And so...the "recession" begins

I for one, would encourage Australia to kick those U.S. bases out of the country. If enough countries would do that, then maybe the U.S. government will take the hint and cut that massive defense budget.
Pine Gap is one of these US bases, and it is there because the US uses it to collect information learned from intercepting digital or otherwise electronic communications. Being the only such facility in the S Hemisphere it is extremely important to not only US, but also to the other "five eyes" countries that share such information. These countries are UK, USA, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand, and the information gathered by any one is shared with the other members.

Beyond this, it has been claimed that each country also gathers intelligence on other members of the Five Eyes alliance, and this information is then shared back to the country that has been spied on. This is done to evade laws regarding a country spying on its own citizens, while also maintaining a surveillance profile on those at home.

I don't think cutting such an important facility is a good idea for US or Australia.
 

Lately, I've been thinking about the direction the U.S. is heading -- particularly around bringing back manufacturing that its big companies have set up in other countries, and relying on tariffs to make imported goods less competitive, and force the hand of its own companies, or at least attempting to.

On the surface, it seems like, use economic pressure to bring jobs and factories back home, reduce reliance on foreign supply chains, and strengthen national self-sufficiency. Raise the cost of U.S. goods in its own country as an unfortunate consequence?

The ‘thinking way’ of world’s politicians is one thing – the ‘thinking way’ of the world’s citizens is something completely different. We are no longer in a world where price alone dictates purchasing habits – the now very much opinionated citizens of the world have moved on since then. Many people, especially younger generations across the world are turning away from American products not because they are expensive, but because they no longer trust the U.S. It’s no longer just about trade policy or manufacturing locations or tariffs. It's about how the U.S. is perceived globally, by citizens. (y)

Some here might not care what their nation is thought of globally, but when most nations around the world start to significantly dislike (to put it politely), the US anymore, it starts to turn into the US vs the rest of the world. And it’s not just Canadians saying they won’t visit anymore -- social media is full of people from other nations saying the same, and boycotting American goods too. (y)

America might be trying to shock the world into negotiating "better" trade deals. But in doing so, in the manner in which it is doing, may have accidentally turned a generation of global citizens/consumers against its brand entirely. People are boycotting U.S. goods not because of cost, but because of what those goods represent to them now. As they might perceive it: political instability, cultural arrogance, and heavy-handed, bullying diplomacy. (y)

Even if some U.S. companies decide to remain inside foreign countries, the label behind the product still reads "American", and for many consumers, that might be enough to say, I’m not going to buy American regardless of what country it's manufactured in.

What happens if, five or ten years from now, the U.S. decides it doesn't want to be isolated from world trade anymore? What if it wants to rejoin global trade networks and rebuild those bridges? It might be too late. Supply chains will already have moved on. Trust will be harder to rebuild than it was to destroy, in the minds of the global consumer. (y)

There is also the risk that, by shielding U.S. industries from competition for significant periods, innovation will stagnate. In the meantime, innovation outside the US continues. Without the pressure to compete globally, US domestic companies might lose the drive to improve, leading to complacency and falling behind technologically.

In trying to rebuild internal strength, in the manner in which it's doing, the U.S. might be pushing away the very world it wants to show its strength over. The rest of the world might not want to come back. Could that mean that if a recession is imminent, the rest of the world manages to eventually pull itself out, and the U.S. remains in one? (y)
(y) Some very good arguments above. Speculative, of course but speculation is all we have to rely on just now. That is why the current situation is so scary for everyone.
 
While the exact number fluctuates, there are approximately 13 US military bases in the UK, primarily Royal Air Force (RAF) bases, where US military personnel are stationed.

In the 1990s, there were around 100 US manned facilities in the UK, but that number has significantly decreased.


There are 13 US military bases in the Uk, perodminantly Air Force bases.. most not too far from where I live here in the East of England...



they are as follows...

The 13 bases are RAF Lakenheath, RAF Croughton, RAF Welford, RAF Fairford, RAF Feltwell, RAF Upwood, RAF Barford St John, RAF Blenheim Crescent, RAF Fylingdales, RAF Menwith Hill, RAF Mildenhall, RAF Alconbury and RAF Molesworth.

One of our prominent members here, has served and knows a couple of these Bases as he worked and lived on them for years. I won't name him, I'm sure he'll name himself if he feels he wants to...


There are 12,147 US military personnel in Britain, with access to 11 RAF bases.

Secret Deployments:

135 US Department of Defense (DoD) personnel are also permanently based in "multiple" undisclosed locations across the UK.

  • US Air Force Deployment:
    The US Air Force has a significant presence in Britain, with the third-largest deployment in the world.

  • London Presence:
    The US military has 100 personnel based in London, including 52 inside the American embassy.
 
Pine Gap is one of these US bases, and it is there because the US uses it to collect information learned from intercepting digital or otherwise electronic communications. Being the only such facility in the S Hemisphere it is extremely important to not only US, but also to the other "five eyes" countries that share such information. These countries are UK, USA, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand, and the information gathered by any one is shared with the other members.

Beyond this, it has been claimed that each country also gathers intelligence on other members of the Five Eyes alliance, and this information is then shared back to the country that has been spied on. This is done to evade laws regarding a country spying on its own citizens, while also maintaining a surveillance profile on those at home.

I don't think cutting such an important facility is a good idea for US or Australia.

For some considerable time, I've had the impression that we are all spying on each other -- friend and foe alike. There were rumors in the late 90's that the U.S. was paying France to spy on the UK.

The "Five Eyes" intelligence alliance have an agreement not to spy on each other, or at least not without letting the nation know later, along with letting that nation know what intelligence has been gathered. Which I think is what you are referring to?

Then we have the UK bugging the offices of the United Nations, allegedly, at the bequest of the Americans, and with their help. Something that was leaked and published in UK media at the time. I can vaguely remember the General Secretary of the UN in a short stand up interview being asked about it. His response made me think that spying at the UN was just a normal day at the office. He gave a kind of, yeah, it happens kind of response.

Then there was a G20 summit in London: Part of the UK's Intelligence Service, GCHQ set up "fake Internet cafés" near summit venues. These were designed to look like regular internet cafes, and worked in the same manner. But they were in fact created to monitor Login credentials, read Emails; log browsing habits of the G20 representatives, and record passwords entered into online forms.

It seems that many know this type of things happen, a lot. It’s just rude to talk about it too loudly.
 
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I don't think cutting such an important facility is a good idea for US or Australia.
I graduated from the school of optimism and am now a pessimist. From my point of view, the U.S. as a superpower is on its last legs. I think a lot of people have their heads firmly buried in sand and think things will blissfully continue on. So what will your country do, when the inevitable happens?
 
For some considerable time, I've had the impression that we are all spying on each other -- friend and foe alike. There were rumors in the late 90's that the U.S. was paying France to spy on the UK.

The "Five Eyes" intelligence alliance have an agreement not to spy on each other, or at least not without letting the nation know later, along with letting that nation know what intelligence has been gathered. Which I think is what you are referring to?

Then we have the UK bugging the offices of the United Nations, allegedly, at the bequest of the Americans, and with their help. Something that was leaked and published in UK media at the time. I can vaguely remember the General Secretary of the UN in a short stand up interview being asked about it. His response made me think that spying at the UN was just a normal day at the office. He gave a kind of, yeah, it happens kind of response.

Then there was a G20 summit in London: Part of the UK's Intelligence Service, GCHQ set up "fake Internet cafés" near summit venues. These were designed to look like regular internet cafes, and worked in the same manner. But they were in fact created to monitor Login credentials, read Emails; log browsing habits of the G20 representatives, and record passwords entered into online forms.

It seems that many know this type of things happen, a lot. It’s just rude to talk about it too loudly.
a sorta: even the good side nations can't trust each other completely - so really know one in the world are trusting - just pretending? it's like an electronic zoo for humans that we live in - it all looks normal but never is - no one can trust anyone else?
 
I graduated from the school of optimism and am now a pessimist. From my point of view, the U.S. as a superpower is on its last legs. I think a lot of people have their heads firmly buried in sand and think things will blissfully continue on. So what will your country do, when the inevitable happens?
Good question. When it comes to a choice between US and China our natural instinct is for US. We also have historic affiliation with Commonwealth countries - UK, New Zealand and Canada. Although not a member of NATO we have usually fronted up to support military actions that NATO has been involved in, although it might not be NATO per se given that UK and US are NATO members. Even so, I'm not at all confident that either of these powers would come to our aid, especially if they already had their hands full.

One thing is certain, if we do become under attack from China, we will probably be on our own. We need to think strategically and build up the best systems that would allow us to have a fighting chance to avoid invasion.
 
China has its own problems. They claim 1.4 billion population, but analysts insist the real figure is around 400 million! They import energy and food in mass quantities and they need export markets to afford any of that.

I expect China to fold and make a deal. They are not in any position to attempt aggression, at least not toward the US.
 
But the market going into "bear" territory, especially seeing the free fall that happened Friday spooks "main street". People saw their investments, including their 401Ks, shrink significantly and will be spooked and start tightening their belts.
Volatility is a fact of life when playing the stock market.

There are people waiting for stocks to drop even more, because they want to do Roth Conversions and limit their tax liability. The money stays in the market, awaiting the next upturn.
 
The plan is to purposely crash the economy because poor people are easier to control. Billionaires will get richer by buying stocks, homes, etc when the prices are low.

It’s not hard to find the information on why this is happening. 10 years ago I never would have believed this could happen in America.
So you know it now and this is your chance to buy stocks and homes now.
 
For some considerable time, I've had the impression that we are all spying on each other -- friend and foe alike. There were rumors in the late 90's that the U.S. was paying France to spy on the UK.

The "Five Eyes" intelligence alliance have an agreement not to spy on each other, or at least not without letting the nation know later, along with letting that nation know what intelligence has been gathered. Which I think is what you are referring to?

Then we have the UK bugging the offices of the United Nations, allegedly, at the bequest of the Americans, and with their help. Something that was leaked and published in UK media at the time. I can vaguely remember the General Secretary of the UN in a short stand up interview being asked about it. His response made me think that spying at the UN was just a normal day at the office. He gave a kind of, yeah, it happens kind of response.

Then there was a G20 summit in London: Part of the UK's Intelligence Service, GCHQ set up "fake Internet cafés" near summit venues. These were designed to look like regular internet cafes, and worked in the same manner. But they were in fact created to monitor Login credentials, read Emails; log browsing habits of the G20 representatives, and record passwords entered into online forms.

It seems that many know this type of things happen, a lot. It’s just rude to talk about it too loudly.
pardon?? thought I heard a pin drop then?? cough cough
 
Good question. When it comes to a choice between US and China our natural instinct is for US. We also have historic affiliation with Commonwealth countries - UK, New Zealand and Canada. Although not a member of NATO we have usually fronted up to support military actions that NATO has been involved in, although it might not be NATO per se given that UK and US are NATO members. Even so, I'm not at all confident that either of these powers would come to our aid, especially if they already had their hands full.

One thing is certain, if we do become under attack from China, we will probably be on our own. We need to think strategically and build up the best systems that would allow us to have a fighting chance to avoid invasion.
we'ze already invaded ; they are filling up our universities and some very nice cute ones too!!

oh this is so exciting : the human race is coming together in a big cheating way! SO EXCITING i KEEP MISSING THE NEWS!!!
 
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pardon?? thought I heard a pin drop then?? cough cough
Just a thought: maybe we should be careful with keywords here, or we might end up flagged on some NSA, GCHQ, or even DGSE watchlist. Wouldn’t want to give the French a reason to join the party too!
 
we'ze already invaded ; they are filling up our universities and some very nice cute ones too!!

oh this is so exciting : the human race is coming together in a big cheating way! SO EXCITING i KEEP MISSING THE NEWS!!!
A fascinating mix of light sarcasm and dark humour. How do you do it? :)
 
"The stock market is not the economy. Wall Street isn't Main Street."

WEPndy.jpg
 


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