Shooting of Breonna Taylor, and the "no knock" procedure, plus "stand your ground".

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If not for the activity of the police, Miss Taylor would still be breathing. So, they initiated the events of that night. When Mr. Walker fired at them, and wounded one of them, it was not procedure to blindly shoot the crap out of whoever was in the building. They had no idea of who was on the other side of the door. It could have been a bunch of kids. They didn't even shoot the guy with the gun. But they shot up the next door apartment. Again, they had no idea who was there The fact that one of their own was injured did not give them the license to level the place with bullets. The police acted more like a rival street gang than professional policemen.
 
Butterfly said:
911, I've heard that the police were in plain clothes. Do you know if that is correct? If true, that seems weird, and dangerous for all parties involved.
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I believe that there were two detectives in plain clothes and one patrol officer in uniform and driving his patrol vehicle. I don’t know if he had the lights turned on or not. When serving a warrant, here in PA, the Trooper is required to turn on the vehicle’s blue lights. I don’t know what Kentucky law is.

It saddens me that people don’t follow the rule of law. People like you and I who understand legalities understand these things, but trying to get the average Joe to understand is a huge undertaking. Breonna Taylor’s death was not murder. It was a tragic incident. The police had a warrant, which empowered them to act as they did. When a person decides to hang around thugs, bad things are always likely to happen. The police knew that she was handling money for her ex-bf because they had obtained a bank statement showing large amounts of money being deposited. They also knew that her ex-bf (Glover) was using her apartment from time to time as a place to hide drugs. They knew this from surveillance. Please don’t ask me to site my references. I have read literally dozens of pages on this story and after noting about six different pages, I gave up.

I also think that those people who blame the Kentucky AG for not filing murder charges are just plain wrong. I watched a segment on NBC and CNN where they had some black people who were supposedly important in the black community blaming him for not filing murder charges. It wasn’t up to him. The Grand Jury returned the charge, which they had the power to indict the officers with many different charges, including felony murder, which could have produced a death penalty sentence. So, please leave Mr. Cameron alone.
 

Irwin said:
They were in plain clothes but were wearing police vests. Most of them, anyway, from what I've read.

I don't know. If somebody broke down my door, I'd shoot at them. That's why I own a gun. For protection. To protect my family. And I'm not about to throw up my hands if it's the police who busted down my door. I don't violate any laws and I have a right to not be harassed, although that's not likely to happen since I'm old and a bit of a hermit. But neither Breonna or Taylor were criminals; it was a friend and previous boyfriend of Breonna who was the person of interest.
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Police are required to minimally wear a badge when invoking a warrant. There were two suits and a patrol officer, so one was dressed in uniform.
 
911 said:
Really?? Well, what would you do if someone shot at you and struck your friend who was standing beside you? And, by the way, they did not "initiate the events of the night" as you put it. They were legally serving a warrant. Even by his own admission, Mr. Walker fired the first shot. I cannot believe the heat that Mr. Cameron, AG for Kentucky, is taking for not filing murder charges. He is just following the rule of law. If he filed a murder charge, he would have very little evidence with which to convict. Nothing the cops did were illegal "by law." Using poor judgment or making a bad choice is not against the law.

And BTW, what you also wrote is ridiculous to the tenth power. I doubt if you have any idea as what all goes on prior to a knock-down. There is a lot of planning involved. No one just shows up at the door and kicks it in with guns blazing. This isn't a TV show or a video game.
"The fact that someone could be armed inside the apartment should have been a primary concern to them. They failed to protect the occupants, as well as themselves in the execution of a search warrant."

I also want to add that I do believe Mr. Walker when he stated that he didn't hear the police address themselves. However, that does not and should not not give him (or anyone else) a pass. What's the first rule before you fire your weapon? Identify the target, instead of just coming down the hallway blasting away. You were in the service, right? I guess the Army or whatever branch you were in also makes that clear during basic training. I know that I was taught that in the Marines and also at the Police Academy, which we had to go through a shooting course where there were pop-ups of cardboard dummies. Some where just regular people, kids and animals (cats and dogs) and others were masked intruders or whatever. You didn't want to shoot a regular person. If you did, you failed the course and had to return another day. Three chances to pass or you were out.

Lastly, I am not going to be able to convince anyone that the police were not at fault in this particular case. And, you are not going to be able to convince me otherwise. I just follow the law. What's legal is right and if the cops did something against the law, I would readily admit that they screwed-up. So, when two people cannot agree, it's just best to walk-away.

Bye!
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But, 911... how many more times do families have to endure loosing loved ones to cases of "poor judgement and bad choice"?

How many more times do innocent people need to lose their lives to the nonsensical and asinine practice of police knocking doors down (first) to say hello?
 
I don't believe blowing some one away is an "oops". Tough luck, b****h is not an answer to wildly shooting into an inhabited apartment building. Nor is an association with 'thugs". You cannot deny that blindly shooting into an occupied apartment building without regard to the other tenants is blatantly incompetent, and shows little regard for the lives inside that building. I guess if your neighbor 'hangs around with thugs", bad things will happen to you, too.
This is not the first time we have a police "oops". There is a steady cadence of people loosing their lives in police "oops". Over and over. Year after year. Black Lives Matter is attempting to shine a light on police "oops". But what about the other police involved deaths-whites, latinos? How do we know that they too have lots of "oops"? WE don't have a White lives matter. Yes, there may be many, hopefully most, justified police interactions resulting in death. But.........
Still, you can't deny that the police in the Taylor incident put the lives of the totally innocent people in the next apartment in peril by wildly, and blindly shooting into an occupied building.
 
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fuzzybuddy said:
If not for the activity of the police, Miss Taylor would still be breathing. So, they initiated the events of that night. When Mr. Walker fired at them, and wounded one of them, it was not procedure to blindly shoot the crap out of whoever was in the building. They had no idea of who was on the other side of the door. It could have been a bunch of kids. They didn't even shoot the guy with the gun. But they shot up the next door apartment. Again, they had no idea who was there The fact that one of their own was injured did not give them the license to level the place with bullets. The police acted more like a rival street gang than professional policemen.
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"If not for the activity of the police, Miss Taylor would still be breathing. "

It could also be said that if not for the association with a drug-thug boyfriend ..... She might also still be breathing ?

If a person is going to travel in those circles ?....IMO it opens all sorts of bad doors.
 
Aunt Marg said:
But, 911... how many more times do families have to endure loosing loved ones to cases of "poor judgement and bad choice"?

How many more times do innocent people need to lose their lives to the nonsensical and asinine practice of police knocking doors down (first) to say hello?
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"how many more times do families have to endure loosing loved ones to cases of "poor judgement and bad choice"?

Had their loved ones not made some bad choices/poor judgements , they would have never had bad encounters with the police. Perhaps these families should work from within?

Besides, they [the family] got paid quite nicely & quickly for this one.
 
911 said:
Police are required to minimally wear a badge when invoking a warrant. There were two suits and a patrol officer, so one was dressed in uniform.
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Do you know if Walker fired before or after they broke the door down? I've heard it was after, while they were crashing in. I'm asking because Kentucky does have a version of a stand your ground/castle doctrine law, which might explain why Walker was not charged for wounding the officer.
 
911. Why do the police keep making such dumb mistakes? Don't they get any training? Doesn't their supervisors see what is going on?

I mean. Even the dumbest person in the world knows that you can't kneel on a guys neck with your hands in your pockets until he stops breathing.

I'm all in favor of police and they work they do is tough but what I am seeing is just unbelievable.
 
Aunt Marg said:
But, 911... how many more times do families have to endure loosing loved ones to cases of "poor judgement and bad choice"?

How many more times do innocent people need to lose their lives to the nonsensical and asinine practice of police knocking doors down (first) to say hello?
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Indefinitely - provided it's police officers who are doing the killing.
 
Camper6 said:
911. Why do the police keep making such dumb mistakes? Don't they get any training? Doesn't their supervisors see what is going on?

I mean. Even the dumbest person in the world knows that you can't kneel on a guys neck with your hands in your pockets until he stops breathing.

I'm all in favor of police and they work they do is tough but what I am seeing is just unbelievable.
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The officer's hands were not in his pockets, they were resting on his leg, and the procedure was an approved / taught method at the time.
 
911 said:
I also think that those people who blame the Kentucky AG for not filing murder charges are just plain wrong. I watched a segment on NBC and CNN where they had some black people who were supposedly important in the black community blaming him for not filing murder charges. It wasn’t up to him. The Grand Jury returned the charge, which they had the power to indict the officers with many different charges, including felony murder, which could have produced a death penalty sentence. So, please leave Mr. Cameron alone.
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Your request seems to be falling upon deaf ears. The Governor of Kentucky, Andy Beshear, has requested of Cameron that the Grand Jury transcripts be made public, as have Breonna Taylor's family attorneys. Why not be as transparent as possible in this powderkeg situation?

How can a Grand Jury be able to indict the proverbial ham sandwich but not any of the officers involved in Ms. Taylor's death?

And what good fortune for those folks who'd rather talk about chaos in the streets than police brutality against black people, to have a black man deliver the news that a young black woman, a first responder (essential employee) working two jobs and with no criminal record, was killed in her home and no one will suffer any consequences.

Just who is this Daniel Cameron anyhow?

https://slate.com/news-and-politics...breonna-taylor-kentucky-attorney-general.html
 
win231 said:
Indefinitely - provided it's police officers who are doing the killing.
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Makes me wonder, Win, could it be the coffers in many States, are overflowing with riches, and that's why it's easier to dip into the coffer and settle quickly rather than rein-in police behaviour?
 
I have yet to see any of the police involved apologize for killing an innocent woman. If they have, somebody please post a link. I'd have some empathy for them if they'd acknowledge that they !@#$%ed up.

And why are they putting people's lives at risk over a drug bust? The police were tracking Jamarcus Glover -- Breonna Taylor's ex-boyfriend, but he wasn't even there. He's since been arrested on drug charges.

Whoever lied to obtain the warrant should be punished for actions that led to the death of somebody, whatever law that might be. Criminal negligence?
 
rgp said:
The officer's hands were not in his pockets, they were resting on his leg, and the procedure was an approved / taught method at the time.
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That's what I heard as well. But if they were just on his leg, then he would have to be wearing black gloves. It's hard to tell from the pictures. If they were resting on his leg, it's awfully close to the pocket. The dialogue was "I'm fine with that", or words to that effect. No matter how you cut it. It was a dumb move on all of them and the procedure is no longer valid.

I went back and looked at the images. The police officers arms were bare.
 
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Keesha said:
Approved method that was botched just like this raid.
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Ha ha ha, lololol. I like the hands on his leg as opposed to being in his pockets story. Yeah that's the ticket, if we keep singing that song long enough maybe even Mr. Floyd will believe that one himself. As if that were a deciding factor in him pressing his knee down on Mr. Floyds neck squeezing the life out of him. You gotta love the bleats of these fanboys. What a bunch. Sick.
 
Irwin said:
I have yet to see any of the police involved apologize for killing an innocent woman. If they have, somebody please post a link. I'd have some empathy for them if they'd acknowledge that they !@#$%ed up.

And why are they putting people's lives at risk over a drug bust? The police were tracking Jamarcus Glover -- Breonna Taylor's ex-boyfriend, but he wasn't even there. He's since been arrested on drug charges.

Whoever lied to obtain the warrant should be punished for actions that led to the death of somebody, whatever law that might be. Criminal negligence?
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Police never apologize for killing anyone - including that woman manager of Trader Joe's who was killed recently when police sprayed bullets into the entrance to try to shoot a suspect who ran into the store. If they apologized, it might be interpreted as an admission of wrongdoing & we can't have that. Better for the city to just pay & preserve the hero worship.
 
Aunt Marg said:
But, 911... how many more times do families have to endure loosing loved ones to cases of "poor judgement and bad choice"?

How many more times do innocent people need to lose their lives to the nonsensical and asinine practice of police knocking doors down (first) to say hello?
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That's a good question, Aunt Marg. It's easy for us to sit here and pass judgment, but until one of us in that same situation, we don't know how we would react. Take this case as an example. If you knock on a door and announce yourself and the resident doesn't hear you, so no one responds, then the cops break in the door with a battering ram and the owner (thinking his home is being broken into) opens fire, as a policeman, what would you do? Probably defend yourself by returning fire because you believe that the resident is involving you in a shootout, especially after you see that your partner has been hit.

This was a tragic incident all the way around. The police announced, the resident didn't hear the announcement, so a shootout ensued. But, how do you explain the fact that the female took several shots while the shooter took none?

The police that went through the door had to have permission from a higher up to do that. When conducting a drug raid, I have never known there not to be a plan. If their plan was to execute the warrant and if no one answered the door, they were going to take down the door with a battering ram, someone higher up had to approve this plan. Things like this just do not happen and I have never known any policeman or woman to take it upon themselves to knock-down a door without a higher up approving of the plan. This is not to say that maybe the LMPD doesn't empower their officers to do so without permission. I don't know for sure how they plan their raids, but if they allow officers to do as they feel necessary, then this is the result.

IMO, the reason the one Officer was charged with Wanton Endangerment was because he shot into another apartment. Had he not done that, I doubt if 'any' charges would have been filed. I feel bad for Mr. Cameron, the state's AG, who is taking all the heat for the not filing murder charges. It wasn't his call. A Grand Jury was was convened and they filed the charges, not Mr. Cameron. I couldn't believe all of the people on some of the network news shows that called this man out for not filing the charges. These are very ignorant people that do not understand how our justice system works.

Because Grand Jury proceedings are always confidential, we don't know what all went on during the testimonies that were given. Was the Grand Jury given the option of filing murder charges? Some say yes, some say no. I think because of this, there are a lot of unanswered questions. I also believe someone isn't telling the full truth, either the police or Mr. Walker. This, we will probably never know.

We all would like to have more answers, but I don't think we will get them.
 
FastTrax said:
Ha ha ha, lololol. I like the hands on his leg as opposed to being in his pockets story. Yeah that's the ticket, if we keep singing that song long enough maybe even Mr. Floyd will believe that one himself. As if that were a deciding factor in him pressing his knee down on Mr. Floyds neck squeezing the life out of him. You gotta love the bleats of these fanboys. What a bunch. Sick.
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Did you watch the video ?........Well watch it again.
 
Pink Biz said:
Your request seems to be falling upon deaf ears. The Governor of Kentucky, Andy Beshear, has requested of Cameron that the Grand Jury transcripts be made public, as have Breonna Taylor's family attorneys. Why not be as transparent as possible in this powderkeg situation?

How can a Grand Jury be able to indict the proverbial ham sandwich but not any of the officers involved in Ms. Taylor's death?

And what good fortune for those folks who'd rather talk about chaos in the streets than police brutality against black people, to have a black man deliver the news that a young black woman, a first responder (essential employee) working two jobs and with no criminal record, was killed in her home and no one will suffer any consequences.

Just who is this Daniel Cameron anyhow?

https://slate.com/news-and-politics...breonna-taylor-kentucky-attorney-general.html
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From what I remember, Grand Jury transcripts are not made public unless the person of interest has been found guilty in the court of law. We have a right to privacy, as defined in our Constitution's 4th Amendment, and making public the testimony would violate that right.
 

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