Shoot To Kill Looters

When I was young there were such things as Orphans Homes. One was near where I grew up. It was a small city of itself, had farm lands, laundry, cafeteria, medical center, schools for young and up through high school. All the children came out disciplined and educated. Why that approach for taking children off the streets was ended, I never heard. It seemed to do a good job for the children and the community in general. My Junior High school principal was a graduate of the Orphans Home. So they did come out proper and interested in doing better.

If we don't teach these current generations proper and respectable ways to live, there will never be any improvement in their life styles.

I may have the name of that operation wrong, I called it Orphans Home and it may have been Juniors Home.
 

QuickSilver said:
Not mention... there has been a huge loss of jobs over the last 35 years... mostly due to bad trade agreements and legislation favorable to allowing corporations to move production to other countries..

manpayrolls.png


Time was, a young person could get a job in a factory and support a family.. He could get on right out of high school. Not now.. Most good paying jobs require a college degree.. or at least some college.

SO... we take lack of education... along with lack of good paying jobs in areas like manufacturing... and we have what we have now. pockets of poverty and no family structure.. I think the solution lies in getting education and jobs into the poor areas... and NOT minimum wage jobs... GOOD paying jobs...


How do people take responsibilities and "pull themselves up by their boot straps" when we have taken away the boots?
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Very important aspect to point out QuickSilver, there has been a great income inequality between rich and poor, and businesses that once offered jobs in these areas, have moved out or overseas. The people affected have lost hope, even the ones who try hard to make ends meet, often fight a losing battle.

I heard this author speak about the loss of the American Dream, and how we have to work to get it back for everyone, not only the rich, who have "airbags" around their kids. When their kid wrecks the car, gets strung out on drugs, or gets involved with an assault or burglary charge, mommy and daddy have plenty of money to bail them out of jail, get them good lawyers, send them off to a fancy rehab facility, etc. The poor citizens in America don't have that option, and they don't have it due to circumstances in their cities that are out of their control.

I heard that the Baltimore police department paid out large amounts of money to settle past cases of abuse, all that money could have been spent on community centers, programs, etc. that would help guide the young people not to resign themselves to failure due to their environment. All that past abusive behavior by the police, which they had to settle on, has created what is taking place today.

Just because these kids don't have fathers in the picture, doesn't mean they should be kicked to the curb and written off as losses. The single mother who is out working all day to pay the bills and struggling to get through life with her family, should be able to get a job with decent pay. The folks more well off can devote some time to mentor a teen and help them to feel hope again.

http://robertdputnam.com/

http://robertdputnam.com/about-our-kids/our-kids-in-the-news/
 
I may have the name of that operation wrong, I called it Orphans Home and it may have been Juniors Home.
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The term was Children's Home back where I grew up, or Orphanage. Sure there are some success stories, but there was also lots of abuse. Everyone raised in such places does not automatically become a shining success story. But kids can't just be taken away and herded to an orphanage. Aside from the legal aspect, there are financial and monitoring considerations.
 

BobF said:
When I was young there were such things as Orphans Homes. One was near where I grew up. It was a small city of itself, had farm lands, laundry, cafeteria, medical center, schools for young and up through high school. All the children came out disciplined and educated. Why that approach for taking children off the streets was ended, I never heard. It seemed to do a good job for the children and the community in general. My Junior High school principal was a graduate of the Orphans Home. So they did come out proper and interested in doing better.

If we don't teach these current generations proper and respectable ways to live, there will never be any improvement in their life styles.

I may have the name of that operation wrong, I called it Orphans Home and it may have been Juniors Home.
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So let me understand Bob... To solve the problem of undisciplined children running the streets, these children of single parent homes should be rounded up and put in homes.. like you describe.. ? If so... then I guess you would not mind a big tax increase to PAY for housing, feeding, educating, clothing as well as the medical and dental care these kids need?
 
BobF said:
When I was young there were such things as Orphans Homes. One was near where I grew up. It was a small city of itself, had farm lands, laundry, cafeteria, medical center, schools for young and up through high school. All the children came out disciplined and educated. Why that approach for taking children off the streets was ended, I never heard. It seemed to do a good job for the children and the community in general. My Junior High school principal was a graduate of the Orphans Home. So they did come out proper and interested in doing better.

If we don't teach these current generations proper and respectable ways to live, there will never be any improvement in their life styles.

I may have the name of that operation wrong, I called it Orphans Home and it may have been Juniors Home.
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Unfortunately a number of them ended, not sure why all, but, several ended due to a lot of abuse seeping in. Here in Florida, they're still digging up bones of the youth who disappeared at the hands of some of these places. Unfortunately this abuse wasn't limited to just reform school type settings, one home where a group of nuns were at the helm, were convicted of molestation.

Everyone keeps acting like we live in a society of accountable adults when there's really a veil over the eyes of most, the kids know that there's little to respect as so much corruption is rampant, just prettied up and sugar coated.

What the exact solutions are, I don't have an exact answer, but, it has to start with each person doing their own part to stop escalating and projecting the negative toward an entire group of people based on the acts of certain individuals. I've said it before, I can point out the worst of the worst of all of what ails this society bit by bit and what's pulling it apart and it sure isn't just what's going on in the black families, there have been abandonment issues in other groups for years black, white and other, the catholic churches have the food bank rolls to prove it especially those fathers that drank their paychecks away while the families starved.

What is going on in this Baltimore community is deplorable, the curfew is a start, I hope they will be able to enforce it, I think more people in that community, those people with a vested interest in it's survival no matter the color of their skin need to come up with a plan, more parents and other adults definitely need to get off their backsides and take charge of their family members they spot out there and handle the situation.

Maybe some stricter laws need to be in place all around when it comes to kids roaming these streets if some adults won't handle these kids, I have some not so pc thoughts on the whole procreation thing, but, I'll not push that button, but, yes, China, does come to mind on that one. Some of us really shouldn't be parents, since we aren't actually parenting. The details to work out that call would be a problem though.

But back to the homes for parentless or children needing others to take over guardianship of some sort and why it's been a problem to so extent. The clergy doesn't have the respect from youth as it once may have and frankly, I have complete understanding how this comes to be for many. Again always goes to listen to what I say, avert your eyes from what I actually do, but todays people have eyes everywhere, except for those with their head in the sand. As with other matters, the whole of the clergy isn't tainted, but, for the kids who find themselves at the mercy of people such as those in this story, the numbers are way too high to not understand why so many end up worse off than when they went in.


One of the places where the bodies are still being counted

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2719211/1st-set-remains-IDd-Florida-reform-school.html






 
Somehow, I don't believe the answer is taking peoples kids away from them... OR forced sterilization, OR forced abortion. This isn't China... The answer is Education.. the answer is good paying jobs.. when people can make more money doing illegal things.. than they can working 2 or 3 minimum wage jobs.. what do you expect them to pick? We want more Black men to be involved fathers?.... then let's stop loading up prisons with them for ridiculous things. Close the school to prison pipeline we have now so private corporations running the prisons can make a profit. If we can't get Corporations to stop sending jobs overseas.. let's put people to work building and repairing our infrastructure. There are things that could be done if Washington would just work... and stop being steam rolled by lobbyists and special interests.
 
No, I didn't mean to imply that about children being taken away from their parents, having lived that experience, that's the last thing I meant. I was just responding to what happened to some of these places where kids that had no where to go disappeared to. I hyperventilated just researching orphanages, so no last thing I would suggest be done, but, I get that there are some types of disciplinary academies that do serve a purpose just as the military has served many a wayward person well in some cases..
 
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Here is what's left of the CVS store. My heart goes out to all the business owners, who have lost everything and the families that lived above the burned businesses and are now homeless....so Very, Very, Sad reading their stories and how they worked hard and now it's all gone.
 
The President spoke on the issues, and he made a lot of sense, I agree with all he said . Pointed out some of the things we've already spoken about here regarding the problems and frustrations of the people. Video here. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/04/28/obama-baltimore_n_7162568.html


Obama said the violent protests "distracted" from the largely peaceful protests over the weekend."They were constructive and they were thoughtful," he said of those demonstrations. "And frankly it didn't get much attention. And one burning building will be looped on television ... and the thousands of demonstrators who did it the right way have been lost in the discussion."

It comes up, it seems like, once a week now. Or once every couple of weeks. So I think its pretty understandable why the leaders of civil rights organizations, but more importantly moms and dads, might start saying this is a crisis. What I'd say is this has been a slow rolling crisis."
"This is not new," he said. "And we shouldn't pretend this is new."

Obama urged police unions to work with communities and "acknowledge that this is not good for police."

"We can't just leave this to the police. I think there are police departments that have to do some soul-searching. I think there are some communities that have to do so some soul-searching.

But I think we as a country have to do some soul-searching. This is not new. It's been going on for decades," he said. "If we are serious about solving this problem, then we're going to not only help the police, we're going to have to think about what we can do, the rest of us."
He pointed to policy changes including investing in infrastructure, bolstering early education and reforming the criminal justice system.

"That's hard. That requires more than just the occasional news report or task force," he said.

"If we really want to solve the problem, we could, it's just it would require everybody saying this is important, this is significant and that we just don't pay attention to these communities when a CVS burns. And we don't just pay attention when a man gets shot or has his spine snapped."
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Misty said:
Here is what's left of the CVS store. My heart goes out to all the business owners, who have lost everything and the families that lived above the burned businesses and are now homeless....so Very, Very, Sad reading their stories and how they worked hard and now it's all gone.
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My heart goes out to all the business that have been looted and burned, and all the good people that rioting like this affects, it's heartbreaking. I've seen many on the news helping with the clean up and speaking about some positive things that need to be done in the community. As President Obama said, this is not new and we shouldn't say it is, it's been a slow rolling crisis in many urban communities across America, and it needs to be addressed.

He also mentioned how the news ignores all the thoughtful and peaceful demonstrations, because putting the CVS store and the burning cars on the 'loop' is the drama that draws viewers, that's what sells on these news networks. It's discouraging that you have to hunt down any reports of anything positive going on in Baltimore, by all the good concerned citizens there.

Obama said the violent protests "distracted" from the largely peaceful protests over the weekend."They were constructive and they were thoughtful," he said of those demonstrations. "And frankly it didn't get much attention. And one burning building will be looped on television ... and the thousands of demonstrators who did it the right way have been lost in the discussion."
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QuickSilver said:
Yet... does ANYONE know why Freddie Grey was killed? What crime was he committing? What did he do to cause police to severe his spine, and crush his larynx? Does anyone know? My guess is he was guilty of running while black.
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SeaBreeze said:
What was the reason they went after him anyway, did they arrest him, break his spine and kill him just because he was running?
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Guess you must be right QS, I had the same question but can only hear the crickets. I thought it was because I really haven't been watching that much news this past week, and thought I might have missed the reason he was initially stopped. Well today, the news reporter said they were still waiting for an answer on that one...what a shame.

With all the secrecy (again), who wouldn't suspect that this was just another case of foulplay by the police department, now they have to come up with an answer to that question, although I can't believe it's taking them this long to give the reason....even if it has to be fabricated in a back room.
 
WHATEVER happened -- It does not excuse or mitigate in any way the rioting and burning and looting. The damage done to the owners and employees of those store and homes that were destroyed and the officers and others who were hurt is just as real and just as inexcusable. This kind of violence does not solve anything -- we just don't have the right to say "what happened here is despicable and unfair so let's go burn down the neighborhood."
 
Butterfly said:
WHATEVER happened -- It does not excuse or mitigate in any way the rioting and burning and looting. The damage done to the owners and employees of those store and homes that were destroyed and the officers and others who were hurt is just as real and just as inexcusable. This kind of violence does not solve anything -- we just don't have the right to say "what happened here is despicable and unfair so let's go burn down the neighborhood."
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I'm not seeing where anyone has said or implied that the rioting & looting were excusable.
 
Police Throw Rocks At Looters

Police caught throwing rocks at looters.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ore-police-officer-threw-rock-protesters.html

If it wasn't so serious this would be childish theater. This is a "Oh yea, take that!" moment. But it gives another glimpse into the mentality of the corrupt/ends justify the means faction of the Baltimore Police Department. It also goes to show when undisciplined police are high on adrenaline they will do anything to make their point and take the respect they should be earning.

There is a reason they are given helmets, shields, weapons and out there in force. They are supposed to be the professionals and not act like a reactionary school yard bully. This is pitiful.
 
OK I give up. All states in the U.S. have laws against using lethal force against Looters. I thought it was legal in some jusristictions. I researched this subject. I would change that law if I could.
 
Wonder about this. As I remember it is possible to use your gun in defense of your property in some states. I was thinking Texas was one such state, plus a few others.

Now I have to go check the laws again. Has some one taken away one of our protected rights?
 
Lon said:
OK I give up. All states in the U.S. have laws against using lethal force against Looters. I thought it was legal in some jusristictions. I researched this subject. I would change that law if I could.
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It appears to me to be a justifiable shooting in many states of the US.

Make my day laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_doctrine

The legal concept of the inviolability of the home has been known in Western Civilization since the age of the Roman Republic.[SUP][2][/SUP] The term derives from the historic English common law dictum that "an Englishman's home is his castle". This concept was established as English law by the 17th century jurist Sir Edward Coke, in his The Institutes of the Laws of England, 1628:[SUP][3][/SUP]
For a man's house is his castle, et domus sua cuique est tutissimum refugium [and each man's home is his safest refuge].[SUP][3][/SUP]
​
The dictum was carried by colonists to the New World, where it has become known as the castle doctrine.[SUP][3][/SUP] The term has been used in England to imply a person's absolute right to exclude anyone from his home, although this has always had restrictions, and since the late twentieth century bailiffs have also had increasing powers of entry.[SUP][4][/SUP]
Another term, the "Make My Day Law", arose in the USA at the time of the 1985 Colorado statute that shielded people from any criminal/civil suits for using force – including deadly force – against an invader of the home.[SUP][5][/SUP] The law's nickname is a reference to the line "Go ahead, make my day" uttered by actor Clint Eastwood's character "Dirty Harry" Callahan (in the 1983 police film Sudden Impact).

Justifiable homicide[SUP][6][/SUP] inside one's home is distinct, as a matter of law, from castle doctrine's no duty to retreat therefrom. Because the mere occurrence of trespassing—and occasionally a subjective requirement of fear—is sufficient to invoke the castle doctrine, the burden of proof of fact is much less challenging than that of justifying a homicide. With a mere justifiable homicide law, one generally must objectively prove to a trier of fact, beyond all reasonable doubt, the intent in the intruder's mind to commit violence or a felony. It would be a misconception of law to infer that because a state has a justifiable homicide provision pertaining to one's domicile, it has a castle doctrine, exonerating any duty whatsoever to retreat therefrom.
 
I thought those laws involved fear for your life, not fear for your property. In fact some people were sent to prison for shooting someone and claiming they feared for their life.
 

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