More kids die from gunshot than anything else.

CooCooforCoCoPuffs said:
The other countries cannot be compared to the US regarding gun ownership and use, period.
Find another country the size, and the multinational demographics of the United States, that comes even close, that also has FIFTY independent state governments.

The US is the THIRD largest country by population and the fourth largest by area. Of the four, only two are non-communist countries or communist dictator led countries. The diversity of cultures is unmatched as is the geography/boundaries; political-constitutional makeup.
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What has all that to do with my post you quoted re gang related shootings and teen deaths not being ok either ???
 

CooCooforCoCoPuffs said:
So I say take away the guns from all blacks until the role models don't "suck".
Clearly, that won't work because then we'd be called racists - as alway
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And not worry about taking them from young white men?

Seem to recall quite a few mass shootings being done by them

If I was always being called a racist I would have to consider why that is so.
 

January said:
And not worry about taking them from young white men?

Seem to recall quite a few mass shootings being done by them

If I was always being called a racist I would have to consider why that is so.
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Who knows, maybe if background checks meant something, if red flag laws were implemented all across the country, if real records were kept of purchases, etc., maybe the numbers of gun deaths would drop right?
 
Laws / regulations and whatever are only good if it can be enforced. Many deaths are illegal guns how do you fix that ?
Laws vary by state and frankly anything done on a federal level is destined to be a failure by the weight of bureaucracy.

Background checks are often flawed by many states do not fill in their reporting (some close to a year behind) .. in the federal system that is suppose to stop others from obtaining a gun. so other then a speed bump the system is not the safe guard some feel it is.

Red flag laws are flawed by human nature ...

Anything requiring states to report leads to a mess.....
The big jump in the 2022 crime stats recently from approx -2+% to 4.6% was due to some places still not filled in their stats to FBI from 2 years ago. where is the accountability? if we do not even hold our local/ state government to be accurate and on time reporting.
Stats using this system are useless IMO. How about we do not release false data that is always adjusted after the fact when people have gone on making assumptions on bad data.
 
Youth need education on alternate methods of conflict resolution.
Perhaps a course on conflict resolution, not just something mentioned or conversationally talked about.
But would likely be just about as effective as any firearms laws.
Those who don't want to hear it, won't hear it, just as those who refuse to obey the law, don't.
And apparently there's always a chance of a presidential pardon for those who refuse to follow firearms laws.
 
Inept said:
They only can chose what is on offer. If you've got no income and your pockets are empty and there's a man in front of you flashing his cash ....... there's the choice of your future .... good and bad.
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No idea what you're talking about. When I was homeless, penniless and had used all options available, on offer and in front of me, in the early 80's living in a tent in the woods ... I pulled myself up by my bootstraps and turned my life around. And no I'm not a unicorn. Where there is a will there is a way ... for anyone should they desire to make something of themselves.

But that isn't what this thread is about.

In the military, I heard it said that 1% of the sailors caused 90% of the problems
In 2020 black youth were 15% of youth population yet caused 47% of firearms violence
But those statistics were from those cities and states that did report. Perhaps a larger percentage was attributable.

There are no simple solutions. Perhaps it will take a compendium of broad measures.
These threads come up from time to time. Occasionally new ideas are offered.

I offered the suggestion of a required course in conflict resolution. You offered thread drift.
 
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Inept said:
They only can chose what is on offer. If you've got no income and your pockets are empty and there's a man in front of you flashing his cash ....... there's the choice of your future .... good and bad.
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Naturally said:
No idea what you're talking about.
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That's a pity.
Naturally said:
When I was homeless, penniless and had used all options available, on offer and in front of me, in the early 80's living in a tent in the woods ... I pulled myself up by my bootstraps and turned my life around. And no I'm not a unicorn.
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That's good.
Naturally said:
Where there is a will there is a way ... for anyone should they desire to make something of themselves.
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Sorry, but I don't believe that.
Naturally said:
There are no simple solutions.
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Simple? No, that's a fact.
Naturally said:
Perhaps it will take a compendium of broad measures.
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For sure.
Naturally said:
These threads come up from time to time.
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Yes.
Naturally said:
Occasionally new ideas are offered.
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I haven't seen any.
 
Jeni said:
Laws / regulations and whatever are only good if it can be enforced. Many deaths are illegal guns how do you fix that ?
Laws vary by state and frankly anything done on a federal level is destined to be a failure by the weight of bureaucracy.

Background checks are often flawed by many states do not fill in their reporting (some close to a year behind) .. in the federal system that is suppose to stop others from obtaining a gun. so other then a speed bump the system is not the safe guard some feel it is.

Red flag laws are flawed by human nature ...

Anything requiring states to report leads to a mess.....
The big jump in the 2022 crime stats recently from approx -2+% to 4.6% was due to some places still not filled in their stats to FBI from 2 years ago. where is the accountability? if we do not even hold our local/ state government to be accurate and on time reporting.
Stats using this system are useless IMO. How about we do not release false data that is always adjusted after the fact when people have gone on making assumptions on bad data.
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Sounds like you're looking for an excuse to not bother doing anything to be quite frank.
 
Warrigal said:
Any complex problem is never going to be solved with a single action. You've no doubt heard of "top down design" that was a key feature of the NASA project to land a man on the Moon.

Beginning at the top with the goal, every part of the project was analysed and subdivided into smaller goals until every aspect of the project was clearly set out. Then work began on those tasks on which the final goal depended.

Attention to every sub goal was necessary if the mission was to be successful.

Think of gun violence as a mighty mission that needs good planning, human and financial resources to overcome. If US could overcome all of the problems they encountered last century, working with computers with less processing power than an early desktop PC, then all that is lacking to deal with the extraordinary level of deaths and injury caused by modern firearms** is the will to try.

** We are not dealing about muzzle loading rifles anymore. Today civilians have access to the most lethal killing machines ever invented. That is just one of the subproblems that needs to be analysed if the death toll is to be lowered. Juvenile gangs is another, but separate issue.
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We don't have the will to try. We don't even always agree that there is a problem.
 
Irishdude said:
We don't have the will to try. We don't even always agree that there is a problem.
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It would seem that the dream of Camelot in America has evaporated like morning mist.
Pity, because the US Space programs inspired the whole world.

Most of all, it was courageous and visionary.
Much benefit came of the endeavour that we now take for granted.
 
Debrah N. said:
Sounds like you're looking for an excuse to not bother doing anything to be quite frank.
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NOT at all i would be happier if the laws/ rules worked as they are suppose to. hold locals/ states accountable to have info completed in a reasonable time frame. As many background checks are 7-10 days then any offense or reason a person should not have a gun should be entered in FBI NICS system in less then 10 days.
Seems convenient to let a haphazard system fail to push for more and more restrictive laws on those who follow them. As we all know none of the check marks stop illegal trade.
 
Jeni said:
NOT at all i would be happier if the laws/ rules worked as they are suppose to. hold locals/ states accountable to have info completed in a reasonable time frame. As many background checks are 7-10 days then any offense or reason a person should not have a gun should be entered in FBI NICS system in less then 10 days.
Seems convenient to let a haphazard system fail to push for more and more restrictive laws on those who follow them. As we all know none of the check marks stop illegal trade.
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You’re right, laws are only good if they are b enforced. For multiple reasons, your government system is set up so that big money is allowed to buy government and voters have accepted that. And at this point, I don’t think there’s really a will or a way to force change. I suppose you’ll just have to get used to hearing ’thoughts and prayers’ instead of solutions.
 
Warrigal said:
It would seem that the dream of Camelot in America has evaporated like morning mist.
Pity, because the US Space programs inspired the whole world.

Most of all, it was courageous and visionary.
Much benefit came of the endeavour that we now take for granted.
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That was an era before the rise of murderous youth gangs and the proliferation of semiautomatic weapons.
 
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