Long post but reflects MY feelings

Some actions are driven by emotions, not rational thought. So you go right ahead with your emotional response, and potentially and needlessly spread disease to vulnerable people, whether or not you know them personally. Go ahead and refuse to listen to reason and continue to look out for your own selfish wants, as opposed to thinking about the implications your behavior will have on others. Continue to devalue doing things for the greater good.

We are not a nation composed of individuals and nuclear families. We live in a society and that alone makes us dependent on one another, whether we like that or not. None of us get to opt out of the human race. You can attempt to negate the responsibility that comes with the freedom you so righteously demand, but that doesn't absolve you of the consequences to others of you failing to step up.

But you go on and continue to be needlessly smug and self-righteous. I'll just be over here with my mask and my disinfectant spray, doing what I can to protect myself from people like you.
 

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I respect your frustration with all of this, squatting dog. Even those at the top of the science fields don't fully understand this virus. With some in government and business trying to spin the situation to their own advantage, and with the vast amount of misinformation circulating on social media, it's not at all surprising that the average person experiences a certain amount of anxiety and confusion.

This is obviously a disease that affects larger cities the most, not only in sheer numbers but also in terms of cases/deaths per 100,000 people. Like myself, you are blessed to live in an area that isn't being hit nearly as hard as some. I wonder if we might feel differently if we lived in a hard hit urban center.

Ultimately we all make our own decisions about our actions that can affect our safety and that of those around us. I'll defend my personal liberties (and yours) with every fiber of my being but for the sake of others, for example, I CHOOSE not to to drink and drive. Likewise, I CHOOSE to observe social distancing and sanitation practices. You will CHOOSE what seems best to you, but please don't denigrate others for their CHOICES. THey share the same rights as you.

There's nothing we can do about cancelled events and closed restaurants, and frankly I'm not so precious that missing out on those things is going to ruin my life. The Lord has gotten me through far worse that this in my life, and I trust He'll get me through this as well.

I'll pray for relief for all of those who are suffering, both physically and emotionally, during this ... just another of life's many challenges. I'll continue to count my many blessings and get on with my life.
 
I had to go to the pharmacy last week to pick up a prescription. No queue, just stay 6 feet away from others (only one other customer). A simple shield round the cash desk, but no other obvious precautions.
This time I didn't have to sign for anything.
 

Ronni said:
Some actions are driven by emotions, not rational thought. So you go right ahead with your emotional response, and potentially and needlessly spread disease to vulnerable people, whether or not you know them personally. Go ahead and refuse to listen to reason and continue to look out for your own selfish wants, as opposed to thinking about the implications your behavior will have on others. Continue to devalue doing things for the greater good.
But you go on and continue to be needlessly smug and self-righteous. I'll just be over here with my mask and my disinfectant spray, doing what I can to protect myself from people like you.
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I'm not being smug. I just think that some people in charge have way over reacted to what may, by the time it's all done and tested, will have been no better or worse than other disease's. (for which we have no cure by the way).
It just stuns me that people are so willing to forgo the civil liberties and rights so quickly, and without question. Call that self-righteous if you prefer. I'll proudly wear that badge.
 
squatting dog said:
I'm not being smug. I just think that some people in charge have way over reacted to what may, by the time it's all done and tested, will have been no better or worse than other disease's. (for which we have no cure by the way).
It just stuns me that people are so willing to forgo the civil liberties and rights so quickly, and without question. Call that self-righteous if you prefer. I'll proudly wear that badge.
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I have a medically trained family member who is also a first responder and he and friends who are on the front lines. I've received first hand reports of the heinous nature of this virus and the wretched way people are sickening and dying from it. I don't want to go out that way, so I choose to keep myself safe based on my own research and understanding of the virus and its spread.

How is that choice violating my civil liberties? YOUR choice hampers my ability to keep myself safe. My choice is a REACTION, in part, to your lack of responsibility because now I'm now only having to keep myself safe from the virus, I'm also having to keep myself safe from people like you.
 
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If this kills far fewer people than projected, it will almost certainly be due to the extraordinary containment measures taken by epidemiologists, scientists, doctors, political leaders and literally billions of humans following their advice.

When there's a terrible drought with forecasts of millions dying of starvation, but governments cooperate to bring food to those areas so far fewer die than predicted, some may find it appropriate to say, "I knew that drought wasn't going to be such a big deal after all!"
 
squatting dog said:
They don't, but, with a lot of other states with a lock down order, travel has all but stopped. I like to take my motor home out to the desert area's and boondock a lot. This year, it was planned to hit Utah, then Montana, and the Dakota's. Right now though, it's difficult because, while there is blm land that is still open, stopping anywhere to dump holding tanks or get fresh water or other supplies is all but impossible.
Can you imagine not being allowed into a grocery store unless you're wearing an armband ala Montana. Hey.... why not just make it a star sewn on your shirt?
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OK, I get it. This is all about you.
 
I am not in a panic over it. But, I am following all the social distancing guidelines. What does it hurt? I have a boyfriend who is 67 and has lung, heart and other health issues. I live in a senior living apartment building. Disabled and elderly. All types of health issues. If I take this lightly, I'd never forgive myself if someone got it because of me. I am not missing out on anything though. I don't usually go out much unless I go shopping with my boyfriend. I have not seen him for two weeks now. I am planning on going to my grocery store using my mobility chair today or tomorrow.
 
@squatting dog When I first read your post, I thought you were personally venting and was going to ask you if you felt better now....but since it was just a copy and paste from some unknown ranter on the internet, I didn't bother replying. Also, this is America, you are not losing your civil liberties by being asked to act responsibly during a COVID-19 Pandemic, something we haven't encountered here in our lifetime. If you're in China, and they lock you in your house, check on you every day by force, and put you in prison or worse for stepping out of your house, then yes, that is losing your rights.

There are young and old people dying from this, and I personally have no problem adjusting my daily routine to avoid the spread of this virus to myself and others. Your state may not have a lot of deaths from it, but there's no big bubble around Arkansas, you affect all of the United States of America.

Some who die from this already have compromised immune systems or health issues....but, if they didn't contract the Coronavirus, they would still be enjoying their lives today, instead of being hauled off in bodybags with the other victims, all who have died alone and not even had their loved ones with them. Many who lost their wives, husbands, parents or children to COVID-19, have not even been able to bury their dead, or have a proper funeral for them.

I don't think it's asking too much to restrict our activities until they get a hold on this pandemic. But, having said all that, you are entitled to your opinion, and you're not alone in not wanting to cooperate in this health crisis. Here are recent statistics for the US.

https://www.statista.com/statistics...covid19-cases-and-deaths-number-us-americans/

As of April 23, 2020, the number of both confirmed and presumptive positive cases of the COVID-19 disease reported in the United States had reached 865,585, with 48,816 deaths reported among these cases.
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Tommy said:
Ultimately we all make our own decisions about our actions that can affect our safety and that of those around us. I'll defend my personal liberties (and yours) with every fiber of my being but for the sake of others, for example, I CHOOSE not to to drink and drive. Likewise, I CHOOSE to observe social distancing and sanitation practices. You will CHOOSE what seems best to you, but please don't denigrate others for their CHOICES. THey share the same rights as you.

There's nothing we can do about cancelled events and closed restaurants, and frankly I'm not so precious that missing out on those things is going to ruin my life. The Lord has gotten me through far worse that this in my life, and I trust He'll get me through this as well.

I'll pray for relief for all of those who are suffering, both physically and emotionally, during this ... just another of life's many challenges. I'll continue to count my many blessings and get on with my life.
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Very well said @Tommy , I admire you for that and thank you. 👍
 
SeaBreeze said:
@squatting dog When I first read your post, I thought you were personally venting and was going to ask you if you felt better now....but since it was just a copy and paste from some unknown ranter on the internet, I didn't bother replying. Also, this is America, you are not losing your civil liberties by being asked to act responsibly during a COVID-19 Pandemic, something we haven't encountered here in our lifetime. If you're in China, and they lock you in your house, check on you every day by force, and put you in prison or worse for stepping out of your house, then yes, that is losing your rights.

There are young and old people dying from this, and I personally have no problem adjusting my daily routine to avoid the spread of this virus to myself and others. Your state may not have a lot of deaths from it, but there's no big bubble around Arkansas, you affect all of the United States of America.

Some who die from this already have compromised immune systems or health issues....but, if they didn't contract the Coronavirus, they would still be enjoying their lives today, instead of being hauled off in bodybags with the other victims, all who have died alone and not even had their loved ones with them. Many who lost their wives, husbands, parents or children to COVID-19, have not even been able to bury their dead, or have a proper funeral for them.

I don't think it's asking too much to restrict our activities until they get a hold on this pandemic. But, having said all that, you are entitled to your opinion, and you're not alone in not wanting to cooperate in this health crisis. Here are recent statistics for the US.

https://www.statista.com/statistics...covid19-cases-and-deaths-number-us-americans/
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All you say may be true, but, here are the statistics for the top 10 killers in the USA for 2018......2,839,205 dead. That's an awful lot of people who have died and yet... silence. What exactly is it that makes people think this one is so much worse? Hint.... media
 
Manatee said:
Ask the folks that can't even go to the funeral of a victim/relative.
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@Manatee , my heart goes out to those who were on their death beds from COVID-19 completely alone, not being able to have any comfort from their spouses or loved ones. Also, I can't even imagine how it would feel if my husband was in the hospital in that situation, and if he died alone, I couldn't even view his body for a last goodbye, or have him cremated in a funeral home in a proper fashion. I honestly don't know how I would react to that horror. :(
 
squatting dog said:
All you say may be true, but, here are the statistics for the top 10 killers in the USA for 2018......2,839,205 dead. That's an awful lot of people who have died and yet... silence. What exactly is it that makes people think this one is so much worse? Hint.... media
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Apples and oranges. We can agree to disagree, I'll leave it at that.
 
Also, this is America, you are not losing your civil liberties by being asked to act responsibly during a COVID-19 Pandemic, something we haven't encountered here in our lifetime. If you're in China, and they lock you in your house, check on you every day by force, and put you in prison or worse for stepping out of your house, then yes, that is losing your rights.
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Good answer, SeaBreeze. I thought about that also after I posted my reply to Squatting Dog. China is apparently a police state, and I feel sorry for the people who are not only caught up in this horrible pandemic over there, but are also under the thumb of a draconian police force. Locking people up or having armed police forcing them to stay inside is a violation of basic human rights. Asking people to cooperate with what all the health officials are saying is the only way we have at present of stopping this is not a violation of anything! The only people (thankfully, a small number) who think it is, are living in a childish fantasy.
 
Ronni said:
I have a medically trained family member who is also a first responder and he and friends who are on the front lines. I've received first hand reports of the heinous nature of this virus and the wretched way people are sickening and dying from it. I don't want to go out that way, so I choose to keep myself safe based on my own research and understanding of the virus and its spread.

How is that choice violating my civil liberties? YOUR choice hampers my ability to keep myself safe. My choice is a REACTION, in part, to your lack of responsibility becuase now I'm now only having to keep myself safe from the virus, I'm also having to keep myself safe from people like you.
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Exactly the type of programmed robot they want you to be.
 
win231 said:
Exactly the type of programmed robot they want you to be.
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My son has no deep seated heinous motive to turn me into a robot! Good Lord, use your brain!!

He’s my son. He’s a first responder. He’s medically trained. He has seen, up close and personally, the devastating effects of this virus. HE’S TRYING TO KEEP ME ALIVE!!!!!

I simply cannot imagine the kind of dysfunctional relationship you must have with your own children, if you have any, to ascribe such evil motives to mine.

I am sorry for you. 😟
 
After a couple or several seasons of Covid 19 they won't be so stringent with the rules. They'll have a magic vaccine by then too, so it will be on you if you die from it.
 
The OP seems like a typical reaction to a situation where a tight grip has been in force long enough to cause a breaking. That grip was necessary for at least 3 weeks to give us time to figure some things out, but now may be the time to loosen it a little for some.

This virus can be devastating to large cities whereas more sprawling areas are lightly affected. I remember over a month ago hearing Gov. Cuomo of NYC warning the rest of the country that we would have the same sort of numbers as NYC in a few weeks. Fortunately, it hasn't played out that way and (knock wood) it stays that way. I'm in a rural/suburban area living about 30 miles from Orlando, and things here are completely different than in NYC. Florida has a very low percentage of deaths statewise in comparison -- Florida 5 deaths per 100,000 and New York 83 deaths per 100,000. The US is so diverse in our living environments that there is no one-size-fits-all.

I see nothing wrong with a very slow but smart re-opening of areas that are lightly affected as long as special precautions are followed. The numbers would have to be watched very closely to make sure the health care system could accommodate any increase in cases. Also, returning to work should be voluntary rather than forced.

Personally, I have no need or desire for things to open back up quickly. We don't work anymore, and we're able to bike and walk in the sunshine every day. Walmart curbside pickup is great for getting groceries. Husband and I even cut each other's hair. For us, it wouldn't make sense to put ourselves and others at risk by going out. However, I realize it's different for others especially those who need to go out to make a living. I'm content staying in but as long as others aren't putting anyone at risk or taxing the healthcare system, then I believe they should be allowed to try re-opening slowly and safely.
 
Red Cinders said:
The OP seems like a typical reaction to a situation where a tight grip has been in force long enough to cause a breaking. That grip was necessary for at least 3 weeks to give us time to figure some things out, but now may be the time to loosen it a little for some.

This virus can be devastating to large cities whereas more sprawling areas are lightly affected. I remember over a month ago hearing Gov. Cuomo of NYC warning the rest of the country that we would have the same sort of numbers as NYC in a few weeks. Fortunately, it hasn't played out that way and (knock wood) it stays that way. I'm in a rural/suburban area living about 30 miles from Orlando, and things here are completely different than in NYC. Florida has a very low percentage of deaths statewise in comparison -- Florida 5 deaths per 100,000 and New York 83 deaths per 100,000. The US is so diverse in our living environments that there is no one-size-fits-all.

I see nothing wrong with a very slow but smart re-opening of areas that are lightly affected as long as special precautions are followed. The numbers would have to be watched very closely to make sure the health care system could accommodate any increase in cases. Also, returning to work should be voluntary rather than forced.

Personally, I have no need or desire for things to open back up quickly. We don't work anymore, and we're able to bike and walk in the sunshine every day. Walmart curbside pickup is great for getting groceries. Husband and I even cut each other's hair. For us, it wouldn't make sense to put ourselves and others at risk by going out. However, I realize it's different for others especially those who need to go out to make a living. I'm content staying in but as long as others aren't putting anyone at risk or taxing the healthcare system, then I believe they should be allowed to try re-opening slowly and safely.
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You make valid points.

Understand, I have no objection to folks taking reasoned and reasonable steps to slowly return to as normal a life as possible, keeping in mind the recommended guidelines. And while your choices in this regard might be different than mine, we would each be taking into account our own environments, both personal and regional, death/infection/recovery statistics in our areas, and how our choices will impact friends, family, neighborhood etc.

That is VERY different than an hysterical reaction and rebellion to THE GOVMINT taking away our liberties, and I'LL DO WHAT I DAMN WELL WANT, and Y'ALL ARE PROGRAMMED ROBOTS and the rest of the dreck ad nauseam.

Even that, EVEN THAT, if that's the way folks want to think, that's fine. I respect your right to think however you want, whether I disagree or not, right up to the point where you want to take the way you think AND SHOVE IT DOWN MY THROAT. At that point all bets are off. :mad:
 
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Half the deaths are in New York or New Jersey, where people live cheek by jowl. I believe that's important to note. I hope we can be sensible about this without completely surrendering our rights.
 
This may seem to be a little bit off topic, but it isn't, really. After reading through this thread, I started thinking about the subject of personal rights and freedom. The more I thought, the more I realized that we really don't have absolute freedom, far from it. And that's as it should be.

People who are living like hermits in the middle of a wilderness, all alone, may have a bit more "freedom" than people living among other people, but even there it isn't absolute. What if they demand the freedom to burn down the forest?

And, if you're living as part of a social milieu with other human beings, you can't,,,,

Walk naked down a city street.

Walk, even fully clothed, down the middle of a busy interstate, because you just felt like taking a walk.

Raise lions in your suburban back yard.

Play loud music through a loudspeaker on your front porch in your suburban neighborhood, at 2 AM.

Start a bonfire in the living room of your apartment.

Interfere with the democratically elected workings of government, or other people's right to vote.

Commit a felony because you think the law against that felony is "unfair."

I'm sure you can think of many other examples. So, what makes it a "live free or die" issue to deliberately endanger the health of other people?
 
If anyone fears this virus [that bad] I understand that but....in that case limit yourself, lay-down restrictions....for yourself. Stop telling me what I must do. Some people are really hurting [financially] and really can not go any longer without a paycheck....as such, they need to get back to work if at all possible.

Calls to suicide hot lines are on the rise, domestic violence is on the rise,drinking [alcohol] is on the rise, etc & so-on. We [our nation] really does need to get back to some normalcy .
 
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