School shooting in Madison, WI

January said:
Yet another school shooting in US :(

When I was a teenager I dont think my parents could read my mind either, nor could I when my kids were teenagers

I don't think it is fair to jump to blaming the parents.
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What else IS it then? LIFE isn't fair! SOMEone did something wrong!
A parent has 100% responsibility for whatever their kid does until that kid is 18; and ACCOUNTABILITY.
What a kid does is a reflection on the parents; if something bad or terrible happens then the parent let it happen on their "Watch".

Society is NOT responsible for raising a child, a parent is. Parents need to get their sh*t together!

Had four kids of my own. And it really gets my fur up watching parents NOT parent today. It is ridiculous.

It took 110% of my energy to build their character, their values, their integrity, their sense of right and wrong. It takes a lot of time, being there, being receptive, being aware, listening and watching their conversations when they were on the phone; screening their friends, what is going on every minute, parental effort in making rules and boundaries and then enforcing those boundaries at all times, consistently; showing respect both ways, letting them talk, to listen, to vent; not being tied up in my own stuff so much they felt dismissed; it takes MUCH more than what parents today are doing: letting them raise themselves and giving them excuses for bad behavior; letting them listen to crappy music; letting them get exposed to the dregs and dreadful behaviors of all sorts of society. Kids need leaders, good parental leaders, who set examples from HOME that the kid matters. I could just LOOK in my kid's eyes and tell if they were being clear with me and I wasn't afraid to make my kid upset if it meant they would LEARN the correct behavior. I wasn't supposed to be their "friend" - I was to be their ROCK and didn't take CRAP off them.

I may sound harsh and unloving but parenting isn't some warm fuzzy occupation. You are dealing with lives, those of your children and those of anyone who comes in contact with them, until they are 18-21 and out from under your watch.

Sometimes parents just give a kid a phone, computer, computer games, music downloads - and parents don't even CHECK what the words are saying, etc too many paretns just let them hang out and do whatever, see or follow whatever...parents do not pay enough COVERT attention.because it is for the parent's convenience. Computers, cell phones, inane violent/disgusting bloody video games for hours and hours take up mind space of the kids.

Careers have become more important to mothers than their kids. And yes, I say mothers. Career or kid? Which will it be, because men are SELDOM the ones who will ultimately step up to the plate to be at home 24/7.

PARENTING IS NOT A PART TIME JOB.

The hand that rocks the cradle...

Sorry if this is seen as a "rant" but kids need to feel important enough a parent has one focus - a focus in a smart way.
 

In her manifesto, which she called "War Against Humanity," Natalie Rupnow wrote that she had "grown to hate people and society" and called her parents "scum."

She also wrote that she acquired weapons "by lies and manipulation, and my father's stupidity" and described wanting to die by suicide, but feeling like carrying out a shooting was "better for evolution rather than just one stupid boring suicide."

How does a 15 year old girl become that jaded and disillusioned with the world? :unsure:
 
HermitHogan said:
In her manifesto, which she called "War Against Humanity," Natalie Rupnow wrote that she had "grown to hate people and society" and called her parents "scum."

She also wrote that she acquired weapons "by lies and manipulation, and my father's stupidity" and described wanting to die by suicide, but feeling like carrying out a shooting was "better for evolution rather than just one stupid boring suicide."

How does a 15 year old girl become that jaded and disillusioned with the world? :unsure:
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The internet.
 

Children need to be protected from the internet because the internet and any other devices are a source of input to their brain. A young brain is not made to process things (especially bad things) which the brain is not developed enough to process. When developing children's brains see and hear negative things, traumatic things, scary things, the chemicals released affect the development of the brain. The brain is a VERY sensitive organ in children under 18, boys until 21.

All this bad STUFF being discussed so publicly these days is just creating traumatized brains from a young age.
Parents need to be better gate keepers of protecting children's developing minds!
 
Example of bad things/situations that should be kept away from children's hearing/seeing/viewing/exposure to:
Parents arguing in front of them.
Being placed in a divorcing scenario, told to make choices they are too young to be making.
Disgusting behaviors, language, negative words.
Pornography.
Stories about murders and killings.
Parental anxieties, mental conditions, money worries
Blood, gore, frightening horror shows
Scary things like these HUGE skeletons and gore people put out in their yards on Halloween.

For every bad thing a child experiences, they must see 50 good things. The human brain keeps track of more bad experiences than good, it builds up in children's brains, like a toxin. Bad is more permanent in the human brain than good, because recognizing bad events is a survival mechanism. But kids do not need to know "bad" and fear producing situations before the are about 7 because they are supposed to be protected from ANY bad until age 11 or when the brain gets what is called "crystallized" memory and function.

If children are exposed to bad things, bad news, bad situations, ugly things in life, their brain records those frightening or threatening things, it skyrockets chemicals in the brain, bathing the young brain in chemicals that are toxic to normal brain development. As time goes on and more bad experiences happen, this creates a brain that has skewed ways to process information. It is also especially bad to have high levels of both cortisol, and adrenaline bathing the young brain of humans.

Another thing parents do is not take the fact children's brains need a lot of REGULAR and predictable sleep, healthy food, and plenty of exercise and sunshine hours; and PLAY.

Year after passing year I note MORE children in stores and out at night (with parents and without parents) being dragged around at 7, 8, 9,10, midnight, grocery shopping or taken to movies (with an 13 or R rating for violence and sex scenes..). Sleep and scheduled naps for children used to be seen as "sacred" in child rearing. Not any more...! Seems parents could care LESS!

Am more and more happy less and less children are being born in the US. With parenting like this, why have a child?
 
CooCooforCoCoPuffs said:
What else IS it then? LIFE isn't fair! SOMEone did something wrong!
A parent has 100% responsibility for whatever their kid does until that kid is 18; and ACCOUNTABILITY.
What a kid does is a reflection on the parents; if something bad or terrible happens then the parent let it happen on their "Watch".
Click to expand...


I disagree.

parents can only do their best - they are not mind readers and they cannot control their teenagers every move. What a kid does is a reflection on them - good parents can have difficult kids who make poor decisions too

I agree with poster upthread - without specific supporting evidence - ie evidence the parents did actually did something specific that contributed to this, then witch hunting them is not right.
 
I agree with everything @CooCooforCoCoPuffs has said about what constitutes good parenting, I just don't think that we can blame this school shooter's parents for what has happened.

For all we know they did see that their daughter had serious problems and were doing what they thought was best for her (I think guns in the home of any teen is risky but that's another subject.) They may well have put her in a Christian school because they noticed she needed more discipline.

Parents can be aware that their child is struggling without thinking they might go to school and shoot people.
 
Each time I read about a school shooting, I get a flashback to the shooting here in PA in a small Amish town called West Nickel Mine. On that day, 11 little girls were shot with 5 being killed of which, 2 were sisters. It was a terrible day.

I was the second Trooper on the scene. The other Trooper and I Iwere getting ready to enter the school when the last bullet was fired, which turned out to be the killer shooting himself. I never seen so many frightened little girls. Many of them were crying.

The boys had all been sent outside and the shooter only wanted the girls to remain in the building. It’s hard to believe that it has been 18 years ago since the day of the shootings.

I helped wheel the little girls out to the ambulances while on the gurneys. Since that day, the school has been destroyed and a new school has been built at an unknown location, except for first responders.

You keep asking yourself, Why? Why?
 
Della said:
I agree with everything @CooCooforCoCoPuffs has said about what constitutes good parenting, I just don't think that we can blame this school shooter's parents for what has happened.

For all we know they did see that their daughter had serious problems and were doing what they thought was best for her (I think guns in the home of any teen is risky but that's another subject.) They may well have put her in a Christian school because they noticed she needed more discipline.

Parents can be aware that their child is struggling without thinking they might go to school and shoot people.
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The idiot father bought his daughter the gun she used in the shooting for her 15th birthday!
 
There is probably a lot more backstory here. But that's probably true of most of these school shootings.

Sitting in a circle with ear trumpets craned, gumming out "The Internet" at each other is as dumb as it is predictable.

I'm not religious, but trying to tar that as the source of extremism feels like a real stretch. I can't think of any where a core tenet involves the worthlessness of others and yourself or advocacy of violent acts.

She could just as easily have driven a car into a group of fellow students.

I suspect a big piece of this is media in general, spouting gloom and doom and painting a hopeless vision of the future. Couple that with hereditary guilting over past generations and young people are already in a precarious emotional state when some adversity triggers an extreme response. Schools are not helping when they just double down on this messaging.
 
So basically, Big Pharma, the Medical / Psychic / Hospitals / Schools should be always held responsible?
Only they could have caused a difference. The Depressed, crazy, insane kids should be held in a cage in
the basement until all grown-ups. Showers above the cages to soak the kids every time they start screaming!

No more newspaper boys and Girls routes. It's the Cell phones and Microwaves near the brain. It being
in extra dimensional delusions. That's it Disillusioned - Dimensions - insanity.

Why don't the shoot themselves first is the illusional question.
 
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hollydolly said:
This was posted on the shooters' fathers fcebook page back in August of this year...his daughter clay pigeon shooting.

93227231-14200813-Rupnow_was_seemingly_encouraged_to_handle_and_fire_guns_by_her_f-m-22_1734442025787.jpg



This is the father

93227299-14200813-Police_confirmed_they_were_talking_with_Jeff_Rupnow_pictured_and-a-4_1734435589671.jpg

Police, who identified Rupnow as the shooter on Monday are still investing the motive behind her rampage. Officers raided the family's home and are sifting through a manifesto that she may have left behind.

The details come amid online speculation over Rupnow's gender identity after Madison Police Chief Shon Barnes sparked fury by claiming that whether or not she is transgender is 'not important at all' to the investigation into the shooting.

Barnes also raised the possibility of Rupnow's parents facing charges, following the imprisonment of James and Jennifer Crumbley earlier this year that opened the door to prosecutions of school shooter parents.

Barnes said at Monday's press conference: 'We also want to look at if the parents may have been negligent. And that’s a question that we’ll have to answer with our district attorney’s office.'
Also the T-shirt seems to be significant...
Observers noted Rupnow's daughter appeared to be wearing a t-shirt of the German industrial rock band KMFDM, who were notably idolized by Eric Harris (pictured) and Dylan Klebold, the perpetrators of the Columbine High School massacre

93233661-14200813-image-m-32_1734442954006.jpg

93233669-14200813-image-a-33_1734442996069.jpg

Rupnow was present from the start of the school day on Monday and eventually opened fire on a study hall full of students from various grades, Chief Barnes said.

Investigators believe Rupnow used a 9mm pistol to carry out her attack, a law enforcement official told AP. The official spoke on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the ongoing investigation.

A motive for the shooting was not immediately known, nor was it clear if the victims were targeted, Barnes said during a press conference Monday.
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The trap shooting with homes so close, the fathers most likely got something wrong to. 12 gauge shot lands in those ranges when duck hunting.
 
CooCooforCoCoPuffs said:
What else IS it then? LIFE isn't fair! SOMEone did something wrong!
A parent has 100% responsibility for whatever their kid does until that kid is 18; and ACCOUNTABILITY.
What a kid does is a reflection on the parents; if something bad or terrible happens then the parent let it happen on their "Watch".

Society is NOT responsible for raising a child, a parent is. Parents need to get their sh*t together!

Had four kids of my own. And it really gets my fur up watching parents NOT parent today. It is ridiculous.

It took 110% of my energy to build their character, their values, their integrity, their sense of right and wrong. It takes a lot of time, being there, being receptive, being aware, listening and watching their conversations when they were on the phone; screening their friends, what is going on every minute, parental effort in making rules and boundaries and then enforcing those boundaries at all times, consistently; showing respect both ways, letting them talk, to listen, to vent; not being tied up in my own stuff so much they felt dismissed; it takes MUCH more than what parents today are doing: letting them raise themselves and giving them excuses for bad behavior; letting them listen to crappy music; letting them get exposed to the dregs and dreadful behaviors of all sorts of society. Kids need leaders, good parental leaders, who set examples from HOME that the kid matters. I could just LOOK in my kid's eyes and tell if they were being clear with me and I wasn't afraid to make my kid upset if it meant they would LEARN the correct behavior. I wasn't supposed to be their "friend" - I was to be their ROCK and didn't take CRAP off them.

I may sound harsh and unloving but parenting isn't some warm fuzzy occupation. You are dealing with lives, those of your children and those of anyone who comes in contact with them, until they are 18-21 and out from under your watch.

Sometimes parents just give a kid a phone, computer, computer games, music downloads - and parents don't even CHECK what the words are saying, etc too many paretns just let them hang out and do whatever, see or follow whatever...parents do not pay enough COVERT attention.because it is for the parent's convenience. Computers, cell phones, inane violent/disgusting bloody video games for hours and hours take up mind space of the kids.

Careers have become more important to mothers than their kids. And yes, I say mothers. Career or kid? Which will it be, because men are SELDOM the ones who will ultimately step up to the plate to be at home 24/7.

PARENTING IS NOT A PART TIME JOB.

The hand that rocks the cradle...

Sorry if this is seen as a "rant" but kids need to feel important enough a parent has one focus - a focus in a smart way.
Click to expand...
This is a bit judgmental, @CocoCooforCoCoPuffs.
 
HermitHogan said:
She grew up in an unstable home. The parents divorced and then remarried each other several times. She was shifted back and forth between parents. Add to that, religious indoctrination and gun fanaticism. It's not surprising she wasn't well adjusted.
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Maybe she had NO moral upbringing at all. You can send a kid to all the religious based schools you want, but if the ten commandments are not practiced by the parents - or the parents are religious hypocrites you get a kid with anger and resentment. It has nothing to DO with your bias on religious teachings. You use two terms "indoctrination" and "fanaticism".

I have yet to meet a gun "fanaticist". It isn't the gun. It is the shooter that is the problem and a parent that CLEARLY made a lot of false assumptions.
 
squatting dog said:
Social media has taken the social out of society.
Let's call it what it really is... Anti-social media. :(
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Cannot agree with this more.
It would not surprise me at ALL if she had been teased and bullied on the internet.
Teasing and bullying used to be done only in person, or behind one's back, etc.
Now days bullying is rampant.
Only she knew what was bothering her, what pushed her over the edge.
Fifteen year old girls may be even more dangerous than a 15 year old boy.

I had two daughters, I had me and my THREE sisters and my grand daughters with raging TEEN PMS! It is real.

I thought they had lost their minds some days of each month!
 
papa tiger said:
The trap shooting with homes so close, the fathers most likely got something wrong to. 12 gauge shot lands in those ranges when duck hunting.
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Looks like a legal trap range set up to me...I see an old barn close; but a S/T range doesn't need the parameters a rifle/pistol range needs, does it?
 

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