Our spiritual side, or our "religion", what do we believe

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Denise1952

Well-known Member
I've wanted to talk about this for awhile, but I was gun-shy, but I think it would be interesting to find out what others think here on SF.

I've shared a little here and there about my life, but I won't make a book out of this OP. Until the age of 33, I had no teachings, no church, my family was sort of the "wild bunch" and for my early years, I wasn't sure whether my name was Denise, or God Dammit Denise. But all that time I imagined, I thought about some sort of magical loving old fella that lived up-stairs (heaven, I had heard that term somewhere) that would protect me. I usually cried out for "mom" when I was hurting/sick, but when I got older, I remember crying out "oh God help me". I capitalize God because I can't bring myself to use a small g because to me that's an inanimate, man-made god. Something I just came to believe along the road of life.

About the man-made god, I am not telling anyone that may not be the right thing to do, so I hope all will feel comfy sharing.

Ok, I will just leave that here, I went through a lot of different changes after 33, started going to church, reading the bible, stopped cussing, trying to be a good gal (really silly if I was going to follow the bible because it says there is no good in us:

New International Version of the bible.
For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.

I picked religion because I know little about politics, or money, but I wanted to try a "meaty" subject. First I want to say, I personally have not problem with thread-hijacking, and humor, so please feel free. I can get a topic back on track, others are well capable too if they want to. Please feel welcome to discuss your opinions, thoughts, ideas, beliefs and experiences. I look forward to learning, and sharing more as well;)

Denise

Edited: I got a bit grandiose in my OP here so I edited out. I had originally said "all members are welcome" but of course they are because this is an open forum, and I don't own it. My apologies, denise
 

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When I was very little I learned that God is Love and that seemed pretty good. Then, as I grew older and especially during the war, my feelings about God came and went with the tides of change. One fine day I was thinking on the subject and decided there's a choice to believe or not believe. To me, God is of ALL things. Simply, all things are of God. The entire miracle of existence in the micro/macro universe is God. Science is merely our struggle to explain. Psychedelic.
 
Thanks TG, I really like the way you put that into words, I feel much the same, but others can sometimes put it in the words that don't come to me. All I know of psychedelic is the light shows at our dances, and the pictures on the walls, painted right on the walls of course;)
 

I was born and raised as a Catholic,was brainwash into the word "Almighty GOD" and Jesus as his son.Im not a confirmed atheist or believe in it.
What I do believe in is my own crazy thinking with a devil and angel on my shoulders trying to guide me in my decisions in life. So far none of them has worked.(g)
There are thousands of interpretations of where the word GOD comes from,you can take you pick and follow it.

 
I've never been a "religious" person in that I don't enjoy rigid, proscribed rituals and cast-in-cement rules.

I also "floated" along as a kid, thankfully not being pressured into any one system or belief, at least until I was 12. That was the year my father and sister died within a month of each other. After the church service and on the way to burial of my father (the second of the two deaths) I asked the priest why this happened.

His reply was "God wanted them more than you needed them."

Okey-dokey.

I went on a little spiritual quest to try to figure things out, and within a couple of months I had met my future martial arts / philosophy teacher. He began to introduce me to Taoist philosophy, never labeling it as such and never pushing it on me - instead, he piqued my interest in it to the point where I began asking for more and more information. Only then did he call it by name and start me on a more formal education of what exactly the philosophy entailed.

The up-side is that it made perfect sense and answered all of my questions, just as it continues to do so almost 45 years later, so it's what I've stayed with.
 
True Davey, about "take you pick". I think a large number of folks, including myself, during this period of my life, are forming our own God, or idea of God. It's where we create our own God, instead of the idea, in christianity, or catholicism where God creates man/woman. I fall short, on understanding many other religions because I have studied them, or experienced their teachings.

Thanks for your input Davey;) Denise
 
SifuPhil said:
I've never been a "religious" person in that I don't enjoy rigid, proscribed rituals and cast-in-cement rules.

I also "floated" along as a kid, thankfully not being pressured into any one system or belief, at least until I was 12. That was the year my father and sister died within a month of each other. After the church service and on the way to burial of my father (the second of the two deaths) I asked the priest why this happened.

His reply was "God wanted them more than you needed them."

Okey-dokey.

I went on a little spiritual quest to try to figure things out, and within a couple of months I had met my future martial arts / philosophy teacher. He began to introduce me to Taoist philosophy, never labeling it as such and never pushing it on me - instead, he piqued my interest in it to the point where I began asking for more and more information. Only then did he call it by name and start me on a more formal education of what exactly the philosophy entailed.

The up-side is that it made perfect sense and answered all of my questions, just as it continues to do so almost 45 years later, so it's what I've stayed with.
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This is excellent Phil, that is somewhat my story, in that, I had no formal teaching, but I was always curious. I met a "teacher" as well, who happened to become my husband. He was the most generous, giving man I had ever met. He was either on the phone helping someone who called him, or handing out money to someone that needed it. I don't think I ever heard him say no to anyone needing his time or financial help. He fell a little short paying any attention to me, I was forever trying to get it. But the thing was, I wanted to be like him in so many ways, be unselfish, care about others. So I followed him into christianity. As I look back, it was him I was following for sure, not the God of the bible.

The good part of it all, is that I am a less selfish person today, and I am "believe me" a better person and what I mean by better is I am not still raising hell with the possibility of ending up in jail or worse. I am more productive then destructive to others. I hope.
 
When your 'time' comes and you pass over all those you love and who have loved you (who have passed over) will be there to greet you. Even your beloved pets will be there.

Life is a continuum. It doesn't matter what religion you follow, it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.

'All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your tine is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.''
 
I was brought up in a fundamentalist Christian home (you must be 'saved' or else)! I lost my faith by the time I left home and married at nineteen. I cannot see anything good about the Biblical version of the deity. I believe ALL religions are human creations.
 
Knightofalbion said:
When your 'time' comes and you pass over all those you love and who have loved you (who have passed over) will be there to greet you. Even your beloved pets will be there.

Life is a continuum. It doesn't matter what religion you follow, it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.

'All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your tine is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.''
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I like your belief Knight. I've never felt better about myself then when I am kind to someone. I've only hurt myself by being selfish, or unkind. Like if someone does me dirt, it has never payed to be nasty back. I too hope for animals, and all our loved ones that have gone before, to be there waiting. I know I could just end up dead and in the dirt, but it is a nice thing to hope for, dream about;) No more pain, no more tears, and we don't have to figure out what to cook for supper!!:playful:
 
Justme said:
I was brought up in a fundamentalist Christian home (you must be 'saved' or else)! I lost my faith by the time I left home and married at nineteen. I cannot see anything good about the Biblical version of the deity. I believe ALL religions are human creations.
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I do agree on "religion" being human-creation JM. Fundamentalist is very strict as I understand it (which I don't know much about it). I do know the bible says "you must be born-again". I have questioned that because of all the folks that supposedly aren't, and I am not sure what that entails even. Except for a Holy Spirit that indwells the born-again, supposedly. Sometimes, to be honest, I do hope there is some relationship to be had with a God of unconditional love, but I don't know, and again, I am pretty shut-down about it all. Thanks for your input:) Denise
 
I was brought up in a strict Presbyterian household where I was told that things were "God's will" and I shouldn't question things. Well I did question things and came to the same conclusion as Justme. I've had no real faith since my teens and this is a non religeous household. The children were never baptised and have never been to church. They're adults now and can make up their own minds.

Life is just a period of light between two periods of darkness. Why shoud the darkness after I die worry me more than the darkness before my birth?
 
Capt Lightning said:
I was brought up in a strict Presbyterian household where I was told that things were "God's will" and I shouldn't question things. Well I did question things and came to the same conclusion as Justme. I've had no real faith since my teens and this is a non religeous household. The children were never baptised and have never been to church. They're adults now and can make up their own minds.

Life is just a period of light between two periods of darkness. Why shoud the darkness after I die worry me more than the darkness before my birth?
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Love your reply, especially that last line, way excellent imo! Also, one thing that bothered me about my "religious" teaching was also, "well, it is just God's will", no solid answers. I want answers too, as best as we can figure them out CL. Another thing is, I used to hear over and over, "I'll pray for you". Well, that may be a wonderful thing, maybe prayers are answered, but when I am in a group of folks, and let folks know I am looking for work (networking) when someone says "I'll pray for you" I'd rather hear (if they know someone) "I'll ask around for you Denise" you know, help with skin on it.

Thanks CL, Denise
 
I was raised as a Catholic, and went to Catholic grade school for eight years, my family made us go to church every Sunday, although my mother usually just went on the holidays. I was literally in church 7 days a week, weekdays before school, Saturdays for confession and Sundays for mass. By the time I went to public high school, I wanted nothing to do with church, and have gone maybe twice since, to accompany my sister there.

I am not religious at all, in fact, as time goes by, I find religious groups/churches to be no more than a business, always seeking new customers and their money. It appears that many wars and killings in the past, also the present, happen in the name of 'religion'. I've met some born-again Christians, who were not kind to others at all, and they had a selfish hateful way about them. I have zero tolerance for people who try to push their religion on me, not being able to say two sentences without the word Jesus, or quoting the bible. If they want to devote their lives to a designated religion, good for them, whatever makes them happy...but leave me out of it.

I was raised in a loving home, and taught at a young age to treat others as I would like to be treated, with kindness and respect. It comes very naturally for me to help others in need, and to perform small acts of kindness on a daily basis. Although life has taught me not to be too trusting of others, I am a loving person and often smile and nod at others crossing my path.

I respect people and their property, so there's no 'sinning' there on my part. However, I expect the same consideration from them. I was a bit wild in my younger days, especially as a teen, but I did nothing to harm others, nothing I would be sent to 'hell' over, lol.

There were certain rules in the church that I just plain out disagree with, like no birth control. That is a private decision for the individual woman to make. When I went to church, all prayers and psalms were in Latin, so just that fact made everything extra special. We weren't allowed to eat meat on Fridays, so my mother would always make fish or other meatless dishes for us. Then all of a sudden, the mass was in English, and everybody could eat meat on Friday. :rolleyes: My sister ended up marrying a Jewish man, and was booted out for not marrying the same faith. Is that the loving way of God, I don't think so? Anyhoo, she still goes to Catholic church, as it has some meaning and importance to her, and I respect that.

I don't find any pleasure in killing, hurting or stealing from people, or destroying their property. I'm very considerate of those around me, and would do the polite thing when needed, like moving out of their way so they can get by, not blasting my radio in public, not letting my dog get into their business, etc. I believe there is some supreme being that created us and everything around us, but until someone comes back from the dead and gives us the lowdown, we can all just guess about things, and believe what feels right for us in our hearts. Label me as spiritual, not religious. :)
 
I grew up in a home where my folks read the Bible, taught me the Bible; and they both lived what they believed to the best of their ability. I was taught to be considerate of everyone, kind, and to help anyone in need that I was able to help. I don't think that I could have had better parents than I had.
I didn't even question my religion for many years; only lately have I really been searching for more and better answers. I believe that there is a tremendous difference between religion and belief in God.

Many of history's worst crimes have been committed by supposed Christians (or other religious leaders), in the name of furthering the religion. The Bible itself has had many translations , and often no longer means what it originally intended to convey; as well as things were written into the Bible by Constantine, when he was uniting the pagan and Christian religion into one faith. He combined the celebrations, beliefs and rituals of the two religions, so that everyone could celebrate their chosen holidays; and still learn to follow the same religious leaders.
Thus, we now have pagan traditions that have been in our Christian theology for so many years, we don't realize that they were not always there.

I believe that there is a Creator of this world, I just don't have an understanding of who He is. I am searching for that part. I don't think that the Creation Story as told in the Bible is correct (the way we understand it), yet, there are serious holes in the evolution theory as well; and nothing in between those two extremes.

Prayer works. I don't know if it is an actual communication to a Supreme Being, or if it is just our mind joining into the collective thinking; but there have been many instances of prayer being answered; so I believe that it is more than just a coincidence. So I pray. I try to open my mind to anything that God might want to say to me, as well.

I can see that the churches often do more harm than good, usually because the religious leaders of the churches are corrupted, and money hungry people, using people's faith as a way to enrich their own pockets; and not being the proverbial shepard who is protecting his flock. The churches fight among each other, and each claims to be the "true church". Obviously, they can't all be right; so I think it is up to each of us to decide how we will live our lives, and what we will believe.
 
'Faith without charity (loving-kindness) is dead. Love is the fulfilling of the Law.'

Love and kindness have been the core message of all the Masters and teachers of the Light. A great spiritual truth. So simple yet so profound.

Let love and kindness be your motivation and guide in life.... This is the only true religion.
 
Thanks nwlady. Unfortunately I can't claim any credit for that saying and I don't know who first used it. Vladimir Nabokov wrote "common sense tells us that our existence is but a brief crack of light between two eternities of darkness.", but I think it comes from much earlier.
 
Both my parents were agnostic. I was never baptized. When I was about 7 they wanted me to have a basic understand what religion (Christianity) is. They sent me every Sunday to a Methodist church for Sunday school. That church was chosen because it was the nearest to home. The school was in the basement. We sang songs as a lady played a piano. We colored in coloring books and the lady told us stories. We got snacks and had time to run around in a grassy yard and play. I liked it. At the time, I didn't comprehend that I was supposed to believe the Sunday school stories were true. That the whole world flooded and Noah saved a boy & girl of every creature on a boat he built. That some men blew on horns and the noise made giant walls fall down. Nobody mentioned "These ARE true stories". I'd go home and hear stories about the 3 little pigs and Little Red Riding Hood. I was told "These are NOT true". In my own mind it was all fun & games. When I was 9 there was a graduation party. Everything began to change, starting with that party. There was music, but we were told we weren't allowed to dance. They mentioned it was prohibited because of the devil. The following Sunday I was sent upstairs instead of the basement. The minister gave his sermon. He yelled the entire time, telling us all we were sinners and were damned. He upset me so much, made me feel horrible about myself. I went home & told my parents I didn't want to go back. They said I didn't have to.

I find it interesting that there have been about 4,200 different religions in the world. I am an atheist. I am amused when I am accused of worshiping the devil. If I have no belief in god, why would I believe his enemy exists? I don't believe in any of it. My lack of belief does not make me an amoral person. I've often wondered why humans created the concept of religion. I find all religions have one factor in common. They offer life after death. Now that is a huge reward for following a religious belief.
 
Ina said:
The Powers That Be
.........ARE.........
Regardless of Designation
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This is exactly what I think, too. God is whatever He is, whether we believe it or not, and whether we understand it or not.
This world, and outlying universe, came into existence somehow. Even if nothing that has been written about God, in the Bible, or any other holy book, is true; there IS a truth, it exists, and disbelief has no effect on it.
As far as our behavior, I would live by my inner moral values, whether there is a God or a Heaven and afterlife, or not.
If there is some kind of an afterlife when we finish this one, then it would be wonderful to see my loved ones who are gone from this life. If there is none, then it doesn't much matter what I believed, since it will all be over when I die.

One of the things that most interests me right now, is what existed before our "creation history" began ?? All of the stories go back about 6,000 years; but we have bones and other examples of life existing before that time period. Evolution leaves out a lot, and can't explain some of the ways that life has developed here, so I wonder if there was once a highly developed civilization, that was somehow wiped out, and then life just started over with the time frame that we have a record of.
 
I'll be back, as Arnie says.

I don't actually have time for this topic at the moment because it's Sunday morning over here and I'm about to leave for church where I teach Sunday School. Later today we're off to a farewell to an old work colleague who is retiring from teaching aged 71.

When I do return I might have a few things to say about the differences between the concepts of faith, belief, church, religion, spirituality, dogma/darma and philosophy. Or I might not after reading all the posts.

Sometimes it helps with understanding to clarify exactly what we are talking about. Sometimes it is unnecessary.
 

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