Obamacare

[AZ Jim]

19 million divided by 319 million = .05956 or about 6% of the population. Sounds pretty poor to me. Plus my medical insurance now cost me more to have and it pays less than before. OH lucky me.

EVERYONE wasn't supposed to be signed up. Millions had their work insurance, millions more their own plans and still more millions had Medicare. Over 50 million on Medicare alone. Any other questions? *eyes roll*

 

[BobF]

I'm just being pessimistic, because aside from a few exceptions the incumbent party usually loses the presidency, especially after having it for two terms. I can't imagine which of the GOP hopefuls would be the most electable at this point; look how John McCain threw away his chances in 2008 by taking on Sarah Palin as VP candidate. Of course, remember what Mitt Romney did last election with his ill-advised characterization of 47% of the electorate as being government-dependent-moochers.

watch the video

Way-to-go Mitt, no wonder he's decided not to run.

Exactly right. Nearly half of us retirees and lower income folks end up paying no taxes at all but we all do end up depending on the government for support. Those are facts, to say the least. I am one of them and don't understand that at all. Our entire tax system needs redone and all of us should expect to pay some small percentage to the government as a thank you for their looking out for us. More important is that some large and profitable companies like GE should be made to pay taxes on their earnings. If they don't pay taxes in other countries then that money should be taxed in the US. A few years back it was reported that GE paid no taxes in the US. If this was true then the tax laws are wrong and filled with far too many escape holes for those who can afford good tax law attorneys to help them to beat the system. Right now we are stuck with a government that cares nothing about how much debt they are creating and also don't seem to care about ending industries from not paying taxes either. Darn shame. I hope our next President will make that one of his or hers number one priorities. End the money handouts to the undeserving and make sure all of us do have a bit of awareness of the needs of the government. We could likely cut the governments needs by a bunch if we just got rid of a lot of them and let private enterprise handle lots of the jobs.

 

[QuickSilver]

EVERYONE wasn't supposed to be signed up. Millions had their work insurance, millions more their own plans and still more millions had Medicare. Over 50 million on Medicare alone. Any other questions? *eyes roll*

Very true.... I think the 19 millions went above the original expectation.. AND of course healthcare premiums went up.. but not because of Obamacare.. Healthcare premiums ALWAYS go up... however, they have gone up LESS with the implementation of Obamacare

 

[Don M.]

I am Optimistically hoping that we will see a move towards a SP-UHC system...Socialized Medicine, if you prefer...in the Not Too Distant future. These kinds of plans are in place in most of the rest of the Western world, and the people in those nations have a better overall health and longevity than we do...AND at half the costs. I think Obamacare and all this Partisan Bickering is going to PO the bulk of our people to the point where the majority will begin to demand such a system. Between our greedy drug companies, the overhead of dozens of For Profit insurance companies, medical specialists having 7 of the top 10 annual incomes, and doctors who have to order multiple needless tests to protect themselves from an Army of Ambulance Chasing Lawyers, our present system is quickly becoming unaffordable....not only to individuals, but the government, as well.

I'll make a prediction that by the end of this decade, our present system will be in such a mess that it is going to require a complete overhaul...and all our government needs to do is look at what is working out quite well for the people in these other nations, and adapt many of the same principles, here.

The biggest hurdle will be getting our politicians out of the hip pockets of the Big Money Boys in our Health Care Industry. We USED to have a Medical Profession, but now it is the Health Care Industry...and the First Priority of Any industry is to make money.

 

[AZ Jim]

Very true.... I think the 19 millions went above the original expectation.. AND of course healthcare premiums went up.. but not because of Obamacare.. Healthcare premiums ALWAYS go up... however, they have gone up LESS with the implementation of Obamacare

Also millions in armed forces covered there. I imagine if we had the numbers for those "expected" to be signed up (and not otherwise covered) we would see a HUGE difference in percentages.

 

[drifter]

It's a long time till election but at the present the Queen Bee is in the Driver's seat. Who, pray tell, do the GOP have that is electable. They seem to be so fractured. A number of them can attract votes but not enough to garner a nomination or if so, who among them can come close to beating the democratic nominee. I see the GOP having many contenders but little leadership. Where are the statesmen(can we dare use that word today)? Those behind the scenes giants like William Buckley, who dictated conservative policy, or Goldwater, who became a Senior Statesman. Where are people with vision who would serve their country over making a buck. They may not exist, I don't know, but they should. The GOP needs a leader and that man is not yet on the horizon. I fear the democrats will win by default and Madam President, what dreams do you have for your country?

 

[AZ Jim]

It's a long time till election but at the present the Queen Bee is in the Driver's seat. Who, pray tell, do the GOP have that is electable. They seem to be so fractured. A number of them can attract votes but not enough to garner a nomination or if so, who among them can come close to beating the democratic nominee. I see the GOP having many contenders but little leadership. Where are the statesmen(can we dare use that word today)? Those behind the scenes giants like William Buckley, who dictated conservative policy, or Goldwater, who became a Senior Statesman. Where are people with vision who would serve their country over making a buck. They may not exist, I don't know, but they should. The GOP needs a leader and that man is not yet on the horizon. I fear the democrats will win by default and Madam President, what dreams do you have for your country?

Unlike you I HOPE we Democrats triumph of the ship of fools that are the Republican contenders.

 

[BobF]

Very true.... I think the 19 millions went above the original expectation.. AND of course healthcare premiums went up.. but not because of Obamacare.. Healthcare premiums ALWAYS go up... however, they have gone up LESS with the implementation of Obamacare

Some mental adjustment being made here. I was in a industry insurance plan and as happened during the signup times, many of us were told to find other insurance as they were going to get out of trying to keep up with the Obama care plans. So I and thousands of other were required to move to Obama care or do without any insurance. My company was one of the larger ones in the US and at that time it was reported that more than one company had chosen to leave care for the retirees to the retirees choices. We got a cash allowance to use toward any insurance we decided on. The Obama plan did not include all coverages that our employer had so we then selected those items to add to the Obama care. All told we pay more, have a higher initial cash to the services prior to insurance starting to pay and so far all is more than we had to pay prior to Obama care.

 

[AZ Jim]

Some mental adjustment being made here. I was in a industry insurance plan and as happened during the signup times, many of us were told to find other insurance as they were going to get out of trying to keep up with the Obama care plans. So I and thousands of other were required to move to Obama care or do without any insurance. My company was one of the larger ones in the US and at that time it was reported that more than one company had chosen to leave care for the retirees to the retirees choices. We got a cash allowance to use toward any insurance we decided on. The Obama plan did not include all coverages that our employer had so we then selected those items to add to the Obama care. All told we pay more, have a higher initial cash to the services prior to insurance starting to pay and so far all is more than we had to pay prior to Obama care.

I retired in 1991 and was to be covered by group insurance for life. Within one year I got a similar notice and a slight increase in pension to "cover" my insurance. That was a LONG time before Obamacare!!

 

[QuickSilver]

Part of Obamacare is that companies over a certain number of full time employees HAVE to provide healthcare.. they cannot drop it and tell everyone to fend for themselves..

 

[BobF]

One comment I make is that it is far too soon to start the campaign for the next President. We have an entire year yet before we get so fired up about who might be next. Remember Obama showed up in the middle of the Democrat campaign and we all thought Hillary would be the one but instead Obama came and dazzled all that were listening. Today it is only some of the dazzled that still think he is so great. I think I just posted this new number of finally back up to 50% from as low as 4?% a years or so back.

I still think that Hillary will still be around for the election, she has wanted that place for 8 years already.

Who of the Republicans will get selected? Lets just wait a year for all that to settle out. It is way too early for most to even care.

 

[Ameriscot]

I am Optimistically hoping that we will see a move towards a SP-UHC system...Socialized Medicine, if you prefer...in the Not Too Distant future. These kinds of plans are in place in most of the rest of the Western world, and the people in those nations have a better overall health and longevity than we do...AND at half the costs. I think Obamacare and all this Partisan Bickering is going to PO the bulk of our people to the point where the majority will begin to demand such a system. Between our greedy drug companies, the overhead of dozens of For Profit insurance companies, medical specialists having 7 of the top 10 annual incomes, and doctors who have to order multiple needless tests to protect themselves from an Army of Ambulance Chasing Lawyers, our present system is quickly becoming unaffordable....not only to individuals, but the government, as well.

I'll make a prediction that by the end of this decade, our present system will be in such a mess that it is going to require a complete overhaul...and all our government needs to do is look at what is working out quite well for the people in these other nations, and adapt many of the same principles, here.

The biggest hurdle will be getting our politicians out of the hip pockets of the Big Money Boys in our Health Care Industry. We USED to have a Medical Profession, but now it is the Health Care Industry...and the First Priority of Any industry is to make money.

The US is the only industrialised country that does not have socialised medicine.

 

[AZ Jim]

One comment I make is that it is far too soon to start the campaign for the next President. We have an entire year yet before we get so fired up about who might be next. Remember Obama showed up in the middle of the Democrat campaign and we all thought Hillary would be the one but instead Obama came and dazzled all that were listening. Today it is only some of the dazzled that still think he is so great. I think I just posted this new number of finally back up to 50% from as low as 4?% a years or so back.

I still think that Hillary will still be around for the election, she has wanted that place for 8 years already.

Who of the Republicans will get selected? Lets just wait a year for all that to settle out. It is way too early for most to even care.

If it's too early to influence anyone about 2016 Presidential elections why are you constantly pissing and moaning about Obama?

 

[QuickSilver]

Originally Posted by BobF Let it be state choices like most things should be. Current government has no respect for states to run things as they see fit, for anything at all.

I want to comment on this.. Leaving it up to the States is ridiculous. For one thing... there are Rich states, like Maryland and New Jersey... and there are poor states... like Mississippi. Do you believe that those lucky enough to be living in a rich state are more deserving of healthcare than those in poorer states? Why should American citizens be denied basic healthcare simply because of which state they were born in. Healthcare is a right of every US citizen, and it cannot be provided equally by every state.. This is why it's a Federal issue and responsibility... unless of course you don't believe we were all created equal.

 

[AZ Jim]

I want to comment on this.. Leaving it up to the States is ridiculous. For one thing... there are Rich states, like Maryland and New Jersey... and there are poor states... like Mississippi. Do you believe that those lucky enough to be living in a rich state are more deserving of healthcare than those in poorer states? Why should American citizens be denied basic healthcare simply because of which state they were born in. Healthcare is a right of every US citizen, and it cannot be provided equally by every state.. This is why it's a Federal issue and responsibility... unless of course you don't believe we were all created equal.

Ironically this guy depends on federal government in several ways as do these other Republicans but they have so little forward vision they fail to understand they are actually voting AGAINST their own well being. When, God forbid they lose their Social Security, their Medicare, Medicaid, Long term unemployment comp.......then the lights come on, but, alas it's far too late.

 

[BobF]

If it's too early to influence anyone about 2016 Presidential elections why are you constantly pissing and moaning about Obama?

He deserves the criticism over the unmeasured love of how he has avoided working with our Congress and for creating such a grand debt for us to repay some day. He just does not work as our Constitution has suggested the government to work. Basically, Obama is out of control and does not care at all. He is like a kid playing with his new toy. We do have two more years till the election.

 

[BobF]

The US is the only industrialised country that does not have socialised medicine.

Maybe because we have had one of the best in the world and took care of sick folks from around the world. Also, it was possible in the US to get taken care of and not have to pay for all the care you got if you were poor. I don't even think that is possible with Obama care. But if so then the government must be giving the care away to the poor. Why force others into that system. We could have just set up a system for those that could not have afforded to buy their own insurance. Lots of ways we could have gone and not just idolized our way into Obama care. It should have all been set up by our Congress, and it was not, so we will have to live with what we have till some future date when maybe our Congress will be given the job to revamp our heath system into something we can all afford and still continue to be a world leader in care and medications, as we have been in recent years.

 

[Ameriscot]

Maybe because we have had one of the best in the world and took care of sick folks from around the world. Also, it was possible in the US to get taken care of and not have to pay for all the care you got if you were poor. I don't even think that is possible with Obama care. But if so then the government must be giving the care away to the poor. Why force others into that system. We could have just set up a system for those that could not have afforded to buy their own insurance. Lots of ways we could have gone and not just idolized our way into Obama care. It should have all been set up by our Congress, and it was not, so we will have to live with what we have till some future date when maybe our Congress will be given the job to revamp our heath system into something we can all afford and still continue to be a world leader in care and medications, as we have been in recent years.

No, the US does not have the best healthcare in the world, only the most expensive and massively more expensive than other countries. You don't get treated when you are poor unless you are on welfare and can get medicaid. The working poor are screwed. Unless it's life or death you don't get treated and you can't get routine healthcare. The first thing you are asked when going for any type of healthcare is how you are going to pay for it. How about all your co-pays and outrageous costs for prescriptions?

I'll take the NHS over US healthcare.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...rn-countries-with-us-coming-last-9542833.html

 

[BobF]

Some think cheap, low cost, is better medical care. What we have in the US are hospitals that will fix anybody and everybody that comes into their emergency room and ask for help. They will get the help without a question. Then when checked and found not serious they will be taken care of if they wait for the first attention. I have done this myself and been take care of. Usually it is something less than severe but one time I started to have problems at home on a Sunday and the wife took me to the hospital emergency room where I was taken in, checked, found to have a brain tumor and then sent by ambulance to another city in another state for more evaluation. Yes they knew by then that I was an insured US citizen but that was not what made them continue. There first mission is to take the patient and try to find and fix the problem. That is how they found out just how serious the problem was. Had I been a non citizen they would still have kept on going to try to make my life continue as best they could. Our medical system has always been good and for all, not just the insured. We have Canadians come to the US for better medical care than in Canada. At least for them they thought so. To just say we have poor medical care and far too expensive is unfair to the facts. To make our medicines takes years and millions of dollars and those are the high priced ones. When those procedures get paid for then the costs do come down and more of us can use them. Medical care is not some dime store article and I hope they never go that way.

Too much effort is going into getting all for free, which is not possible if you want real good medicines and treatments. Look to the cost of medical care anywhere in the world and it will cost more than the free meetings or free medicines. It will all get paid by higher taxes and lessor quality of services.

 

[AZ Jim]

No, the US does not have the best healthcare in the world, only the most expensive and massively more expensive than other countries. You don't get treated when you are poor unless you are on welfare and can get medicaid. The working poor are screwed. Unless it's life or death you don't get treated and you can't get routine healthcare. The first thing you are asked when going for any type of healthcare is how you are going to pay for it. How about all your co-pays and outrageous costs for prescriptions?

I'll take the NHS over US healthcare.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...rn-countries-with-us-coming-last-9542833.html

Never mind this guy, he has drunk of the cup of Koolaid served up by the Megan Kellys, Limbaugh's (the drug addict) and hannity's at faux (Gag) "News". He doesn't know any better.

 

[QuickSilver]

No, the US does not have the best healthcare in the world, only the most expensive and massively more expensive than other countries. You don't get treated when you are poor unless you are on welfare and can get medicaid. The working poor are screwed. Unless it's life or death you don't get treated and you can't get routine healthcare. The first thing you are asked when going for any type of healthcare is how you are going to pay for it. How about all your co-pays and outrageous costs for prescriptions?

I'll take the NHS over US healthcare.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...rn-countries-with-us-coming-last-9542833.html

You are correct.... The uninformed koolaid drinkers like to run around bragging that our healthcare system is the BEST in the world... It's not... in fact it pretty much sucks at dead last in developed countries.. As you said... what we DO have is the most expensive and the least inclusive. We are also the only country where someone can lose everything they have to medical bills they cannot afford to pay.. How wonderful is THAT!!

 

[Ameriscot]

Some think cheap, low cost, is better medical care. What we have in the US are hospitals that will fix anybody and everybody that comes into their emergency room and ask for help. They will get the help without a question. Then when checked and found not serious they will be taken care of if they wait for the first attention. I have done this myself and been take care of. Usually it is something less than severe but one time I started to have problems at home on a Sunday and the wife took me to the hospital emergency room where I was taken in, checked, found to have a brain tumor and then sent by ambulance to another city in another state for more evaluation. Yes they knew by then that I was an insured US citizen but that was not what made them continue. There first mission is to take the patient and try to find and fix the problem. That is how they found out just how serious the problem was. Had I been a non citizen they would still have kept on going to try to make my life continue as best they could. Our medical system has always been good and for all, not just the insured. We have Canadians come to the US for better medical care than in Canada. At least for them they thought so. To just say we have poor medical care and far too expensive is unfair to the facts. To make our medicines takes years and millions of dollars and those are the high priced ones. When those procedures get paid for then the costs do come down and more of us can use them. Medical care is not some dime store article and I hope they never go that way.

Too much effort is going into getting all for free, which is not possible if you want real good medicines and treatments. Look to the cost of medical care anywhere in the world and it will cost more than the free meetings or free medicines. It will all get paid by higher taxes and lessor quality of services.

Totally untrue. Of course the NHS is paid out of taxes. But the care is not lesser quality.

And I've been to US emergency rooms. The first thing they wanted to know was how it would be paid for.

 

[Ameriscot]

And no one has ever gone bankrupt due to medical bills in western countries except in the US.

 

[AZ Jim]

Is my invite to Scotland still valid?

 

[BobF]

I want to comment on this.. Leaving it up to the States is ridiculous. For one thing... there are Rich states, like Maryland and New Jersey... and there are poor states... like Mississippi. Do you believe that those lucky enough to be living in a rich state are more deserving of healthcare than those in poorer states? Why should American citizens be denied basic healthcare simply because of which state they were born in. Healthcare is a right of every US citizen, and it cannot be provided equally by every state.. This is why it's a Federal issue and responsibility... unless of course you don't believe we were all created equal.

Total misunderstanding of the idea of states being our government and reducing the federal to what it was designed to be. States should determine just how they want their lives to be run and how to do that. They could decide what type of health insurance they would prefer and if pressed for money they could then choose to associate with other states with the same type of health care to share the costs. That is how it really has been run for many years and it should be allowed to continue. Our government was designed to have the states run their own way and the federal was really not much more but for our central source of defense and safety. The more the states get jammed by the federals the more in trouble they can get as their state treasure can not manage to cover all that is demanded. Right now we have 25, or more, states working to get their freedom to be themselves.

I once lived in Mississippi and for many reasons it is still a better place to live. Much cheaper to live there than many states I have lived in. People were less aggressive and much more friendly than many places I have lived. Would the folks in Mississippi like free medicine? Yes, probably just as much as those folks in New York would. But lots of this health stuff we seem to be getting turned on to are not necessary for good health at all. At least not to be put on our tax bills. Too make that anywhere near to fair we need to correct our tax laws so everyone gets to pay something, and now it, in order for all to appreciate what the federals are doing to us. No such thing as poor states unless you measure everything in you life in dollars. For me, I would not even live in New York City area at all. I would not worry about living in the Albany area as it is far more civilized their.

States is where the Constitution is set up for, not the federal bunch. There were states and then they merged and asked for a central government to be arranged. Till the 1900's there was little to talk about for the federal government but now the feds' think they own the entire US as controllers, which they really are not.