Progress on Australian Same Sex Marriage Bill

I don't believe the comment in the ruling that a wedding cake is 'just food' .

Wedding cakes traditionally are a big part of the celebration. Many people take a piece home and keep them as mementos.

Here, although we accept that the Kleins imbue each wedding cake with their own aesthetic choices, they have made no showing that other people will necessarily experience any wedding cake that the Kleins create predominantly as “expression” rather than as food.
 

Are you buying an "artistic creation" or a wedding cake? Since the purpose of a wedding cakes is to be eaten, it is a food. And the bakers have shown no other reason their "creative artistry" is thwarted; other than their religious belief. So, if their religious belief would not allow them to bake cakes for N+g+rs; that would be okay with you?
 
Suing someone because they won't give you what you want the way you want, if successful it could even be considered having 'blackmailed' that someone, or company. But that's okay cuz the person/company hurt your feelings?
 

I think it speaks to the separation of church and state. Any person has the right to their religious views until they impinge on the rights of society. Denigrating groups of people because their lifestyle, (and refusing them services,) does not conform with

a particular religious view, is, in my humble opinion, a form of bigotry, and violates their human rights. To reduce such actions to the level of hurt feelings, well, that seems very dehumanising to me. To any student of history, the past, and present are full of attempts to prevent certain people from being treated as equals, based on gender, race, colour, creed, socio economic

postion etc. Either all of us matter, or none of us do. The fight for equality by LGBQTI people, is all too reminiscent of the struggle of Suffragettes, Unionists, Civil Rights advocates, et al. I believe far more is at stake than feelings. It comes down to what sort of society we have? Inclusive, or otherwise? Partitioning human rights according to Scripture, even in violation of law, well, to me, that is a slippery slope.
 
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Following God's Word as taught in the New Testament Bible scriptures benefits ALL persons. Some persons may have to make some difficult changes in how they live their lives, (it can be so very painful to give them up) but none of us are going to stay alive forever and, for me, I'd rather struggle (unhappily, groan, through some difficulties), live this life the best I can manage according to God's Word (always asking God in all sincerity to forgive the sins I continue to commit in my weakness), and attain a forever life God has for all, minus all troubles. And for those people who turn to Him and in all honesty haven't interpreted any scripture of His in such a way to mean that what they want it to mean excuses their sin(s), sins which they refuse to give up to suit themselves.

My belief, no offense meant to anyone who believes differently. :)
 
"My beliefs are the only true ones, not yours. I believe you have sinned before my God. I don't want any of you sinful, disgusting, filthy, Bible thumping Christians in my store."
That is akin to what Christians are saying when you won't bake a cake for everybody.
 
Wow, fuzzybuddy, sadly you have some very hateful misconceptions of Christians. Ah well. :(
 
I think Fuzzy was just using an analogy, albeit a bit powerfully worded.

That may be one analogy Fuzzy, But another might go like this-
"Although I can't in good conscience assist you in committing what I believe personally to be a sin, I love you and wish you the best."

Life is not fair. IMHO, I'd be ok baking the cake but I believe $$$$$'s was the motive behind the couple making (literally) a federal case out of it.
 
My problem would be being forced to do something I don't want to do in my own business. It's different if I'm working for the Safeway bakery.

If I don't feel like cutting hair today I shouldn't be forced to do it .

The U.S. prides itself on freedom.
 
Camper6 said:
My problem would be being forced to do something I don't want to do in my own business. It's different if I'm working for the Safeway bakery.

If I don't feel like cutting hair today I shouldn't be forced to do it .

The U.S. prides itself on freedom.
Click to expand...

Same here. And I can't get my head around why the customers have "rights" but the baker doesn't??? What's the deal there? As others have said, there are plenty of bakeries that will do it, so just move on.
 
Well, I'm not being forced to do anything. You, Christians, dishonor my God. I just don't want you sinful Christians in my store.
What this country stands for is freedom. And I freely don't cut no N*G**R's hair!
God bless America.
 
Let's step back for a moment and look at the bigger picture. What if the proprietor of a store just doesn't want to do business with a customer because he/she doesn't like the customer's attitude? Or finds the customer's attire offensive? Or he's just in a lousy mood that day and is picky about which people he is waiting on? Is he violating the customer's rights by refusing to do business? Does he even need an excuse, or can he just refuse to wait on someone?

Obviously, this would be very odd, for anyone who is in business to make a living. But would it be a legal violation to refuse customers for whatever reason?
 
No, IMO. But would be poor business ethics.
When I say, “I am aChristian”
I’m not shouting, “I’ve been saved!”
I’m whispering, “I get lost sometimes
That’s why I chose this way”
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t speak with human pride
I’m confessing that I stumble –
needing God to be my guide
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not trying to be strong
I’m professing that I’m weak
and pray for strength to carryon
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not bragging of success
I’m admitting that I’ve failed
and cannot ever pay the debt
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t think I know it all
I submit to my confusion
asking humbly to be taught
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not claiming to be perfect
My flaws are far too visible
but God believes I’m worth it
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I still feel the sting of pain
I have my share of heartache
which is why I seek God’s name
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I do not wish to judge
I have no authority
I only know I’m loved.
©1992 Carol Wimmer All Rights Reserved
 
No, IMO. But would be poor business ethics.
When I say, “I am aChristian”
I’m not shouting, “I’ve been saved!”
I’m whispering, “I get lost sometimes
That’s why I chose this way”
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t speak with human pride
I’m confessing that I stumble –
needing God to be my guide
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not trying to be strong
I’m professing that I’m weak
and pray for strength to carryon
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not bragging of success
I’m admitting that I’ve failed
and cannot ever pay the debt
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t think I know it all
I submit to my confusion
asking humbly to be taught
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not claiming to be perfect
My flaws are far too visible
but God believes I’m worth it
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I still feel the sting of pain
I have my share of heartache
which is why I seek God’s name
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I do not wish to judge
I have no authority
I only know I’m loved.
©1992 Carol Wimmer All Rights Reserved
 
No, IMO. But would be poor business ethics.

When I say, “I am aChristian”
I’m not shouting, “I’ve been saved!”
I’m whispering, “I get lost sometimes
That’s why I chose this way”
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t speak with human pride
I’m confessing that I stumble –
needing God to be my guide
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not trying to be strong
I’m professing that I’m weak
and pray for strength to carryon
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not bragging of success
I’m admitting that I’ve failed
and cannot ever pay the debt
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I don’t think I know it all
I submit to my confusion
asking humbly to be taught
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I’m not claiming to be perfect
My flaws are far too visible
but God believes I’m worth it
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I still feel the sting of pain
I have my share of heartache
which is why I seek God’s name
When I say, “I am a Christian”
I do not wish to judge
I have no authority
I only know I’m loved.
©1992 Carol Wimmer All Rights Reserved
 
How did this turn into a Christian poetry thread? And why all the repetitions? Are you having trouble posting on this forum?

Let's get back to the subject, please. This has been a very interesting discussion, and I don't want to see it sabotaged.
 
fuzzybuddy said:
Well, I'm not being forced to do anything. You, Christians, dishonor my God. I just don't want you sinful Christians in my store.
What this country stands for is freedom. And I freely don't cut no N*G**R's hair!
God bless America.
Click to expand...

Well no the complainants were welcomed in the store and the offer was to be able to buy any cake in the store.
The point was that they wanted a creation of their own that the baker did not want to make.

If you don't feel like cutting hair you shouldn't have to regardless of who wants a haircut.

And if I am hair stylist and I don't do the type of haircut you want then I shouldn't have to.

Next question. Should I be forced to ?

For instance I don't do mohawk haircuts because I think they are racist.
 
If I owned a business, I, who put it together through hard work & expense have the earned right on how I choose to run my business, not the customers.

I will not take on the guilt of those racist doings in the past, or are still being done. I see most as ignorant actions--whoever the person who's doing it or what their race is. BTW, P C has turned into a monster of ridiculous restrictions.

The Mohawk hair cut (on a white male, or girl), I just thought of as goofy. Nothing to do with any Native American tribe. If those Native Americans see the cut as offensive to their traditions, then I guess leave the cut to them, no one else. But would that be another of the P Cs going overboard?
 
If I own a business I should be able to say who I want to serve. You are there by invitation. There is an unwritten contract. We can make a deal or we can't make a deal.

No shoes, no shirt, no service. Should I be forced to serve you?
 
Sunny, you are totally correct. If the baker, FOR ANY REASON, did not want to bake a cake for a customer, he could come with some lame excuse- he's over booked, etc. He does not say, "According to my religion, God denounces you as sinners. And because you are such deviants sinners, my religion prevents me from using my talents to bake you a cake". That is what you say when you want a Supreme Court case.
The short version of this is "my religion allows me to discriminate against you"
 
And once again, does the proprietor have no rights?? Why do some people have rights while others do not?

And I agree, political correctness has gone way too far. My opinion, of course.
 

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