Question for the Atheist

gruntlabor said:
:) You're on the right site, and we never stop talking politics. I don't know how we get away with it.
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We talk issues that may or may not have a political element, but we do not sink to vote for X or Y. Years ago, pending retirement, I began posting in a retirement news group, and over time saw it consumed, and eventually destroyed, by a total commitment to pure politics. The managers of this forum are well aware that the same fate would be in-store for this group if politics was literally allowed to devour us.
 

Sunny said:
Think about it; from the words that Beethoven set to music in his 9th Symphony: "Uber sternen muss er wohnen." (Above the stars He must live.) What a beautiful way of putting it, though it makes no sense scientifically. But it's pure poetry.

So, as a musician friend of mine once put it, maybe my religion is music!
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Of course it is! Once you become enamoured of something and fascinated by its influence on life, it becomes a non-corporeal entity. It becomes something with a distinct and independent existence, and that is why music and poetry are so prominent in religion, especially in mysticism.
 

Jeffry Dohmar devoured people, perhaps eating more red meat will make us run faster and jump higher to reach the designated crown of humorous admiration.. You saw Dinner of Smucks? Convincing smucks they are popular and worthy of winning via competition they haven’t a clue of the mockery taking place.

Who are we to know which side we stand among our peers? Who are we laughing at and why do we continue to play the game when clearly there are no winners, it’s not even a race, life consists of trial and tribulations that mold us into whatever we become. Sadly we are taught to get ahead in life we must surpass our neighbor and by doing so we are superior.
What if society acted as one instead of EVERY-ONE?, we are not wired that way. Every person for themself. I am guilty of not helping others, primarily because times are different now and I don’t know the world as well as I did before. Older and weaker, I might not be able to defend myself or run away.
 
You have heard of the "Butterfly Effect".? "The butterfly effect is the idea that small, seemingly trivial events may ultimately result in something with much larger consequences – in other words, they have non-linear impacts on very complex systems. For instance, when a butterfly flaps its wings in India, that tiny change in air pressure could eventually cause a tornado in Iowa." Duck-Go

It is more than likely that the smallest act of kindness will have some major impact down the road. In contrast our acts of pride and selfishness towards others will have a negative impact down the road. I hope that people are free enough to chose the former.
 
Mr. Ed said:
Jeffry Dohmar devoured people, perhaps eating more red meat will make us run faster and jump higher to reach the designated crown of humorous admiration.. You saw Dinner of Smucks? Convincing smucks they are popular and worthy of winning via competition they haven’t a clue of the mockery taking place.

Who are we to know which side we stand among our peers? Who are we laughing at and why do we continue to play the game when clearly there are no winners, it’s not even a race, life consists of trial and tribulations that mold us into whatever we become. Sadly we are taught to get ahead in life we must surpass our neighbor and by doing so we are superior.
What if society acted as one instead of EVERY-ONE?, we are not wired that way. Every person for themself. I am guilty of not helping others, primarily because times are different now and I don’t know the world as well as I did before. Older and weaker, I might not be able to defend myself or run away.
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:) All we can do with what we have no control over is to force our attention from these dark thoughts elsewhere to the positive, the wholesome, the cheerful, the productive, the helpful ...
**IF there is no solution, THEN there is no problem. --Marcel Duchamp paraphrased**
 
Gary O' said:
You've been told wrong
There is no eternal suffering
That's not Biblical
There's just eternal death
You won't be coming back
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Given this run through, that's not a bad thing. :D

And I'm not a biblical scholar (for obvious reasons), however, what about Matt. 25:41, and Matt. 25:46?
 
Paco Dennis said:
You have heard of the "Butterfly Effect".? "The butterfly effect is the idea that small, seemingly trivial events may ultimately result in something with much larger consequences – in other words, they have non-linear impacts on very complex systems. For instance, when a butterfly flaps its wings in India, that tiny change in air pressure could eventually cause a tornado in Iowa." Duck-Go

It is more than likely that the smallest act of kindness will have some major impact down the road. In contrast our acts of pride and selfishness towards others will have a negative impact down the road. I hope that people are free enough to chose the former.
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I love the idea of The Butterfly Effect. It perfectly shows how intricately related everything is. Yes, even the all of us meeting here, on this forum, at this exact time. It's all in the scheme of things.
 
VaughanJB said:
I love the idea of The Butterfly Effect. It perfectly shows how intricately related everything is. Yes, even the all of us meeting here, on this forum, at this exact time. It's all in the scheme of things.
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Choosing to meet on the Senior Forum is an act that coincides with all the activity on the planet in the now. We create our reality by how we respond to our situation. When we respond by indifference and callousness it creates a world of doubt and strife. When we respond with compassion and caring we create a world of human well being.
 
Paco Dennis said:
Choosing to meet on the Senior Forum is an act that coincides with all the activity on the planet in the now. We create our reality by how we respond to our situation. When we respond by indifference and callousness it creates a world of doubt and strife. When we respond with compassion and caring we create a world of human well being.
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Oh dear. No wonder I've already got a seat booked in hell. :( 🔥
 
VaughanJB said:
what about Matt. 25:41
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Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Everlasting fire
It won't be extinguished
It'll burn everything up

VaughanJB said:
and Matt. 25:46?
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And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

It's the second death
That death will be everlasting
They'll be gone......forever
 
Gary O' said:
Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Everlasting fire
It won't be extinguished
It'll burn everything up


And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

It's the second death
That death will be everlasting
They'll be gone......forever
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Which points to eternal, no? Otherwise, what is "everlasting"?

Mind you, let's face it, people love to interpret the Bible in many different ways. I guess we'll find out at a time hopefully distant in the future.
 
VaughanJB said:
Mind you, let's face it, people love to interpret the Bible in many different ways. I guess we'll find out at a time hopefully distant in the future.
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Forgive me @VaughanJB

My eyes are gone for the day (AMD)
There are many pertinent Bible texts concerning hell and death
But I've gotta rest what's left of these eyes of mine

There is one that comes to mind

It's in Ecclesiastes 9

3 This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead.
4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
 
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Gary O' said:
It's in Ecclesiastes 9

3 This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead.
4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
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These were wise words from long ago. So it is better to be "joined to all the living" by the sound of it, and know that we die, hopefully making us humble and wise. That way, we cling less, let our hatred and envy fade in this life, and see an affinity with all living creatures. Kohelet advises us that the words of the wise are sometimes hard, but we need the "goads and pricks" like stubborn creatures, in order to follow wisdom.
 
Gary O' said:
Forgive me @VaughanJB

My eyes are gone for the day (AMD)
There are many pertinent Bible texts concerning hell and death
But I've gotta rest what's left of these eyes of mine

There is one that comes to mind

It's in Ecclesiastes 9

3 This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead.
4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
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No problem, man. Honestly, let's not even debate Bible verses and their meaning. Frankly, I'm not qualified, and neither are many of the people who claim to be (I've seen too many instances of so called "preachers" making verses mean whatever they want them to mean in a given circumstance). Preachers, I've found, are the very worst in selling their agenda in a package of re-re-re interpretations of the words of the Bible.

And no, I do NOT include you in that comment.

As I say, I'm not qualified to dissect the Bible. In this particular instance though, an eternity of suffering is indeed something I've seen taught many times.
 
davey said:
haven't the ten commandments always stood the test of time? - and we can all still remember and recite them heh?
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I just wrote I don't want to get into it, but...... the Ten Commandments have their own issues. For example, they're in the Old Testament, and we now have a NEW testament. There's a lot of heinous stuff in the Old Testament, but of course, people like to cherry pick it and claim that some bits still apply. The Ten Commandments are a case in point. As far as I know, they don't appear as such in the New Testament, but rather they're "numerous times in different ways".

I just hate the cherry picking. Scholars have discussed this many times, and I'm not one of them! :D
 
OT and NT??? these are just abreactions - meaningless when compared but essential when read as a full novel?? there is a full thread that needs to be read and cherished - cherrypicking gives one hallucinations?
 
VaughanJB said:
There's a lot of heinous stuff in the Old Testament, but of course, people like to cherry pick it and claim that some bits still apply. The Ten Commandments are a case in point.
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There is a lot of heinous stuff in all epic literature. The difference is that people don't think other stuff is historical, whereas too many assume that the OT is and try to bring it in line with the NT. That is where the term "cherrypicking" applies.
 
Stoppelmann said:
There is a lot of heinous stuff in all epic literature. The difference is that people don't think other stuff is historical, whereas too many assume that the OT is and try to bring it in line with the NT. That is where the term "cherrypicking" applies.
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Well sure, if the assumption is that the Old and New Testaments are fiction - then there's no issue whatsoever about what's in it.

However, when it comes to a God belief, it goes beyond that, since this is supposed to be the words of our actual creator.

I find preachers, and especially those you find on the net, endlessly fascinating. They are so corrupt, yet influential. And their corruption is easy to spot too, it's not as though they hide it. Instead they peddle their various agenda's in politics and in society in the guise of having a deep understanding on what the words of the Old Testament and New Testament actually mean. It's a big circus. But really entertaining as well. :D
 
well we all have our own circuses to peddle don't we in some form ?? that's why we have these ilustrious avatars to show how we may wanna be a circus master??
 
VaughanJB said:
... the Ten Commandments have their own issues. For example, they're in the Old Testament, and we now have a NEW testament.
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Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. --Matthew 5:17–18
 

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