On the heels of the latest school shootings...

AZ Jim

R.I.P. With Us In Spirit Only
I sit here and reflect on my own school days and am disgusted at the change in our society! I didn't go to college so I attended 13 school years, K-12. I never saw any day where I smelled fear as a student. I only feared getting caught smoking in the restrooms as a high school student. I now read school shootings occurring coast to coast, day in and day out. I don't get it? What has has happened since the 50's to cause this change? The only thing I can think of is maybe video games where wholesale killing gets more score? Kids used to come home from school and play baseball down the street with their friends, now they spend their lives on their smart phones or home computer with video games.

I am not suggesting that my generation would not have done the same had the technology existed, but it didn't. Could this be a contributor to what's happening today? I don't know but God bless the parents of 17 beautiful kids who went to their school and will never go there again.
 

I agree... I play slot games and some of the ads that come up for other "games" are graphic and bloody!!
Ken, I think it desensitization these kids. They become somewhat immune to the horror of death by violence.
 

My experience growing up was similar, nothing more than a few scuffles that were broken up by the janitors and the phys ed teachers.

The graphic images in video games may be a contributing factor.

The thing that I don't understand is why these things only seem to cause a very minute portion of the population to act out in such horrendous ways.

I think that we tend to look for one reason or one solution in these tragedies when we really need to look at hundreds of changes that will impact many areas of our lives.

The whole topic is very sad and frustrating.
 
My experience growing up was similar, nothing more than a few scuffles that were broken up by the janitors and the phys ed teachers.

The graphic images in video games may be a contributing factor.

The thing that I don't understand is why these things only seem to cause a very minute portion of the population to act out in such horrendous ways.

I think that we tend to look for one reason or one solution in these tragedies when we really need to look at hundreds of changes that will impact many areas of our lives.

The whole topic is very sad and frustrating.
It is beyond the reasonable, like you, among us...
 
Why are we blaming the kids? Remember, it is the wonderful kids of this generation who went en masse to Tallahassee to protest, and to say, "Enough! We will not allow this to continue!"

And these kids also play video games.
 
It is not just the 'kids' of today at all. Look to the way parents go to their kids school games and then do as much as they can to make sure their kids teams end up winners. This begins in the younger years for those students and continues on even beyond their college years.

Look to how the pro athlets show little to no willingness to show their faith and loyalty to the country that has allowed them to become so wealthy and debt free so young. Not enough loyalty to stand for the flag and such at game beginnings.

It seems that from somewhere their is a lot of hate and loss of respect for the great things this country has made possible for so many.
 
Kids, today, are totally desensitized to violence and gore thanks, in part, to the very network we all communicate on, right here! If I so choose, I can Google "beheadings," and, in less than a minute, watch actual ultra-violent killings of my fellow man/woman. When I was only about ten, I went to see a movie, "Boxcar Bertha." It featured graphic sawed-off shotgun shootings of men, with their innards being blown against a wall. I became sick, at the theater, although I held it in, but when I came home I was shook up for the next day, or two. Now, kids would watch that movie and say, "Man, this is lame!" and then go back to blasting apart realistic looking men and aliens, on their giant-screen TV's, at home. Sad, what we're devolving to.
 
Why are we blaming the kids? Remember, it is the wonderful kids of this generation who went en masse to Tallahassee to protest, and to say, "Enough! We will not allow this to continue!"

And these kids also play video games.

It's not all one-sided or black and white. High school kids are learning how to be and who they want to be and sometimes those lines get blurred. They can be vicious to an outlier like Cruz on social media and remain silent when they see others piling on and being vile. The next minute they can turn around and be decent people who make good decisions. Some of them are hopelessly mired in the drive to be popular while others are willing to take chances and remove themselves from the running. When high school kids mostly want to fit in and win approval, it takes a brave soul to come forward and refuse to continue to participate like Emma Gonzales is doing.
 
I think a part of it is communicating with the kids; parents sitting down and talking to them every day about their lives and their feelings and their ambitions and their beliefs and reinforcing the good things. A lot of the time no one has time for the kids but let them spend all their time texting, on the tv, on the video games.
 
Exposure to excessive amounts of violence, genuine, or virtual, can also sicken people and cause them to eschew such for the rest of their lives. Ultimately, unless mentally incapacitated, we are all responsible for what we do with our anger. Does much of the world live in a sick society, probably, but that is nothing new. Just because we don’t have all the answers does not relieve us of the responsibility to work towards equitable solutions. One thing, the past is gone, we can never return to what was, only reflect, learn, and move forward.
 
First, I agree with Shalimar. However, I would answer to the last line in her post by saying, "We haven't learned to do that yet."

Preventing school shootings is not fixing just one thing. If it was that simple, surely someone would have figured it out by now. So, we can now say that it's not the parents, it's not the video games, it's not adding security to schools (Sandy Hook proved that), it's not the easy access to guns, it's not because a kid was rejected by a girl and it's not even the mental breakdown or bullying of the child. However, the reports that we (the police) are getting states very simply that it is collectively a number of things that goes wrong in a child's mind that brings about a school shooter.

In each case of a school shooting from Columbine to Parkland, one thing has been constant. Before the shooting began, the shooter told another student, who turned a deaf ear. THIS is what has to stop. It's a well known fact that kids do not share their inner most secrets with adults. It's some kind of pact that they (kids) have. Oh, they don't talk about it or take an oath, but nonetheless, it is an unwritten pact. I remember back when Columbine took place and the day before the shooting happened, I forget which shooter it was, told another student, "Don't come to school tomorrow." Back in my day, we had "tattle-tales" all over the place. I remember being outside for recess while in elementary school on one afternoon with my buddy throwing a ball back and forth and a girl saw me spit on the playground. The next day, the teacher had me stand up in class and she asked me if I did that. I thought about lying, but I told her that I did. She then told me that I had to stay indoors that day during all three recesses.

If any kid that got wind of a shooting that was being planned would immediately report it, at the very least, some of these shootings could be prevented. Now, this is not to say that maybe at least one of the other reasons for a shooting that has happened that I listed earlier in this post could also be a contributing factor, but psychiatrists have stated over and over that kids become shooters for various reasons. Of course, if guns weren't so readily accessible, it may also prevent some of the shootings, but again, if a person (or kid) wants to carry out a mass carnage by shooting their classmates, they will do it.

Bottom line here is, there is no 'one" answer that will stop shooters, unless all guns from our society are removed and we can all say with certainty; that isn't going to happen. As it stands now, we are waiting to see where the next shooting will take place. I hope parents have spoken with their children and have "discussed" with them the various ways that they can help themselves stay safe in school and what to do in case a shooting does break out. I wish that all school classrooms had double-hung windows that could be raised and the children could have an escape route out the window, even if they are on the second floor. If it were me, I would rather take a chance jumping out a second floor window than facing down a shooter holding an AR-15. A broken leg can be fixed, whereas; a hole in your heart or head cannot.

The last paper that I read on this subject spoke about parents should be talking with their children everyday and especially about what their day was like at school. Sometimes, there are telltale signs that come out and if the parent is listening close enough, they may be able to pick up on something that the child is having an issue with and that together, the child and the parent can work on to fix.
 
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There is nothing new about this country's love of guns and its culture of violence. The technology available just makes different kinds of games available. If anything has changed and is responsible for these horrifying mass shootings, it is the proliferation of assault weapons, semiautomatic weapons, etc. People have been shooting each other with pistols since this country began, but at least with a pistol you can't do as much damage.

When my son was little, he had a bb gun. Most little boys had one. No one thought there was anything wrong with them; a very tiny percentage of those kids turned into killers. And the bb guns probably had nothing to do with it. But I'm glad to see them gone anyway.
 
Instant gratification and social media. Technology has made instant gratification quicker & easier to come by even if it's winning a video or getting a 'like' for a comment. Social media has thrown several new variables into the mix including opinions that decades ago that would be meaningless or never be discussed except among best friends or family. So many of today's youth get to see what people think of them or visa versa. If they don't see or get what they want their frustration and/or anger can start building or growing almost instantly which could leave too much emotion for them to handle in a short time frame.

The older generations have context and experience without tech. The youth do not. But the same 'rules' should apply. People should accept or consider a different opinion even online. But too many adults early wrote off tech 'eh it's the internet'. But not having to directly face others when they start name calling or opining emboldens nasty behavior which in turn triggers a response which leads to escalation.

Several old adages still apply which I think many of todays youth never heard of or wrote off and that's 'sticks n stones' and 'be nice', just like in the movie Road House bouncer training scene.
 
I agree with all of the above posts, especially the comments about ultra-violent games and movies. It seems to me that, at an absolute minimum, parents can, and should, refuse to allow their kids to play those games. Doing so may not stop a single shooter but it just might.

In my opinion, 911 is spot on correct when he suggests that it is not one single cause but rather a multitude of causes. No matter how unpopular it may be, we must be willing to look at all possible causes. One thing is indisputable, life has become vastly more complicated then when we were growing up.
 
It is not just the 'kids' of today at all. Look to the way parents go to their kids school games and then do as much as they can to make sure their kids teams end up winners. This begins in the younger years for those students and continues on even beyond their college years.

Look to how the pro athlets show little to no willingness to show their faith and loyalty to the country that has allowed them to become so wealthy and debt free so young. Not enough loyalty to stand for the flag and such at game beginnings.

It seems that from somewhere their is a lot of hate and loss of respect for the great things this country has made possible for so many.


I believe that BobF has hit upon the sine qua non of school shootings. Without the hatred, a kid does not become a mass killer.
I have been studying the two Colombine killers, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold. Reading the FBI psychological studies of those two, it is clear that Eric Harris was not only the mastermind behind the massacre, he was filled with a hatred of nearly everything and everybody.

Excerpts from Eric Harris's diary give us a glimpse into the mind of a psychopath. He had as much compassion for people as a butcher does for the beef he carves up. The FBI concluded that, had Harris not been the killer at Colombine High School, he very likely would have gone on to commit an even greater mass killing, later in life. Absolutely chilling.

Where in the name of God, did Harris learn such hatred ?
 
Psychopaths are wired differently than the rest of us. This is apparent in brain scans which clearly show sharp differences in those areas of the brain responsible for a variety of emotions, particularly empathy. Current science indicates they are born this way, as opposed to sociopaths who usually have horrendous childhoods. If

a person is amoral, unable to relate to the people around them, feels contempt for others, and enraged when everything doesn’t go their way, is dealing with teenage hormones, it can be a recipe for disaster. These individuals view themselves as gods, others as peons. They lack the inhibitors/conscience which define most people.
 
Ok, I accept that, Shalimar. Let me ask you, if such a young man was sent to you, either by the school or the parents, for, let's say being a bully, or perhaps torturing small animals, and, like Harris, he was extremely intelligent, what, if anything, could you do ? Is there any way to either help him or confine him or both ? Assuming, of course, that he was smart enough to never tell you that he had fantasies of killing people.

This presumes that you are absolutely convinced that you are dealing with a psychopath ?
 
Ok, I accept that, Shalimar. Let me ask you, if such a young man was sent to you, either by the school or the parents, for, let's say being a bully, or perhaps torturing small animals, and, like Harris, he was extremely intelligent, what, if anything, could you do ? Is there any way to either help him or confine him or both ? Assuming, of course, that he was smart enough to never tell you that he had fantasies of killing people.

This presumes that you are absolutely convinced that you are dealing with a psychopath ?

Unless he has committed crimes punishable by incarceration of some sort, or is clearly mentally ill to the extent of requiring hospitalisation, there is little restraint available. As for helping him, unlikely, psychopaths think they are normal, the rest of us skewed. Machiavellian manipulators, they are adept at telling therapists what they wish to hear, but they have no desire to change. Nothing is ever their fault.
 
Psychotic and psychopath are not synonymous. If the person is diagnosed as psychotic, meds are available. But, unless the person is a proven danger to themselves or others, a therapist’s hands are tied. Only a small fraction of psychopaths are killers. The majority are successful people with no obvious glitches unless you are close to them.
 
Psychotic and psychopath are not synonymous. If the person is diagnosed as psychotic, meds are available. But, unless the person is a proven danger to themselves or others, a therapist’s hands are tied. Only a small fraction of psychopaths are killers. The majority are successful people with no obvious glitches unless you are close to them.

I knew as soon as I posted that I used an improper term. I guess that happens with us OTBs. :rolleyes:

So I guess my idea of psychological testing for gun permits is shot down.
 


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