Covid - We blew it

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Sunny

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There is nothing to argue about; we have passed the point of no return, it seems.

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'We blew it': U.S. reaches 'explosive' COVID-19 spread as virus is nearly impossible to control, experts say
Abby Haglage
Abby Haglage
Fri, November 13, 2020, 4:09 PM EST


With COVID-19 cases increasing in 46 states, 10 of which broke single-day records for new cases on Thursday, America has officially entered what experts refer to as the “exponential” phase of spread — a rapid multiplying of cases that can’t be contained through traditional measures. On Thursday alone, the U.S. saw 160,000 new cases of the virus, more than any day since the pandemic began.
In California, the second state to surpass 1 million cases, thousands of people in cars lined up at Dodger Stadium on Thursday to get tested; in parts of Washington state, individuals waited four to five hours.
Related: Restrictions grow as pandemic rages in the U.S.

The current spike in cases — which some states are calling a third wave — has brought more than 100,000 new cases a day since Nov. 4. But that’s not counting those that may be going undetected. “We have widespread, uncontrolled COVID-19 in many parts of the country,” says Dr. Amesh Adalja, senior scholar at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security. “And we know the cases reported are an underestimate of what is out there ... we’re missing many cases because people aren’t getting tested. So the true number is much higher than what we’re actually seeing.”
 

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Report from one of my former 'snowbird' neighbors, in SW AZ the Canadians are not coming this winter. With national health care the Canadian government has told them that they will not have health care coverage if they travel to the US. Their benefits are invalid at the border, good luck with the costly healthcare options if available.
 
ManjaroKDE said:
Report from one of my former 'snowbird' neighbors, in SW AZ the Canadians are not coming this winter. With national health care the Canadian government has told them that they will not have health care coverage if they travel to the US. Their benefits are invalid at the border, good luck with the costly healthcare options if available down there.
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Canada has locked it's borders to all unessential travel (USofA) coming in or out.
 
ManjaroKDE said:
Report from one of my former 'snowbird' neighbors, in SW AZ the Canadians are not coming this winter. With national health care the Canadian government has told them that they will not have health care coverage if they travel to the US. Their benefits are invalid at the border, good luck with the costly healthcare options if available.
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Aunt Marg said:
Canada has locked it's borders to all unessential travel (USofA) coming in or out.
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Wise moves.
 
Our national medical coverage doesn’t apply out-of-country at any time. Some private companies are offering coverage, cost unknown, and lots of fine print.

We can fly into the US. Most are choosing not to anyway. Upon return, you must quarantine for 14 days. Short term southern destinations are really hurting. No one goes to Vegas or Disneyland for 4 days to return home to quarantine for 14.
 
Aunt Marg said:
Annie. I wish more countries were doing it.
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It's weird that border control hasn't given consistent results. Israel, New Zealand and Singapore have been aggressive with border crossings from the first and Israel's deaths per 100,000 are at 296 yet NZ and Singapore's are at 5 per 100,000. Vastly different results. The only thing I can think of is that Israel's population is much more diverse and it may be that the impact of religious beliefs such as in the Hasidic Jewish denomination are skewing Israel's mortality rate in the wrong direction. I picked those three because their numbers are likely fairly trustworthy and they're small nations which allows for better control. Obviously New Zealand and Singapore being islands helps with border control.
 
AnnieA said:
It's weird that border control hasn't given consistent results. Israel, New Zealand and Singapore have been aggressive with border crossings from the first and Israel's deaths per 100,000 are at 296 yet NZ and Singapore's are at 5 per 100,000. Vastly different results. The only thing I can think of is that Israel's population is much more diverse and it may be that the impact of religious beliefs such as in the Hasidic Jewish denomination are skewing Israel's mortality rate in the wrong direction. I picked those three because their numbers are likely fairly trustworthy and they're small nations which allows for better control. Obviously New Zealand and Singapore being islands helps with border control.
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I, too, have given thought to skewed stats, etc, Annie.

One thing that I do believe, is European countries that are enjoying lower rates are more in tune with respecting guidelines more so than the west, but all in all I'm left scratching my head from day to day as more and more reports sift in as to out of control numbers.
 
Aunt Marg said:
I, too, have given thought to skewed stats, etc, Annie.

One thing that I do believe, is European countries that are enjoying lower rates are more in tune with respecting guidelines more so than the west, but all in all I'm left scratching my head from day to day as more and more reports sift in as to out of control numbers.
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Scandinavian countries, with the exception of Sweden, are faring much better than the UK, US and several European nations.
 
True. I was watching the Monroe County Executive do a press conference the other day. That is the county where I lived before moving here. He was having the press call in questions. Now our Governor has limited private gatherings to less than 10, and bars and restaurants to limit patrons.
Anyway, a reporter called in to report he saw an ad from a Rochester area restaurant that was offering a 25% discount for Christmas parties of 25 or more people.
 
AnnieA said:
It's weird that border control hasn't given consistent results. Israel, New Zealand and Singapore have been aggressive with border crossings from the first and Israel's deaths per 100,000 are at 296 yet NZ and Singapore's are at 5 per 100,000. Vastly different results. The only thing I can think of is that Israel's population is much more diverse and it may be that the impact of religious beliefs such as in the Hasidic Jewish denomination are skewing Israel's mortality rate in the wrong direction. I picked those three because their numbers are likely fairly trustworthy and they're small nations which allows for better control. Obviously New Zealand and Singapore being islands helps with border control.
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Closing borders only works for countries that have already controlled the virus WITHIN their countries, have rigorous contact tracing, sufficient testing, strong leadership, and a committed population.

Singapore, NZ and Australia did all of these things from the get-go.
 
AnnieA said:
It's weird that border control hasn't given consistent results. Israel, New Zealand and Singapore have been aggressive with border crossings from the first and Israel's deaths per 100,000 are at 296 yet NZ and Singapore's are at 5 per 100,000. Vastly different results. The only thing I can think of is that Israel's population is much more diverse and it may be that the impact of religious beliefs such as in the Hasidic Jewish denomination are skewing Israel's mortality rate in the wrong direction. I picked those three because their numbers are likely fairly trustworthy and they're small nations which allows for better control. Obviously New Zealand and Singapore being islands helps with border control.
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One thing I think might be part of the difference is that many Asian countries already had a culture that included mask wearing when sick. So I think one of the reasons that Asian countries have tended to better than non-Asian countries is that they already had some of the culture in place needed to battle the virus more effectively. However I have no concrete evidence to back up my opinion, so I'm pretty much just presenting conjecture.
 
Not only when they're sick, asp3. I've seen lots of pictures of crowded Asian cities with nearly everyone in the streets wearing masks. One reason may be their poor air quality. But you make an interesting point: for whatever reason, they are apparently resisting the idea of wearing a mask a lot less than we do. They are probably accepting it as more normal.
 
This terrible scenario is playing out exactly as we were warned unless we changed our behavior. Dr. Fauci and the vast majority of medical personnel, epidemiologists, virologists, and related professionals couldn't have been clearer a few months ago.

@Pinky, Los Angeles likewise has a large Asian community and masks have been common sight for many years here, too. They also often (quite wisely) wear loose, lightweight long sleeved shirts, long pants and head coverings, no matter how warm the day is, to protect their skin from the sun.

I salute other cultures' non-politicization of health precautions.
 
The key to controlling this is not in government regulations. It's in everyone taking personal responsibility for their own safety and that of their neighbor.

Learn the facts about your own village/community/town - the space you move about in. Determine your own susceptibility and level of comfort.

Then use common sense and do the right thing.
 
gennie said:
The key to controlling this is not in government regulations. It's in everyone taking personal responsibility for their own safety and that of their neighbor.

Learn the facts about your own village/community/town - the space you move about in. Determine your own susceptibility and level of comfort.

Then use common sense and do the right thing.
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I've got to disagree here, the areas where the government has stepped in and regulated behavior have done the best once the first wave was completed. I'm afraid that people are not responsible and do not really consider how their actions potentially impact others.

I'm of the opinion that if we had started with very restrictive regulations, built up robust contact tracing, developed quick, effective testing, strict quarantine for those who travel from region to region and made it easier for infected people to quarantine themselves without infecting their families we'd be in the same place as Taiwan is. They're basically open for business as usual and didn't have any local transmission (all their cases came in from outside of an area) for over 200 days.
 
ManjaroKDE said:
Report from one of my former 'snowbird' neighbors, in SW AZ the Canadians are not coming this winter. With national health care the Canadian government has told them that they will not have health care coverage if they travel to the US. Their benefits are invalid at the border, good luck with the costly healthcare options if available.
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Oh the Canadians are still going. My niece and husband have a home in Arizona.

They can't drive but can fly. They need to self isolate when they get there and self isolate when they get back and must wear masks on the plane.

But it's worth it because the winters here are brutal. They really enjoy themselves in Arizona. Tennis everyday and golf and gardening add years off your life.

When Canadians go to the U.S. the national health care doesn't cover them in the U.S.

They have to buy a separate insurance package like they have in the U.S.

And it's the same old story. You can get it, but previous conditions are not covered.

I asked the insurance agent, what is not covered for previous conditions. He said whatever pills you are taking and they can get information from your doctor.
 

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