Black men arrested at Starbucks

Sunny

Sunny

SF VIP
Location
Maryland
https://www.vox.com/science-and-hea...delphia-starbucks-arrest-racial-bias-training

This is a very weird case. Two black men were waiting in a Philadelphia Starbucks for a third man to arrive, for a business meeting. Someone called the cops on them, because they were not eating or
drinking, apparently just sitting (or standing) there. They were arrested, apparently for the crime of being black.

Some questions that arise:

Who called the cops, and why?

Given the racial climate we are living in, why didn't they just order a damn cup of coffee while they were waiting? Why make an issue out of it? Starbuck's isn't a public place for meetings; it's a restaurant.

Is the Starbucks apology, and anti-bias training, going to change anything? (I guess the answer to that might partially depend on my first question: who called the cops? If they were called by a customer, how would anti-bias training for the Starbucks staff help?)

The two men were understandably outraged. But really, isn't all this drama queen stuff about "a meeting that was going to change our lives" a bit over the top? Any business meeting could potentially change your life.

Any thoughts on this?
 

This story has been in the news and discussed for over a week. The 2 men were on GMA this morning.

The manager called the police after the men were there TWO MINUTES.


https://www.google.com/amp/6abc.com/amp/2-men-arrested-at-starbucks-speak-out-on-gma/3364889/

Sunny, not sure what you mean when you say "given the racial climate we are in living in..." ...this is really nothing new. I also don't understand your drama queen comment.

I've seen a lot of discussion about this, and by far most whites say they have done exactly what those men did for a much longer time period and nobody called the cops, and they certainly weren't taken out in handcuffs.

As far as outrage, the white customers and also the white realtor/investor they were meeting with were also outraged.
 
The news said the manager of that Starbucks was fired, and all Starbucks are supposed to be shut down, for a few hours, in coming days, for some "sensitivity" training for all their employees. People sitting around in a fast food joint is not that uncommon, from what I've seen. It seems that every time we stop for a cup of coffee at a McDonalds, there are one or two people sitting around playing with their laptops...probably for an extended period of time...taking advantage of the local WiFi. Most of them have little more than a cup of coffee while they occupy the table/booth.
If this manager had an issue with them not ordering anything, and they told him they were waiting for another person to show up, that should have sufficed.
 

This situation is a tough one for me to decide who is right and who is wrong.

I've done the same thing and not experienced any repercussions. I think that the two men involved are right to push back and test this issue instead of just going up to the counter and purchasing a cup of coffee.

If Starbuck's has a written policy against loitering, using the bathrooms without making a purchase, etc... then I feel like the manager was doing her job and Starbucks should acknowledge that.

I also believe that it should be against the law for any business to deny a person access to a restroom.

I'm curious to see how this is resolved and where the line is drawn with business policies against loitering. I understand not wanting to turn your business into a homeless shelter. I don't understand how a business can craft a policy that covers people waiting for a few minutes to meet another person vs people who intend to camp out when it is too hot or too cold outside.

I think that this is one to watch!
 
Applecruncher, if they were only there two minutes before someone called the cops on them, that is of course ridiculous, and obviously racist.

My "given the racial climate" comment was referring to all the shootings of black men for absolutely no reason. They were foolish to be risking their own lives. Again, depending on how long they were there without ordering anything. If it was only two minutes, they did absolutely nothing wrong. If they were making a public issue about not ordering anything because they were there for a business meeting, they were foolish.

I'd say the same thing about a female American visitor walking around in Saudi Arabia wearing nothing but a bikini.
 
Aunt Bea, I agree about the restroom. What is a person is feeling sick? Should they be forced to buy food or a beverage before they are allowed to dash to the restroom?
 
This isn't complex - the manager over reacted based on racial stereotypes, and SB is trying to correct their tarnished image by the "training". On a positive note, by being thusly treated, they will now command some serious $$$s. God bless 'em.
 
Had they waited for their friend in the parking lot instead of hanging around inside (And not buying anything) there

would have been no "incident" regardless of their skin color.
 
Sunny said:
Applecruncher, if they were only there two minutes before someone called the cops on them, that is of course ridiculous, and obviously racist.

My "given the racial climate" comment was referring to all the shootings of black men for absolutely no reason. They were foolish to be risking their own lives. Again, depending on how long they were there without ordering anything. If it was only two minutes, they did absolutely nothing wrong. If they were making a public issue about not ordering anything because they were there for a business meeting, they were foolish.

I'd say the same thing about a female American visitor walking around in Saudi Arabia wearing nothing but a bikini.
Click to expand...

re: bikini Haha!! Okay, thanks for clarifying.

However, the fact that a black man in the US in 2018 needs to/"should" be more careful speaks volumes.
 
Falcon said:
Had they waited for their friend in the parking lot instead of hanging around inside (And not buying anything) there

would have been no "incident" regardless of their skin color.
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We don't know if they drove, or even if there is a parking lot. I know of several Starbucks and other cafes, etc. that don't have one.

Sunny said:
Aunt Bea, I agree about the restroom. What is a person is feeling sick? Should they be forced to buy food or a beverage before they are allowed to dash to the restroom?
Click to expand...

Several yrs ago I got sick while on a city bus, asked driver to let me off immediately, ran into a grocery store, and asked if I could use the restroom - and an employee directed me to where it was. Afterwards, I found the person and thanked her for her kindness.
​
 
It is done a lot, especially if it's business with someone who doesn't have an office. I agreed to meet the seller when I closed the deal to buy some land once, at a local Hardees. I was too nervous to eat. I can't imagine if the guys were just sitting there why anyone would call the police without even talking to them first.
 
NancyNGA said:
It is done a lot, especially if it's business with someone who doesn't have an office. I agreed to meet the seller when I closed the deal to buy some land once, at a local Hardees. I was too nervous to eat. I can't imagine if the guys were just sitting there why anyone would call the police without even talking to them first.
Click to expand...

Have you seen the video? Someone did say something, and they explained they were waiting for someone for a meeting.
 
ANYBODY can walk into a restaurant, walk to the restroom, use it and then leave the premises, and hardly any employee

or customer would think anything untoward was taking place. Maybe something else was going on that we're not being

told about. Ya think ?
 
Very few will see the facts for what they are. Few are even willing to discuss them.

They are simply this........

The reason that young black guys [and for that matter] black girls are scrutinized the way in which they are, is a simple matter of behavior . Behavior in the past, and behavior that continues today,...bad behavior. Which supports a well founded suspicion of criminal behavior.

The reason people in general & even the police pay little attention to elder black women & elder white women [and for that matter men] are the same....Behavior. Their behavior in the past & still today is not conducive to suspecting criminal activity.

Read the crime stats , note the prison population , note the death [by violence] rates, etc. & so-on. Young black men [and to a lesser degree women] are at the forefront of the list. Watch the evening news...who are the ones shooting each other in near record number ? [depending somewhat on location] , who is being arrested for various crimes ? [mostly drug related]....It is not elder black men & women or elder white men & women.....

The criminal behavior by young black folks is their's alone, & their's alone to be corrected. Should they choose to do so ? I sure hope some day soon they will do so.

Until then they will be known by reputation, and most sensible folks will guard themselves against it by various means.

Should this have happened ? No !...And establishing a reputation of better behavior is the only thing that will prevent it in the future.
 
I kinda think that if "something else was going on that we're not beingtold about" the manager would have told the bosses about it instead of letting them fire her.

I tend to think that if "something else was going on that we're not being told about" the white customers woud not have been so outraged and defended the two men.

And if "something else was going on that we're not being told about" I doubt the CEO of Starbucks would have gone on TV and admitted they were wrong.
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fuzzybuddy said:
Two Black guys calmly sitting in a Starbucks. Damn, The S.W.A.T team should have been activated, along with the National Guard, as well as put the Capitol and White House on Defcon3.
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Yeah. You know how those people have behavior problems! And there HAD to have been something going on that we don't know about. ummm hmmm

:wink:
 
This whole thing stinks of a set-up. The two black men in question should have ordered 2 cups of coffee. They chose not to do that . Why didn't they ? I believe the reason they did not order was to set-up a big paying lawsuit.

Secondly, COPS DO NOT JUST WALK INTO A RESTUARANT AND ARREST PEOPLE WITHOUT A DAMN GOOD REASON. More than likely the cops told them that "loitering was not permitted. Buy something or leave." If they chose to do neither , then they should have been arrested no matter what their color.
 
Traveler said:
This whole thing stinks of a set-up. The two black men in question should have ordered 2 cups of coffee. They chose not to do that . Why didn't they ? I believe the reason they did not order was to set-up a big paying lawsuit.

Secondly, COPS DO NOT JUST WALK INTO A RESTUARANT AND ARREST PEOPLE WITHOUT A DAMN GOOD REASON. More than likely the cops told them that "loitering was not permitted. Buy something or leave." If they chose to do neither , then they should have been arrested no matter what their color.
Click to expand...

Really? And the white investor and all the white customers were part of this set-up/scam?? :rolleyes:


The grasping at straws in this thread....incredible, but not surprising.

Note to Starbucks--> "training" is a waste of time and money.
 
applecruncher said:
Really? And the white investor and all the white customers were part of this set-up/scam?? :rolleyes:


The grasping at straws in this thread....incredible, but not surprising.

Note to Starbucks--> "training" is a waste of time and money.
Click to expand...

Nah, the "training" is about trying to remedy their tarnished image. Just another form of advertising/public relations. The actual "training" could be done with an email: "Treat everyone the same. Treat everyone with respect. The End."
 
applecruncher said:
Really? And the white investor and all the white customers were part of this set-up/scam??


The grasping at straws in this thread....incredible, but not surprising.

Note to Starbucks--> "training" is a waste of time and money.
Click to expand...


No, of course not. The scam, if that is what it was, was schemed in the minds of the 2 who were arrested. The remaining people were just innocent by-standers.
The proof will come with the astronomical financial settlement.
 
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