Statues Defaced or Destroyed or Relocated - Priorities: Historic Preservation or Promulgating Racism ?

ok - LET'S JUST CALL HER aNEGRO AND SEE IF THE WORD GETS REPLACED.
 

Old&InTheWay said:
Sunny, the point of my post has to do with the extreme circumstances that are occuring at CHOP. As long as you get your news from the NYT and CNN, you will continue to see their interpretation of events through their partisan, hateful, close-minded bias which is spoon fed to the sheeple in continual and ample doses, disguised as truth. They will leave out and simply not cover realities that do not fit their pre-exisiting POV. And that is exactly how they want it.
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It is only racist if you think it is.
 
You can tear down all the monuments you want and deface our flag, it doesn't resolve one solitary thing. History is there, like it or not. None of this changes the attitudes of any one person at all except to inflame those who see the senseless of such disgusting activities.
 

Of particular interest to me on the scale of insanity is the defacing of the Winston Churchill statue in London. Churchill is, Aguably, the single most important combatant against Hitler's march to destroy Western Civilization. 80 years later, these "peaceful protestors" are succeeding where Hitler failed.
 
A person may, or may not, agree with the events that led up to creating a statue, or monument, but those events ARE part of our history, and should be remembered. Destroying or defacing such a monument shows extreme ignorance on the part of anyone doing so, IMO.

After all...."Those who don't understand History, are doomed to repeating it".
 
Don M. said:
A person may, or may not, agree with the events that led up to creating a statue, or monument, but those events ARE part of our history, and should be remembered. Destroying or defacing such a monument shows extreme ignorance on the part of anyone doing so, IMO.

After all...."Those who don't understand History, are doomed to repeating it".
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There's a difference between remembering history and glorifying certain people and aspects with monuments.
 
StarSong said:
There's a difference between remembering history and glorifying certain people and aspects with monuments.
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Sure.

I personally don't think there should be monuments to Confederate generals, except in museums as objects of historical curiosity. Many were brave men and great generals, but so was Erwin Rommel and there are no statues to him in Germany. (Not that I know of, anyway).

However, the way to remove them is via the democratic process. Take a vote, hold a referendum, whatever. Get the necessary majority and have them removed lawfully. Your right to peaceful protest ends as soon as you whip out that spray paint can or pick up a rock.
 
JimBob1952 said:
Sure.

I personally don't think there should be monuments to Confederate generals, except in museums as objects of historical curiosity. Many were brave men and great generals, but so was Erwin Rommel and there are no statues to him in Germany. (Not that I know of, anyway).

However, the way to remove them is via the democratic process. Take a vote, hold a referendum, whatever. Get the necessary majority and have them removed lawfully. Your right to peaceful protest ends as soon as you whip out that spray paint can or pick up a rock.
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People have been asking for decades to have these removed. It seems that this tidal wave will take them out. Some by actual force, others by a forced awakening of those who should have gotten around to it years earlier. I'm not defending actions, merely explaining them.

LBJ said this:
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"What did you expect? I don't know why we're so surprised. When you put your foot on a man's neck and hold him down for three hundred years, and then you let him up, what's he going to do? He's going to knock your block off."
~ Lyndon B. Johnson following the MLK Assassination Riots
 
I personally revere General Grant, but I also hold Nathan Bedford Forrest in the highest esteem.. North or South; both had the most incredible men of honor fighting for them. This is the history of our beloved nation! Are they to rewrite the American history? This is ludicrous!
Is grafitti more artistic than an incredible sculpture? I agree with Don M. Destroying or defacing a National monument and/or The American flag is an ignorant action. Buy and fly an American flag in your yard! Show the world you stand behind the United States of America!
 
Have to differ with you on Forrest. He was not only a slave owner but a slave trader; he was the first Grand Wizard of the KKK; and he massacred over 300 Union captives (including many black soldiers) at Fort Pillow. He was, of course, a skilled cavalry general.

Is there a monument still standing to him? If so, I'm surprised.
 
Jane Nutter, president of the Gettysburg Black History Museum: “If it’s history and it’s on a battlefield that’s recognizing the history. Not honoring, we’re recognizing what is history, something very pivotal that happened. We can’t ignore that,” said Nutter, whose great-grandfather and great-uncle fought in the U.S. Colored Troops during the Civil War, and whose family owned land off Confederate Avenue in Gettysburg...“[But] placing a statue of a Confederate in a public space in a town? That’s not where it belongs...”
 
If we're not going to be allowed to trash BOTH right and left leaning news sources, the references should not be allowed at all. Some of the crap that is posted is very thinly veiled aggressive political statements attributed to specific groups with no mention of opposing (equally divisive) sources.

If one has something to say - -say it ! Don't pussyfoot around the edges trying to get the narrow view posted without the post being banned. That sort of defeats the purpose of attempting to have a site without hateful political statements.

I don't envy the folks who have the job of trying to keep these posts at bay. There's only two reasons for such posts. One is to get a political view across without the statement being removed OR the poster isn't bright enough to realize what he or she is posting. Take your choice!!
 
Old&InTheWay said:
Since someone mentioned the Seattle situation, here is an exclusive report from a reporter who spent 5days inside the CHOP zone. A great time was had by all: rapes, violence, destruction of property, all in the name of positive change. Cops unwilling to go in to intervene.
You won't see the New York Times or Washington Post reporting this, it doesn't fit their agenda.
This is the not the future of this country. This IS the country.

https://nypost.com/2020/06/20/my-terrifying-5-day-stay-inside-seattles-autonomous-zone/
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The report that I read stated that the police was not permitted to enter CHOP through the Mayor’s orders. She’a another one that needs to go.
 
Gaer said:
I personally revere General Grant, but I also hold Nathan Bedford Forrest in the highest esteem.. North or South; both had the most incredible men of honor fighting for them. This is the history of our beloved nation! Are they to rewrite the American history? This is ludicrous!
Is grafitti more artistic than an incredible sculpture? I agree with Don M. Destroying or defacing a National monument and/or The American flag is an ignorant action. Buy and fly an American flag in your yard! Show the world you stand behind the United States of America!
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If you don’t like it, don’t look at it. Problem solved.
 
JimBob1952 said:
Have to differ with you on Forrest. He was not only a slave owner but a slave trader; he was the first Grand Wizard of the KKK; and he massacred over 300 Union captives (including many black soldiers) at Fort Pillow. He was, of course, a skilled cavalry general.

Is there a monument still standing to him? If so, I'm surprised.
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A bust of Forrest is in the Tennessee Capitol building.

The Fort Pillow soldiers weren’t captives, according to several Union eyewitness accounts, he gave no quarter after they refused to surrender. In the heat of battle I’m sure they killed every soldier they could, that‘s the ugly side of hand to hand combat. It was the same in WW I and II. Kill or get killed.

Forrest was a different man after he disavowed and ordered the disbanding of the Klan. He made a speech to a group of freed slaves in 1875 that opened my eyes, a person can change if he could.
 
JB in SC said:
A bust of Forrest is in the Tennessee Capitol building.

The Fort Pillow soldiers weren’t captives, according to several Union eyewitness accounts, he gave no quarter after they refused to surrender. In the heat of battle I’m sure they killed every soldier they could, that‘s the ugly side of hand to hand combat. It was the same in WW I and II. Kill or get killed.

Forrest was a different man after he disavowed and ordered the disbanding of the Klan. He made a speech to a group of freed slaves in 1875 that opened my eyes, a person can change if he could.
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That may certainly be the case. I guess my point (if I had one) is that if Lee's statue comes down, then Forrest's should too.

Of course now they are trying to take down statues of Lincoln and Washington so this discussion is already out of date.
 
A letter in today's paper says he should not be called General Lee, as he was a "General" in an illegal military force. His highest rank in the U.S. Army was Colonel. So, should he be demoted?
 
Sunny said:
A letter in today's paper says he should not be called General Lee, as he was a "General" in an illegal military force. His highest rank in the U.S. Army was Colonel. So, should he be demoted?
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Somewhat ridiculous, don't you think? George Washington was also a rebel and would most certainly have been hung as a traitor. He too was a general in an illegal military force, although he fought for the right cause (and also the victorious cause). Lee fought for the wrong cause (which was also the cause that lost).

While we are at it, Martin Luther King was a philanderer and plagiarist, Woodrow Wilson was a racist, Eli Yale was a slave trader, FDR was a racist, Margaret Sanger was a horrible racist, Harry Truman used anti-Semitic phrases, Thomas Jefferson owned slaves (and kept one as a mistress) and on and on and on. Let's tear down all the statues and burn any books that mention these people.
 
JimBob1952 said:
Somewhat ridiculous, don't you think? George Washington was also a rebel and would most certainly have been hung as a traitor. He too was a general in an illegal military force, although he fought for the right cause (and also the victorious cause). Lee fought for the wrong cause (which was also the cause that lost).

While we are at it, Martin Luther King was a philanderer and plagiarist, Woodrow Wilson was a racist, Eli Yale was a slave trader, FDR was a racist, Margaret Sanger was a horrible racist, Harry Truman used anti-Semitic phrases, Thomas Jefferson owned slaves (and kept one as a mistress) and on and on and on. Let's tear down all the statues and burn any books that mention these people.
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Let's give America back to England and be done with it.
 
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