France makes abortion a constitutional right as the first country worldwide

gruntlabor said:
Thou shalt not kill. --Exodus 20:13
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Sure, Christians have never, and do not ever, kill others. Not for their belief, or for resources. Nor do they fund others to kill. Got it. For me, if you're going to start strictly enforcing this there are far more significant places to start than the termination of a pregnancy.

People who want to full back to their faith to condone things are perfectly entitled to do so - but it's worth remembering that if you're not of that faith, it's a groundless excuse to force women to go full term, and doesn't really matter.

We really should remember that abortions are still a minority of births, and that the vast majority of women opting for one are single.

We like to paint pretty pictures about the help that is out there, but the reality is many of these births, should they have resulted in a child, would have left a single parent and child in abject poverty. This itself leads to outcomes that are far from favorable. I don't know what it does mentally to a woman who is forced to have a child she didn't want, or can't support.

I hate the idea of abortion, I'd prefer there to be none. However, it's not for me to say, and individual circumstances should dictate what happens. I'm sure it's not an easy decision, and I'm sure that in many cases it's not without a lot of guilt. As a man, I have no idea what going full term truly means to a woman.
 

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I won't be surprised when abortion becomes a hot potato in this election run up in the US. The wave of anti-abortion laws that have appeared in our society lately are very troubling to a lot of citizens. I can't figure out how people will agree on this. One side believes that the unborn child is God's property. The other, believes it is man made and the property of the people who claim it. Just use the ancient method of cutting the baby in half. Then people might understand to mind their own business.
 
Pepper said:
So a woman should be a brood mare to assauge his sadness? His will? Yes, there are sad moments in life. Yes, we have roles made by our genders. That doesn't debilitate her rights. Does it? That's the sadness here, the potential loss of a woman's rights over herself. Something We Fought For.
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I agree. Problem here is someone is calling the result of a man getting his jollies off as a 'baby', and no less his son or daughter. Initially it becomes just a cluster of cells inside the woman's body. Religion has overcome science and common sense in all of these cases.

It is the woman's decision on what to do when a man impregnates her, and she in no way needs to give any man or anyone else any excuses for her decision. It is nobody's business why a woman chooses to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. Her body, her choice.

Until the man is the one to get pregnant, carry that baby inside his body for nine months, and actually be able to give birth, he stakes no claims on that woman's body. When the man has to breastfeed, nurture, and raise that baby after she/he is born until they reach adulthood, then he can have the control and dominate the decision.

He had his way with her for a few minutes, but he does not own her. Those men who don't support the woman and try to force their will on her, are just being selfish.

My husband and other men in my circle of family and friends believe in a woman's right to choose and will show their support at the ballot box. Thankfully I live in a state that still respects women's rights and freedoms and doesn't want to take us back to the 1930s when a coat hanger and back alley were all that was needed for a very dangerous or deadly abortion.
 

VaughanJB said:
Sure, Christians have never, and do not ever, kill others. Not for their belief, or for resources. Nor do they fund others to kill. Got it. For me, if you're going to start strictly enforcing this there are far more significant places to start than the termination of a pregnancy.

People who want to full back to their faith to condone things are perfectly entitled to do so - but it's worth remembering that if you're not of that faith, it's a groundless excuse to force women to go full term, and doesn't really matter.

We really should remember that abortions are still a minority of births, and that the vast majority of women opting for one are single.

We like to paint pretty pictures about the help that is out there, but the reality is many of these births, should they have resulted in a child, would have left a single parent and child in abject poverty. This itself leads to outcomes that are far from favorable. I don't know what it does mentally to a woman who is forced to have a child she didn't want, or can't support.

I hate the idea of abortion, I'd prefer there to be none. However, it's not for me to say, and individual circumstances should dictate what happens. I'm sure it's not an easy decision, and I'm sure that in many cases it's not without a lot of guilt. As a man, I have no idea what going full term truly means to a woman.
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Well said, thank you.
 
ProTruckDriver said:
Hmm, I'd like to ask one simple question to all that are for aborting a child because they just don't want it. Are you glad that your mother didn't abort you?
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My mother was a wise lady, and I would respect any decision she deemed necessary at the time.
 
ProTruckDriver said:
Hmm, I'd like to ask one simple question to all that are for aborting a child because they just don't want it. Are you glad that your mother didn't abort you?
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I'm not..I had a horrible life... at the hands of my parents.. well particularly the father... I was Stillborn along with my twin who didn't survive... they should have left me..

My point being that if my mother had aborted me I wouldn't have had to suffer abuse all my childhood...so it would have been a win for me..
 
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ProTruckDriver said:
Hmm, I'd like to ask one simple question to all that are for aborting a child because they just don't want it. Are you glad that your mother didn't abort you?
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Just because you ‘can’ have a kid, doesn’t mean you should. There are many people who have no business having kids.
 
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SeaBreeze said:
I agree. Problem here is someone is calling the result of a man getting his jollies off as a 'baby', and no less his son or daughter. Initially it becomes just a cluster of cells inside the woman's body. Religion has overcome science and common sense in all of these cases.

It is the woman's decision on what to do when a man impregnates her, and she in no way needs to give any man or anyone else any excuses for her decision. It is nobody's business why a woman chooses to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. Her body, her choice.

Until the man is the one to get pregnant, carry that baby inside his body for nine months, and actually be able to give birth, he stakes no claims on that woman's body. When the man has to breastfeed, nurture, and raise that baby after she/he is born until they reach adulthood, then he can have the control and dominate the decision.

He had his way with her for a few minutes, but he does not own her. Those men who don't support the woman and try to force their will on her, are just being selfish.

My husband and other men in my circle of family and friends believe in a woman's right to choose and will show their support at the ballot box. Thankfully I live in a state that still respects women's rights and freedoms and doesn't want to take us back to the 1930s when a coat hanger and back alley were all that was needed for a very dangerous or deadly abortion.
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You make a huge jump here, from the sentiment, "Her body, her choice" to demanding "support at the ballot box". One is about choice, the other is about force.
 
hollydolly said:
I'm not..I had a horrible life... at the hands of my parents.. well particularly the father... I was Stillborn along with my twin who didn't survive... they should have left me..

My point being that if my mother had aborted me I wouldn't have had to suffer abuse all my childhood...so it would have been a win for me..
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I know it was miserable for you Holly, and there are others I'm sure who feel the same way. When I hear on the news about mothers who lock their young children in the closet and starve them to death, or put them in a barrel in a storage shed only to be discovered well after death, I think to myself that poor child would have been much better off if the mother aborted and never gave birth to them.

Can't imaginge what you've been through my friend, hugs. 🧡
 
gruntlabor said:
You make a huge jump here, from the sentiment, "Her body, her choice" to demanding "support at the ballot box". One is about choice, the other is about force.
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No jump at all. I never said demanding support. If you read what I wrote, you'd see that I said....
SeaBreeze said:
My husband and other men in my circle of family and friends believe in a woman's right to choose and will show their support at the ballot box.
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Don't know where you pulled out that I demand anything, but I'm guessing you had to stand up to do it. You might be the type to demand that other people do things, that is not and has never been me. :rolleyes:
 
VaughanJB said:
Sure, Christians have never, and do not ever, kill others. Not for their belief, or for resources. Nor do they fund others to kill. Got it.
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This is not true. There are plenty of historical references that prove otherwise. Catholic schools who demanded Indians join is one example. Thousands of innocent children were killed and buried under the church. This happened at many schools.
 
PeppermintPatty said:
This is not true. There are plenty of historical references that prove otherwise. Catholic schools who demanded Indians join is one example. Thousands of innocent children were killed and buried under the church. This happened at many schools.
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January said:
I think that was Vaughan's point - Christians have condoned killing when it suited them.
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Indeed.

Bob Dylan wrote a song about it in the 1960's, "With God on Our Side". God is often evoked as justification for killing others. So called Christians are killing every day.
 

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