well as comments about its returns going back to 1920 was hilarious since it had a fixed price for decades and was not an investable asset in America ....

you can post what you want but do it as a comment on someone else’s post because all you do is waste my time replying to the nonsense answers you reply with
 

Aunt Bea

SF VIP
Location
Near Mount Pilot
I've always viewed investing in gold as a bet against the future.

So far I've been able to make a reasonable return over time without holding gold or other precious metals.

I agree with oldmontana that this should be a forum where we can all share our personal views and experiences.

I really enjoy hearing how people have chosen to invest and manage their personal finances even if those choices are quite different from my own approach.
 

mathjak107

Senior Member
I've always viewed investing in gold as a bet against the future.

So far I've been able to make a reasonable return over time without holding gold or other precious metals.

I agree with oldmontana that this should be a forum where we can all share our personal views and experiences.

I really enjoy hearing how people have chosen to invest and manage their personal finances even if those choices are quite different from my own approach.
I agree but that is not what old Montana does ...he just argues and what he argues does not even apply to the thread he is arguing as he tries so hard to disprove what I said ..so he just changes the parameters and goes off on a different answer.

if I specifically say something is pertaining to the last two decades he chimes back in and goes That is not correct ...then posts a chart from 100 years ago ..I mean give me a break with this crap.

that is arguing just to argue ....
 

oldmontana

Member
Location
Montana
Original Poster
I've always viewed investing in gold as a bet against the future.

So far I've been able to make a reasonable return over time without holding gold or other precious metals.

I agree with oldmontana that this should be a forum where we can all share our personal views and experiences.

I really enjoy hearing how people have chosen to invest and manage their personal finances even if those choices are quite different from my own approach.
Thanks.

The fact is we have a poster that can not stand it when I post information that does not go with his thinking...like when I posted..

Gold vs. Stocks and Bonds
When evaluating the performance of gold as an investment over the long term, it really depends on the time period being analyzed. For example, over a 30-year period, stocks and bonds have outperformed gold, and over a 15-year period, gold has outperformed stocks and bonds.1 2

Over the past 30 years, the price of gold has increased by around 280%.2 Over the same period, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) has gained 839%.1

If we look instead over the past 15 years, the price of gold has increased by 278%, roughly the same as the 30 year.2 Over the same period, the DJIA increased by only 173%.1

So, over the longer term, stocks seem to outperform gold by about 3-to-1, but over shorter time horizons, gold may win out. Indeed, if we go way back to the 1920s through today, stocks blow gold away.

Turning to bonds, the average annual rate of return on investment-grade corporate bonds going back to the 1920s is around 5.25%. That indicates that over the past 30 years, corporate bonds have returned around 450% - nearly double that of gold. Over a 15-year period the return on bonds and gold has been fairly comparable.

==========================================

That link showed facts and it showed at times gold did better than stocks and at times stocks did better than gold. No 100 year chart. It was not arguing.

That said I started this thread and the subject is "Is the stock market over"...its not about gold.

Happy investing.
 

fmdog44

Well-known Member
Location
Houston, Texas
Which was not being discussed at All for for a variety of reasons ...I SPECIFICALLY SAID THE LAST TWO DECADES ....GOLD WAS NOT A MAIN STREAM INVESTMENT PRIOR ...NOR WERE THERE MANY PORTFOLIOS UTILIZING GOLD IN THOSE DAYS ...THERE WAS ONLY ONE I KNOW OF ...

the data is very skewed 30 years ago for an asset like gold which is why I won’t even discuss 30 years ago. ...your chart of 100 years ago as well as comments about its returns going back to 1920 was hilarious since it had a fixed price for decades and was not an investable asset in America ....

you can post what you want but do it as a comment on someone else’s post because all you do is waste my time replying to the nonsense answers you reply with
Hit Caps Lock.
 

fmdog44

Well-known Member
Location
Houston, Texas
NOTHING WOULD EVER BE TRUE OF ALL STOCKS ... but all our personal returns work off of indivudual situation .. we all buy at different times , rebalance at different times , sell at different times and have different tax structures ...we can never speak in terms of any ones personal rate of return ..in fact the biggest factor is how much money of yours markets are working on at any point in time . a 5% move in a mediocre market today blows away a great market year 25-30 years ago for most of us in terms of dollars gained or lost .

all comparisons are always done off funds or assets as a group or index

even so i bet indexing beats 90% of small investors who buy individual stocks long term anyway
Hit Caps Lock
 

mathjak107

Senior Member
etf's are like mutual funds that trade like stocks ... very popular ones are total market index funds like vti , s&p 500 funds like voo or spy . gold funds like gld , long term treasury funds like tlt .


you can trade them all day like stocks unlike mutual funds which only price once a day at the close
 
I don't know much about economic theories, but I doubt the full effect of "self isolation" has hit the market. Some seem to think that we throw a switch and the virus disappears and we're back in business. I really don't see that happening. People are racking up way too much debt just trying to stay in their homes and keep eating. Plus, this isn't a normal recession, people are terrified. It's been a huge psychological blow, which is going to take a while to dissipate. Few are going to putting in a new pool. Everybody took a hit from the virus- from McDonald's to Geico, so what you are going to invest in short term? The word "profit" won't be used until 2021, at the extreme earliest.
 
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mathjak107

Senior Member
I don't know much about economic theories, but I doubt the full effect of "self isolation" has hit the market. Some seem to think that we throw a switch and the virus disappears and we're back in business. I really don't see that happening. People are racking up way too much debt just trying to stay in their homes and keep eating. Plus, this isn't a normal recession, people are terrified. It's been a huge psychological blow, which is going to take a while to dissipate. Few are going to putting in a new pool. Everybody took a hit from the virus- from McDonald's to Geico, so what you are going to invest in short term? The word "profit" won't be used until 2021, at the extreme earliest.
markets work differently ....remember laying off people improves the bottom line .. analysts spend their time trying to guess a companies earnings ... their estimates can be real crappy .... but if earnings come in not good , but less bad those stocks go up .... so it is all about meeting or beating estimates whiuch already are crappy .

also 25% of the major index's are in internet sales and information services ... that too has been holding up . lets not forget that 20% of the market index's are influenced heavily by the faang stocks too
 

Liberty

Senior Member
Location
Texas
Speaking of market related concerns...would like to know opinions on the virus sell off creating "Fallen Angels" issues among the bond market.
 

gennie

Senior Member
Location
USA
Speaking of market related concerns...would like to know opinions on the virus sell off creating "Fallen Angels" issues among the bond market.
Elected officials who used insider trader info to increase their already considerable wealth are scum and need to resign their office and go home. I'm looking at you R.B.
 

mathjak107

Senior Member
“The four most dangerous words in investing are: “This time it’s different.” - Sir John Templeton
we are now within 10% of the all time high again ...

this is despite what we all see and think about this becoming the great depression ..those who were waiting for the proverbial crash missed the boat again and the money ship sailed without them ....
 

Aunt Bea

SF VIP
Location
Near Mount Pilot
we are now within 10% of the all time high again ...

this is despite what we all see and think about this becoming the great depression ..those who were waiting for the proverbial crash missed the boat again and the money ship sailed without them ....
I agree.

If you had sound investments and a proper allocation for your goals before the slide you most likely have sound investments and a proper allocation for your goals today.

I still believe that we will take another hard fall/correction before we find our footing and get moving steadily forward.

We'll see!
 

gennie

Senior Member
Location
USA
I don't think the world economic scene has felt the full impact of the Covid 19 virus as it has not yet finished its first round.

People in a position to have early information about trends that will affect the market will do well. Ordinary investors who operate on routine information available to all plus gut instinct ................... not so much. JMHO
 

mathjak107

Senior Member
I don't think the world economic scene has felt the full impact of the Covid 19 virus as it has not yet finished its first round.

People in a position to have early information about trends that will affect the market will do well. Ordinary investors who operate on routine information available to all plus gut instinct ................... not so much. JMHO
All one had to do was nothing ...just stay invested ....we are 10% from the peak ...thinking you are going to time in and out hurts most investors
 

OneEyedDiva

Well-known Member
Location
Nrw Jersey
Apple hit it's 52 week high today but by market close it had slid down close to $2 less than that high to close at $373.85/share. NASDAQ hit what I believe is their all time high today at 10,433.65. I'm glad I bought what I did when the market made those steep drops. I believe we'll continue to experience more drops.
 


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