Kate Smith banned by Yankees

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chic said:
When do we ban George Washington's memory because he was a slave owner? History is history.
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I think it's long overdue to stop white washing this country's history. Washington was a slave owner. As were two out of three of the "Founding Fathers". They also were elitists. The only people that were allowed to vote were white men who owned property. No women (that would include you) no blacks, no Indians. And all that was just as morally wrong back then as it is today. I'm sick and tired of the way people keep referring to the "Founding Fathers" as if they are some kind of God like individuals. These were very flawed men. And I feel no obligation to revere every thing they said and did as if it were the word of God.

 

Trade said:
I think it's long overdue to stop white washing this country's history. Washington was a slave owner. As were two out of three of the "Founding Fathers". They also were elitists. The only people that were allowed to vote were white men who owned property. No women (that would include you) no blacks, no Indians. And all that was just as morally wrong back then as it is today. I'm sick and tired of the way people keep referring to the "Founding Fathers" as if they are some kind of God like individuals. These were very flawed men. And I feel no obligation to revere every thing they said and did as if it were the word of God.

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All of humanity is flawed. And as for "white washing history," how freakin' ABSURD. History is just that...history. It cannot be changed no matter how much people don't like it with their newly-discovered sensibilities. We just have to do better NOW.
 

applecruncher said:
Some of you actually have a solution to many problems:

Get over it! Move on!

What's up with the #metoo stuff? Pffft.
Sexual harassment, rape, ----> Get over it! Move on!
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Doncha love it when white people tell you racism isn't a problem?
 
Trade said:
I think it's long overdue to stop white washing this country's history. Washington was a slave owner. As were two out of three of the "Founding Fathers". They also were elitists. The only people that were allowed to vote were white men who owned property. No women (that would include you) no blacks, no Indians. And all that was just as morally wrong back then as it is today. I'm sick and tired of the way people keep referring to the "Founding Fathers" as if they are some kind of God like individuals. These were very flawed men. And I feel no obligation to revere every thing they said and did as if it were the word of God.

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I agree. "Founding Fathers" ...Pffft. :rolleyes:
 
C'est Moi said:
All of humanity is flawed. And as for "white washing history," how freakin' ABSURD. History is just that...history. It cannot be changed no matter how much people don't like it with their newly-discovered sensibilities. We just have to do better NOW.
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History is being rewritten all the time. Most of the history that is being taught in our schools is propaganda written with an agenda in mind.

For some real history start by reading Howard Zinn's "A Peoples History of the United States"
 
Louis CK pretty much sums up the way I feel about race.

Warning: language







 
Did everyone read the article mentioned by the OP? At the end of the article, Kate Smith wrote a doctrine of sorts that stated the following message. It seems to me that she had a change of heart and maybe even asking for forgiveness? My beliefs aren't everyone's beliefs, I know that and understand that we all live by a set of principles that we were either taught or learned. No one would argue that racism isn't still alive today in America, but we have come a long way. Yes, there is more work to be done. Looking back when Kate sang her songs that were demeaning to blacks, they were acceptable because that was the mentality of the whites living back then. It was a bad attempt at having humor. After reading Kate's comments regarding having tolerance, maybe we can all learn something from reading it.

Kate Smith on “The Value of Tolerance”
“It seems to me that faith in the decency of human beings is what we must have more of, if there is to be a future for all of us in this world. We read in the papers every day about conferences on the best way to keep the peace. Well, I’m not an expert on foreign affairs — and I don’t pretend to know all the complex things that will have to be done for a lasting peace. But I am a human being — and I do know something about people. I know that our statesmen — our armies of occupation — our military strategists — may all fail if the peoples of the world don’t learn to understand and tolerate each other.
“Race hatreds — social prejudices — religious bigotry — they are the diseases that eat away the fibers of peace. Unless they are exterminated it’s inevitable that we will have another war. And where are they going to be exterminated? At a conference table in Geneva? Not by a long shot. In your own city — your church — your children’s school — perhaps in your own home.
“You and I must do it – every father and mother in the world, every teacher, everyone who can rightfully call himself a human being. Yes, it seems to me that the one thing the peoples of the world have got to learn if we are ever to have a lasting peace, is — tolerance. Of what use will it be if the lights go on again all over the world — if they don’t go on … in our hearts.”
​
 
oldman said:
“It seems to me that faith in the decency of human beings is what we must have more of, if there is to be a future for all of us in this world. We read in the papers every day about conferences on the best way to keep the peace. Well, I’m not an expert on foreign affairs — and I don’t pretend to know all the complex things that will have to be done for a lasting peace. But I am a human being — and I do know something about people. I know that our statesmen — our armies of occupation — our military strategists — may all fail if the peoples of the world don’t learn to understand and tolerate each other.
“Race hatreds — social prejudices — religious bigotry — they are the diseases that eat away the fibers of peace. Unless they are exterminated it’s inevitable that we will have another war. And where are they going to be exterminated? At a conference table in Geneva? Not by a long shot. In your own city — your church — your children’s school — perhaps in your own home.
“You and I must do it – every father and mother in the world, every teacher, everyone who can rightfully call himself a human being. Yes, it seems to me that the one thing the peoples of the world have got to learn if we are ever to have a lasting peace, is — tolerance. Of what use will it be if the lights go on again all over the world — if they don’t go on … in our hearts.”​
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Much wisdom there. Sadlly, especially over the past decade, hatred by people of all stripes seems to be increasing.
 
@ Oldman
@ Tommy

So Kate Smith essentially said:

Racism is wrong
People should be nicer to each other
Everyone should practice tolerance and respect

Sorry, but that's not exactly a newsflash and saying those things in 1945 or at any other time doesn't make Kate Smith wise, and the fact remains that several of her songs were racist and disgusting. With regard to race relations, I don't see the last ten years as being that much worse than the.last twenty, thirty, or even fifty years.
 
I'd be curious to know what took place in her life between the early 1930's and 1945, when she apparently came out as a big advocate for racial tolerance. Did she suddenly have a moment of enlightenment? ("OMG, what have I done?") Was there a public outcry? Did it take the Holocaust to raise people's awareness? Why the extreme change?

This is in no way an excuse or apology for the racism that passed as "humor" for many, many years. I've never understood why Al Jolson was considered such a great performer; I find his
blackface routines painful to watch. And the lyrics of some of those songs are just as awful, with or without the blackface.

I've directed a number of plays for our little theater group, based on old radio and TV shows. Wading through a lot of the old scripts, trying to find something that a modern audience would enjoy,
I've been horrified by the offensiveness of a lot of the so-called humor. And some of it was well after the period when Kate Smith sang those songs. People have such a misty-eyed fondness for those old radio shows, such as Ozzie and Harriet, Fibber McGee and Molly, even Fred Allen. (Not to mention Amos 'n Andy!) Many of those old shows can be heard again, thanks to Google, and the
scripts are available free of charge. They are horrible! Some are not as serious as the racist ones, but would we really laugh today at jokes about dumb blondes, stupid female drivers, characters who are routinely "drunk" week after week, mother-in-law jokes. etc.?

So I guess I come down on the side of those who say that level of humor is a disgusting, embarrassing part of our legacy as Americans. But punishing the performers who took part, before their consciousness was raised, is kind of pointless, especially when they have long been dead.

Which brings us to the statues of Confederate generals, streets and schools named after them, etc. What should be done about that? Isn't this Kate Smith brouhaha sort of about the same thing?
 
In those days, there were rules. People liked rules. We all, no matter what color we were, knew the rules and knew where we belonged in those rules. We danced the dance of racism together, we still do. We were/are all responsible for the parts we played then, and the parts we play now.

Its easy to proclaim you are not racist on a forum. But where do you live, who are your neighbors? I live in a racially mixed neighborhood. Blacks, whites, Hispanics, and some interracial marriages between us all with even more diversity. We are so fortunate in that none of us are racist, all of us are friendly, and there are no problems on the block. If only the world could be as kind as this neighborhood is, I hate that I have to move.

Sunny, I am reluctant to address anything regarding the Holocaust. The issues surrounding the Holocaust were and are currently political issues and can not be discussed on this forum.
 
Society can not bend over far enough to correct wrongs of the past. Laws have been put in place to prevent wrongs of past generation from repeating. Maybe a flood is the answer as recorded in the Bible, because the world had gotten so evil.
 
Rgp's remark sounded pretty racist to me.

Trade said:
It did to me too. And his was not the only one either.
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OK, I'll say it, I prefer my own people, white people....so if that makes me a racist?...then I suppose i am.

Do not try to shame me....it won't work.

I'm willing to bet that most here......are the same.....preferring their own. But they will never admit it.
 
Trade said:
So what? Black people have had to placate us whites for centuries. Maybe it's time for us to take our turn in the barrel.
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You can take YOUR turn anywhere you like; do not presume to speak for me. You don't know anything about "us whites" other than your own experience. I have lived my life as best I can and I only expect other people to do the same, regardless of color. Frankly, I don't see anyone being "held back" today if they have the gumption to get out there and work for the life they want.

These discussions never go anywhere because the same people make the same tired arguments. I try to stay out of it because usually, it makes my blood boil to hear white people vilified over crap that happened years ago and we cannot change today. I'm a decent person and most of the people I know are the same, no matter their ethnicity.

Here's a young man that has a healthy outlook on life. (CAUTION: Language)

 
C'est Moi said:
Seriously?? You'd stoop to comparing rape victims and Holocaust survivors with being butt-hurt over a SONG? More pathetic than I originally imagined.
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It's not about a song. It's the fact that prejudice and discrimination in our culture hasn't changed much. In fact, has increased tremendously in the last couple of years. Maybe you haven't kept up with the news. And it's not just about Black and White. It's anyone that isn't "just like us". I'm not saying that's you. Not at all. But there are more and more like rpg, who don't even try to pretend anymore, because they've got many just like them. Sadly. People just have to speak up.
 
C'est Moi said:
You can take YOUR turn anywhere you like; do not presume to speak for me. You don't know anything about "us whites" other than your own experience. I have lived my life as best I can and I only expect other people to do the same, regardless of color. Frankly, I don't see anyone being "held back" today if they have the gumption to get out there and work for the life they want.

These discussions never go anywhere because the same people make the same tired arguments. I try to stay out of it because usually, it makes my blood boil to hear white people vilified over crap that happened years ago and we cannot change today. I'm a decent person and most of the people I know are the same, no matter their ethnicity.
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http://www.execonn.com/matt/Docs/EightPrin.htm


The universe demands balance. The Law of Compensation is that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. If the pendulum swings one way, it must always swing back the other way.
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I don't make the rules. Our turn in the barrel is coming whether you or I like it or not. That's the law of the universe. If you have any complaints you'll just have to take it up with whomever is in charge. Since I'm an Atheist I can't tell you who that might be.

:tongue:
 
C'est Moi said:
You don't know anything about "us whites" other than your own experience.
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So In spite of being a white dude for 72 years, I don't know anything about being white except for my own experience?

And yet you, a white woman, for however many years, present yourself as someone who knows a whole lot about what it's like to be black?

Could you explain the thought process that you used to arrive at those conclusions? Because I just don't get it.
 

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