Why do the vaccine arguments continue?

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Sunny

Sunny

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OK, the disease has been with us for about 2 1/2 years. Most people are vaccinated. A tragic number died of Covid before there was a vaccine. People are continuing to die, overwhelmingly those who have not been vaccinated. (Die of Covid, I mean. Obviously, people continue to die of all sorts of other things. Even vaccinated people can get cancer, strokes, etc.)

For pretty much every other infectious disease, we have vaccines, or are developing them. Most people get the vaccines, if they are available to them. Some do not, for various reasons. (Underlying conditions, they don't believe in vaccines, fear of needles, religious beliefs, etc.) Yet, I have never seen ongoing arguments, often of a very childish nature, about any other disease. We all have our opinions, and as adults we live our lives accordingly.

You want to remain alive and healthy as long as possible, and avoid getting a terrible disease? Fine, so you get the vaccine, might have a sore arm for a day or so (or not), and that's the end of the subject. But with Covid, we get graphs, charts, insults, "proofs" of who is right and who is wrong, and it goes on endlessly. There is apparently nothing that will change the minds of those who have been convinced that this vaccine is somehow a bad thing. It's useless, it's fake, it is being promoted ONLY to make the pharma companies rich, etc. It would be ludicrous if it weren't so sad.

So, why? Well, I think the answer is obvious. This is the only disease I can think of that has been so politicized. And that's what we're really arguing about, isn't it?
 

A year ago, about the Only thing we saw on the televised news was Covid, Covid, and more Covid. It seemed that the more this virus was "publicized", the more it became a divisive issue. In recent months, things like Ukraine and this runaway inflation, etc., have garnered most of the attention on the news. Now, it seems that most have made up their minds regarding these vaccines, and Covid is no longer a major "talking
point" for our media.
Those who accept the scientific evidence continue to get their shots, and follow the guidelines, while those who deny the evidence remain at risk.
 
We all have our opinions, and as adults we live our lives accordingly.
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Exactly, but it appears that you cannot accept that. I, and others will live our lives as we choose , but again it appears that if we choose a way that differs from your opinion / opposes your view , we are somehow less educated ? Less intelligent than you ? And for that reason subject to ridicule & insult from you .

You and some others here seem to be very left leaning , liberal, and democrat . You know the inclusion group, the open minded set, the group that accepts people willingly, openly yet ......... The minute anyone opposes you in opinion ....... they are immediately wrong and again ... subjected to your desdain and ridicule.

I hope that makes you feel really good about yourself ? Because it seems you really need the pat on the back.
 

Sunny said:
OK, the disease has been with us for about 2 1/2 years. Most people are vaccinated. A tragic number died of Covid before there was a vaccine. People are continuing to die, overwhelmingly those who have not been vaccinated. (Die of Covid, I mean. Obviously, people continue to die of all sorts of other things. Even vaccinated people can get cancer, strokes, etc.)

For pretty much every other infectious disease, we have vaccines, or are developing them. Most people get the vaccines, if they are available to them. Some do not, for various reasons. (Underlying conditions, they don't believe in vaccines, fear of needles, religious beliefs, etc.) Yet, I have never seen ongoing arguments, often of a very childish nature, about any other disease. We all have our opinions, and as adults we live our lives accordingly.

You want to remain alive and healthy as long as possible, and avoid getting a terrible disease? Fine, so you get the vaccine, might have a sore arm for a day or so (or not), and that's the end of the subject. But with Covid, we get graphs, charts, insults, "proofs" of who is right and who is wrong, and it goes on endlessly. There is apparently nothing that will change the minds of those who have been convinced that this vaccine is somehow a bad thing. It's useless, it's fake, it is being promoted ONLY to make the pharma companies rich, etc. It would be ludicrous if it weren't so sad.

So, why? Well, I think the answer is obvious. This is the only disease I can think of that has been so politicized. And that's what we're really arguing about, isn't it?
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Great post!

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Sunny said:
OK, the disease has been with us for about 2 1/2 years. Most people are vaccinated. A tragic number died of Covid before there was a vaccine. People are continuing to die, overwhelmingly those who have not been vaccinated. (Die of Covid, I mean. Obviously, people continue to die of all sorts of other things. Even vaccinated people can get cancer, strokes, etc.)

For pretty much every other infectious disease, we have vaccines, or are developing them. Most people get the vaccines, if they are available to them. Some do not, for various reasons. (Underlying conditions, they don't believe in vaccines, fear of needles, religious beliefs, etc.) Yet, I have never seen ongoing arguments, often of a very childish nature, about any other disease. We all have our opinions, and as adults we live our lives accordingly.

You want to remain alive and healthy as long as possible, and avoid getting a terrible disease? Fine, so you get the vaccine, might have a sore arm for a day or so (or not), and that's the end of the subject. But with Covid, we get graphs, charts, insults, "proofs" of who is right and who is wrong, and it goes on endlessly. There is apparently nothing that will change the minds of those who have been convinced that this vaccine is somehow a bad thing. It's useless, it's fake, it is being promoted ONLY to make the pharma companies rich, etc. It would be ludicrous if it weren't so sad.

So, why? Well, I think the answer is obvious. This is the only disease I can think of that has been so politicized. And that's what we're really arguing about, isn't it?
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You hit the nail on the head in the last paragraph, obvious to all.
 
This particular virus differs from previous ones in that it has so many symptoms. Some people are still not sure whether they have actually had it or not. Now it has mutated again and there is another outbreak starting up. There is confusion over the vaccine....does it work or not....is it worth the risk?
It's no wonder that it is causing such disruption to our lives. People should not be condemned for being cautious....even the medical people don't know the full facts about it.
 
Don M. said:
Those who accept the scientific evidence continue to get their shots, and follow the guidelines, while those who deny the evidence remain at risk.
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Yes, my husband and I have been fully vaccinated and boosted, as many of our neighbors, friends and relatives. We are glad the vaccines were available and we didn't get sick or die from the deadly worldwide virus like so many others have. I feel strongly that if more people acted responsibly and got vaccinated sooner, the country would be in better shape today and there wouldn't have been so many dead from this virus. Rest in peace to all those who lost their lives during this pandemic.
 
Political division aside, the main argument has been DNA vaccines ~vs~ MRNA vaccines.

Respectively, a vaccine that's been tested over decades and is reasonably predictable that uses the whole virus, dead or living, and a vaccine that contains a very briefly tested single-stranded molecule of RNA and only a tiny portion of the virus. No one knows for certain what the long term effects of the latter might be. And now it's been approved for infants and children, and I'm sure that's why people are still arguing about it....or arguing again.
 
Sunny said:
This is the only disease I can think of that has been so politicized. And that's what we're really arguing about, isn't it?
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How did the sickness industry get such power over all the public, worldwide ? deception.

Cancer was "politicized" almost a century ago, and it was made illegal for licensed doctors in the usa to tell people the truth about that. So millions suffer needlessly.

Not much to argue about if you trust the gov and medics though.

If you care, get a copy of the book still available on ebay etc as far as I know -
"Nutrition the Cancer Answer" - how licensed and unlicensed doctors cured cancer easily before it became illegal to do so. It still works, but quietly for the professionals.
 
I suspect Covid will go the way of the flu. Vaccines available, proven effective, but not 100%. Some people will choose to get them, some won't. That ain't going to change.
Just Jeff said:
Young Healthy Athletes, and other persons without previous problems, die/d/ suddenly, after getting jabbed.
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Sure it happens, but very rarely. Large population studies continue to show that your risks are lower with the vaccine than without. Risks either way, best data shows lower risk with than without.
Murrmurr said:
No one knows for certain what the long term effects of the latter might be.
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The same could be said for many things in life, not just medicines. I don't see any reason this one should be of especially great concern, but I do understand others worry. Probably the best reason I have heard for not getting vaccinated. I don't agree, but then I have not always been right!
 
Sunny said:
Why do the vaccine arguments continue?
So, why? Well, I think the answer is obvious. This is the only disease I can think of that has been so politicized. And that's what we're really arguing about, isn't it?
Click to expand...
A sizable portion of the populace have become "experts" in numerous fields since Google Search, and for reasons of promoting their own self-esteem they choose to attack and discount the actual experts. Of course certain slanted media seize every opportunity to interject divisive viewpoints to further consolidate their control of their viewership.
 
Jeff, what is your source of that information about the young, healthy athletes dying suddenly after getting "jabbed?" That's a word the anti-vaxxers seems to love. Actually, it doesn't feel like a jab, it's more like a gentle poke that you barely feel. Please show us your source of the information about all these young, healthy people dropping dead from getting the vaccine.

Maybe several people died of a freak allergic reaction, out of all the millions worldwide who got vaccinated. And I'm not even sure of that. I do know that they ask everyone to sit for 15 minutes after receiving the vaccine to make sure there is no allergic reaction, and I'm sure the nurses are trained to counteract it if it happens. Probably statistics would show that that could happen after any medical procedure. I bet there's a handful of people have died after getting their teeth cleaned!

Lavinia and Murrmurr, I agree that the first people to volunteer for the vaccine were brave souls, as it was all very new; the disease itself was new, and nobody knew anything for sure. Many people did hold off on getting the vaccine but finally the statistics showed them a) how safe it was, and b) how effective it was, so they happily got it. And I think we were right about not jumping in too quickly to vaccinate kids. But considering the risks from the disease, vs. the risks from getting the vaccine, it does seem a no-brainer to me. That little "poke" is probably one of the safest medical procedures you can get.

Just a look at a map of the U.S., and which states objected (and still continue to object) to mask-wearing mandates (ooh, that scary word, "mandate," even though it just means a government requirement), and the statistics on getting the vaccine, and it's pretty obvious what this endless argument is really about.
 
Nathan said:
A sizable portion of the populace have become "experts" in numerous fields since Google Search, and for reasons of promoting their own self-esteem they choose to attack and discount the actual experts. Of course certain slanted media seize every opportunity to interject divisive viewpoints to further consolidate their control of their viewership.
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I agree.
 
The "experts" many seem to be trusting, the "political correct" imeciles , are experts at continuing, ongoing deception.

Anyone may be able to research for themselves and find this out clearly.
 
Sunny said:
That little "poke" is probably one of the safest medical procedures you can get.
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hahahahaha x billions.

Better to do better research , not just over the last three years, but over the last hundred years, and see if the "experts" told the truth or not. Easy to find, or used to be, that the fda, cdc, and ama all worked together for power over people, deceiving them, lying, yes outright lies since about wwII.
 
Just Jeff said:
The "experts" many seem to be trusting, the "political correct" imeciles , are experts at continuing, ongoing deception.

Anyone may be able to research for themselves and find this out clearly.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a sensitive issue for you. what exactly is/are "political correct" imecile(s) in your world, what does that mean?
Just Jeff said:
hahahahaha x billions.

Better to do better research , not just over the last three years, but over the last hundred years, and see if the "experts" told the truth or not. Easy to find, or used to be, that the fda, cdc, and ama all worked together for power over people, deceiving them, lying, yes outright lies since about wwII.
Click to expand...

Edit: never mind, saw your last post, pretty much explains where you're coming from.
 
Sunny said:
OK, the disease has been with us for about 2 1/2 years. Most people are vaccinated. A tragic number died of Covid before there was a vaccine. People are continuing to die, overwhelmingly those who have not been vaccinated. (Die of Covid, I mean. Obviously, people continue to die of all sorts of other things. Even vaccinated people can get cancer, strokes, etc.)

For pretty much every other infectious disease, we have vaccines, or are developing them. Most people get the vaccines, if they are available to them. Some do not, for various reasons. (Underlying conditions, they don't believe in vaccines, fear of needles, religious beliefs, etc.) Yet, I have never seen ongoing arguments, often of a very childish nature, about any other disease. We all have our opinions, and as adults we live our lives accordingly.

You want to remain alive and healthy as long as possible, and avoid getting a terrible disease? Fine, so you get the vaccine, might have a sore arm for a day or so (or not), and that's the end of the subject. But with Covid, we get graphs, charts, insults, "proofs" of who is right and who is wrong, and it goes on endlessly. There is apparently nothing that will change the minds of those who have been convinced that this vaccine is somehow a bad thing. It's useless, it's fake, it is being promoted ONLY to make the pharma companies rich, etc. It would be ludicrous if it weren't so sad.

So, why? Well, I think the answer is obvious. This is the only disease I can think of that has been so politicized. And that's what we're really arguing about, isn't it?
Click to expand...
Better questions:
1. Why do you feel the need to repeatedly reassure yourself that you made the right decision to get vaccinated?
2. Why do you feel the need to ridicule those who didn't make the same decision you made? Especially since the health decisions of others ain't none of your business.
3. Why don't people who choose not to get vaccinated feel the same need to ridicule those who choose to get vaccinated?
It doesn't matter to me who's vaccinated & who isn't. It's their decision; not mine. And not yours. You waste lots of energy by being obsessed with the health decisions of others.
4. You are a shining example of the "Childish Nature" you speak of.
 
Sunny said:
Murrmurr, I agree that the first people to volunteer for the vaccine were brave souls, as it was all very new; the disease itself was new, and nobody knew anything for sure. Many people did hold off on getting the vaccine but finally the statistics showed them a) how safe it was, and b) how effective it was, so they happily got it. And I think we were right about not jumping in too quickly to vaccinate kids. But considering the risks from the disease, vs. the risks from getting the vaccine, it does seem a no-brainer to me. That little "poke" is probably one of the safest medical procedures you can get.
Click to expand...
Healthy children are not at risk of death by covid. Their covid symptoms are relatively mild and short-lived. Data shows that over 50% of children the world over have had covid and are therefore have natural immunity. Children's covid MRNA vaccine is effective for 6weeks to 8 weeks, according to Pfizer.

Only children with obesity, juvenile diabetes, severe asthma and other respiratory disease and other co-morbidity known to cause severe covid symptoms and possibly death should be given or considered for the covid vaccine. The only children who have died from covid had severe underlying medical conditions including the ones I mentioned. The majority were either asymptomatic or had very mild symptoms.

It is absolutely unknown whether or not the MRNA vaccine will cause long-term side effects because only time will tell; years, possibly decades. It is known that a concerning percentage of young men and boys age 14 to 24 have had 2 or more cardiac issues, usually after the 2nd vaccine, "extremely likely" caused by the vaccine, and that the effectiveness of the vaccine is limited and protection wanes rather quickly.

I was vaccinated and got 1 booster (and I'm done), but if I still had young kids, and they were healthy, I would choose to not get them vaccinated.
 
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Nathan said:
A sizable portion of the populace have become "experts" in numerous fields since Google Search, and for reasons of promoting their own self-esteem they choose to attack and discount the actual experts. Of course certain slanted media seize every opportunity to interject divisive viewpoints to further consolidate their control of their viewership.
Click to expand...
However, there are very good sources online. NIH, Nature Science and a dozen other revered medical journals, World in Data, various university virology labs, and numerous researchers and virologists all over the world. None of which are particularly interested in politics.

Doesn't make one an expert, only well-informed.
 
Murrmurr said:
However, there are very good sources online. NIH, Nature Science and a dozen other revered medical journals, World in Data, various university virology labs, and numerous researchers and virologists all over the world. None of which are particularly interested in politics.

Doesn't make one an expert, only well-informed.
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Absolutely, agree 100%. I spend most of my time online researching medical topics, or other technical matters. What matters is seeking facts, and not cherry-picking Google search for material to support one's own pet viewpoint.

For the record: I personally don't believe that anyone on this forum is advocating to blindly adhere to what experts say. As such, this is my position.
 
Murrmurr said:
However, there are very good sources online. NIH, Nature Science and a dozen other revered medical journals, World in Data, various university virology labs, and numerous researchers and virologists all over the world. None of which are particularly interested in politics.

Doesn't make one an expert, only well-informed.
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None of those sources you listed claim that the pandemic is a hoax, so they must have a liberal bias. :cool:
 
Bella said:
Perhaps there are some people who might find this article from the NIH National Library of Medicine—National Center for Biotechnology Information interesting.

COVID UPDATE: What is the truth? By Dr. Russell Blaylock, a nationally recognized, board-certified neurosurgeon, health practitioner, author, and lecturer. >> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9062939/


Bella ✌️
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If they are searching for the truth themselves, still, and have not given in to the ridiculous stories from the profit-mongers in gov, medicine, pharma, corporations, banks, schools, and so on....
Most people, according to history, according to the puboic reactions/attitudes the last three years, and according to all Scripture, do noot care for nor ever even seek the truth, but aer content and blindly following the blind, believing the misinformation broadcast over all media overwhelmingly, with trillions of dollars directing the direction instead of what is right or true.

"The COVID-19 pandemic is one of the most manipulated infectious disease events in history, characterized by official lies in an unending stream lead by government bureaucracies, medical associations, medical boards, the media, and international agencies.[3,6,57] We have witnessed a long list of unprecedented intrusions into medical practice, including attacks on medical experts, destruction of medical careers among doctors refusing to participate in killing their patients and a massive regimentation of health care, led by non-qualified individuals with enormous wealth, power and influence."
 
Another reason the "Vaccine Arguments" continue:
People who are vaccinated keep getting Covid.
That causes the intelligent thinkers among us to question the vaccine's usefulness.
 

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