Three fired Minneapolis police officers guilty of violating George Floyd's civil rights resulting in his death

Ruthanne said:
You never know till you are there.
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True, which is why even tho i feel the bystanders behaved reasonably, i can not be sure i would have. I happen to feel that the only acceptable use of 'white privilege' is to combat racial injustice, but having worked in civil rights movement i am aware of limits of the protection of that might afford me.
 

I'm sure police across the country have learned something through this. If they are called to a crime scene and the suspect turns out to be a black man who is twice the size of any of them, flipped out on drugs to the point of calling for his mama and claiming he can't breathe while he is still standing up, then kicking and screaming while they're trying to put him in the patrol car ... just let him go.

Younger officers, new to the job, maybe just four days in, have learned that if a much older, superior officer tells them that this is the proper hold to use, he's used it before without any lasting harm, they should tell him he's wrong and punch him out.

The really smart police have quit already.
 
As for the argument many make that if you are talking you're breathing, anyone with impaired respiratory system knows how instinctive it is to voice your concerns while you can when you feel the limits constricting.
On humid days, when moisture means there is less oxygen per cubic inch of air than on dry days, if i exert myself doing chores my first thought is "i can't breathe" because i FEEL the difference. (Fix it with a brief spell on my CPAP, brings my level up).

As for Chauvin's remark about how much oxygen it takes to say 3 words, it would take much more to precisely describe the panic one feels when one is still taking in air but your body knows you are not getting sufficient oxygen from your inhales.
 
Sunny said:
Claiming he can't brreathe while he is still standng up, Della? Where did you get that idea?

Floyd Told Officers He Couldn’t Breathe At Least 28 Times, New Bodycam Video Reveals | NBC News - YouTube
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I can't find the police cam video where I saw that, it would be on the camera with the first officer who approached him and his van from the back left side.

Here is footage from the officer who went to the right, for those who think he didn't resist arrest and didn't say he couldn't breathe until he was face down on the ground.
 
Della said:
I can't find the police cam video where I saw that, it would be on the camera with the first officer who approached him and his van from the back left side.

Here is footage from the officer who went to the right, for those who think he didn't resist arrest and didn't say he couldn't breathe until he was face down on the ground.
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I almost have a panic attack myself, watching that footage ...all over $20.... :cautious:..it makes it even worse that since Floyd was saying he couldn't breathe right from when he was sitting up.. and Chauvin still knelt on him to his death.... ..Chauvin should have got life
 
I heard enough and I don't intend to offend anyone but I really need to say this. The brutal reality of the law enforcement profession is the indisputable fact that police officers are not robots and as such possess the exact same human qualities and frailties as everyone else on the planet. They carry a deadly weapon with the power and legal authority to use that weapon to take a life if need be. Police officers exist not only to serve and protect the public but to monitor human behavior and as such expect the average citizen to act accordingly when they request or order them to comply with their directives pure and simple. Humanity must understand and respect the responsibility these officers are tasked with from their very first day in the academy until the very last day they retire hopefully with a sound body, mind and spirit. In the end run conflicts arise when the average person feels intimidated, humiliated and more often than not unfairly targeted when stopped, questioned, searched, detained and more so arrested in front of bystanders. Same issue with being pulled over by a police officer and receiving a traffic ticket while other motorist are passing by. A fair number of motorist who receive speeding tickets while commuting to work in the morning become so upset they actually turn around a go back home and call in sick. I wish I had that luxury when I was hogging especially working extra board because GOD help me if went home instead of reporting to my terminal. The speeding ticket would be the least of my worries. The good, bad and ugly of a small number of citizens of color especially in high density urban areas is the so called disparity of representation in law enforcement agencies in those areas, yet the application numbers reflect the extremely low number of minority applicants. Well I yakked enough and I have to feed my two charges so I'll save my AAP vs. EEOC spiel for another time unless we're all glowing in the dark come next week. Luv ya all.
 
Ruthanne said:
I would have screamed at the cops!! People should have screamed and yelled!! You can bet your ass I'd risk it!!
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Apparently the crowd did yell and scream, that is why the one cop was holding back the bystanders. One of the cops actually asked if Chauvin was kneeling on Floyd too long. He was ignored, and didn't try any further.
 
mrstime said:
Apparently the crowd did yell and scream,
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Yes, judging from the video above, the cops are used to being screamed at. In just this one incident, we can see Floyd and his two companions were screaming constantly, "I can't breathe" was interspersed with dozens of, "I didn't do nothing," and, "I'm not that kind of guy." They've had to learn to ignore being screamed at.

During Chauvin's trial one of the witnesses, a police officer, said that, "I can't breathe" has been the common 'get out of going to jail,' call of the career criminals since the first famous breathing incident that happened when Eric Garner died in police restraint in 2014. It's a slogan of the Black Lives Movement. Unfortunately it can end up being a case of "the boy who hollered wolf," if it's used when one clearly can breathe, so it's ignored later when one really is in respiratory trouble.
hollydolly said:
all over $20.... :cautious:
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It was the Cup Foods manager who cared about the 20, not the police, it's just their job to inforce the law for the manager. I always feel sorry for that young clerk who was sent out twice to ask a van full of older people doing drugs for the cigarettes back.

If only George would have returned those cigarettes, taken his counterfeit bill and driven off to try it somewhere else, none of this would have happened. If he was as terrified of the police as he pretended to be he would have done just that, knowing the bill had been spotted. If he was as claustrophobic as he pretended to be, he wouldn't have sat in a van with the windows rolled up for thirty minutes outside Cup Foods. If he truly couldn't breathe during the 28 times he screamed it, he wouldn't have had breath to also talk a steady stream of, "I'm not that kind of guy."


The police had been working with people all day long, a steady stream of people so busy shouting, "I didn't do nothing!" that they can't hear simple instructions like, "Please, put both hands on the wheel." All day long, their work had to be done in the city with bystanders calling out their two cents worth.

Going by the angry, stubborn look on Chauvin's face as he kept his knee on Floyd's neck, the crowd screaming at him, seeming to know his job better than he did, in front of his subordinates, was a factor in his refusal to let up and appear to be letting the public tell him his job. I believe Chauvin deserved his conviction, but I'll always think that screaming crowd was a big part of the problem.
 
Della said:
Yes, judging from the video above, the cops are used to being screamed at. In just this one incident, we can see Floyd and his two companions were screaming constantly, "I can't breathe" was interspersed with dozens of, "I didn't do nothing," and, "I'm not that kind of guy." They've had to learn to ignore being screamed at.

During Chauvin's trial one of the witnesses, a police officer, said that, "I can't breathe" has been the common 'get out of going to jail,' call of the career criminals since the first famous breathing incident that happened when Eric Garner died in police restraint in 2014. It's a slogan of the Black Lives Movement. Unfortunately it can end up being a case of "the boy who hollered wolf," if it's used when one clearly can breathe, so it's ignored later when one really is in respiratory trouble.

It was the Cup Foods manager who cared about the 20, not the police, it's just their job to inforce the law for the manager. I always feel sorry for that young clerk who was sent out twice to ask a van full of older people doing drugs for the cigarettes back.

If only George would have returned those cigarettes, taken his counterfeit bill and driven off to try it somewhere else, none of this would have happened. If he was as terrified of the police as he pretended to be he would have done just that, knowing the bill had been spotted. If he was as claustrophobic as he pretended to be, he wouldn't have sat in a van with the windows rolled up for thirty minutes outside Cup Foods. If he truly couldn't breathe during the 28 times he screamed it, he wouldn't have had breath to also talk a steady stream of, "I'm not that kind of guy."


The police had been working with people all day long, a steady stream of people so busy shouting, "I didn't do nothing!" that they can't hear simple instructions like, "Please, put both hands on the wheel." All day long, their work had to be done in the city with bystanders calling out their two cents worth.

Going by the angry, stubborn look on Chauvin's face as he kept his knee on Floyd's neck, the crowd screaming at him, seeming to know his job better than he did, in front of his subordinates, was a factor in his refusal to let up and appear to be letting the public tell him his job. I believe Chauvin deserved his conviction, but I'll always think that screaming crowd was a big part of the problem.
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But for all that you've stated here.. the fact remains that George Floyd really COULD NOT Breathe.. he was not crying wolf, he couldn't breathe and he begged them over and over again , and despite that they killed him... ..and that is the whole fact of the matter. Whether floyd sat in his car for 30 mins, or didn't admit to passing a forged note.. or the fact he was already a criminal.. none of it matters, he told them he could not breathe, and it was proven , by his death!
 
That's the whole point of the crying wolf story! In the end the little boy really was attacked by a wolf and died Of course Floyd was telling the truth at the end when he was face down with a knee on his neck. But was he telling the truth when he first got out of his van and was saying he couldn't breathe one minute and saying lots of other things the next? I think it's clear he was lying then. I've been unable to breathe and still able to squeak out a few things like "call 911," but not wasting breath on anything not related to my life. That's why they didn't believe him later when they should have.
 
Della, he could have had breathing problems, and if he did say it while standing up, why not believe it? Most people don't go around saying they can't breathe, even when scared or threatened, unless it's true. And even if his inability to breathe was caused by an asthma attack or whatever, does that get Chauvin off the hook?

It's irrelevant. As Holly said, it's obvious that standing, being forced to the ground, or whatever, he clearly couldn't breathe. Chauvin killed him in full public view. There is no excuse for what he did, or the failure of the other cops to intervene. I'm glad they were all found guilty.

Floyd may have been a minor criminal (no one seems sure about that), but Chauvin is clearly a brutal murderer, captured on video for all to see.
 
I say again, as someone who has a compromised respiratory system-- the body goes into panic mode when you are not getting enough oxygen. Even anxiety can cause the problem for some (my problems are strictly physical) because it impacts how one breathes. And BTW air pollution in urban areas is a contributing factor in respiratory issues.

Just because you are moving AIR in/out does NOT mean you are getting enough oxygen to support continued movement and life.
Why do you think pulse oximeters were invented? Why do you think you We see more people in public places with portable oxygen cannisters? Just because some people may falsely claim the problem does not mean everyone who claims it is lying.
 
Sunny said:
Floyd may have been a minor criminal (no one seems sure about that),
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George Floyd's police record: Between 1997 and 2005, he was convicted of eight crimes. He served four years in prison for a 2007 aggravated, armed robbery in a home invasion, in which held a gun against a woman's, abdomen while his accomplices searched her apartment. In total he spent eight years incarcerated for various crimes.

And before you say it, no, he did not deserve to die because of that record.
Sunny said:
does that get Chauvin off the hook?
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I've said over and over for years, and most recently in a post on this very page, that I thought Chauvin was guilty and deserved his sentence.

The thing is, I can believe Chauvin is guilty without having to put angel wings on George Floyd.
 
Della said:
George Floyd's police record: Between 1997 and 2005, he was convicted of eight crimes. He served four years in prison for a 2007 aggravated, armed robbery in a home invasion, in which held a gun against a woman's, abdomen while his accomplices searched her apartment. In total he spent eight years incarcerated for various crimes.

And before you say it, no, he did not deserve to die because of that record.

I've said over and over for years, and most recently in a post on this very page, that I thought Chauvin was guilty and deserved his sentence.

The thing is, I can believe Chauvin is guilty without having to put angel wings on George Floyd.
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We expect criminals to act like criminals & commit crimes. Criminals have not sworn an oath to uphold the law.
We don't expect police officers to commit worse crimes than the criminals they arrest.
 
Della said:
George Floyd's police record: Between 1997 and 2005, he was convicted of eight crimes. He served four years in prison for a 2007 aggravated, armed robbery in a home invasion, in which held a gun against a woman's, abdomen while his accomplices searched her apartment. In total he spent eight years incarcerated for various crimes.

And before you say it, no, he did not deserve to die because of that record.

I've said over and over for years, and most recently in a post on this very page, that I thought Chauvin was guilty and deserved his sentence.

The thing is, I can believe Chauvin is guilty without having to put angel wings on George Floyd.
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Agree here, and I'll add. Floyd's past behavior was a huge part of what took him to his situation that day, leading to his death.

Had he lead a law abiding life , he would very likely be alive today ...... jmo.
 
About this "boy who cried wolf" business, if you think about it for a minute, that could apply to anything that anyone says. There are all sorts of cases of people yelling, "Help!" "I'm being attacked!" and so on, when the problem is themselves; no one is attacking them, and they do not need immediate help.

So, does that provide an excuse for the police to ignore someone who is shouting those words? The police still have to respond. And in a case involving the "fire in a crowded theatre" example, the Supreme Court ruled that free speech is protected, even if it consists of lies. The only exception is speech aimed at inciting immediate violence. (Any examples come to mind?)

Floyd was being questioned about a minor accusation involving (possibly) counterfeit cash. He lost his life over $20! Of course, the issue was really an out-of-control, racist cop.

In the case of George Floyd, he obviously could not breathe. Why all this dancing around, arguing about standing up vs lying down, that other people have used that as a "get out of jail free card" (huh?) and all the other nonsense, which sounds like the last desperate attempt to find some excuse for Chauvin, by a second-rate lawyer.
 
Sunny said:
About this "boy who cried wolf" business, if you think about it for a minute, that could apply to anything that anyone says. There are all sorts of cases of people yelling, "Help!" "I'm being attacked!" and so on, when the problem is themselves; no one is attacking them, and they do not need immediate help.
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The 8th Amendment requires the police, etc., to attend to medical conditions, such as Floyd saying he can not breath. Failure to address such is known as "Deliberate Indifference", which falls under the deprivation of Civil Rights.
Sunny said:
So, does that provide an excuse for the police to ignore someone who is shouting those words? The police still have to respond. And in a case involving the "fire in a crowded theatre" example, the Supreme Court ruled that free speech is protected, even if it consists of lies. The only exception is speech aimed at inciting immediate violence. (Any examples come to mind?)
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Yeah, just what you said, that's not protected speech.
 
We finally get some justice for George Floyd. Unfortunately, this kind of thing happens every day in America. For every cop actually convicted of brutalizing or illegally killing someone there are 10 cops who completely get away with it. Let's face it. There are waaaay too many cops who really enjoy hurting people. They are the same kind of men who enjoy beating their wife/girlfriend.
 
Sunny said:
About this "boy who cried wolf" business, if you think about it for a minute, that could apply to anything that anyone says. There are all sorts of cases of people yelling, "Help!" "I'm being attacked!" and so on, when the problem is themselves; no one is attacking them, and they do not need immediate help.

So, does that provide an excuse for the police to ignore someone who is shouting those words? The police still have to respond. And in a case involving the "fire in a crowded theatre" example, the Supreme Court ruled that free speech is protected, even if it consists of lies. The only exception is speech aimed at inciting immediate violence. (Any examples come to mind?)

Floyd was being questioned about a minor accusation involving (possibly) counterfeit cash. He lost his life over $20! Of course, the issue was really an out-of-control, racist cop.

In the case of George Floyd, he obviously could not breathe. Why all this dancing around, arguing about standing up vs lying down, that other people have used that as a "get out of jail free card" (huh?) and all the other nonsense, which sounds like the last desperate attempt to find some excuse for Chauvin, by a second-rate lawyer.
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"The boy who cried wolf" is a ancient children's story about the human psychological response to someone who tells lies. That is, they tend not to believe that person later when they are telling the truth. That's all. Just an explanation as to why the police might not have believed him. I didn't say there was a law against crying wolf or that the police shouldn't have called medics earlier.

Floyd did not lose his life over $20. He lost his life over resisting arrest. The result would have been the same if he had been approached over parking in the wrong spot or bank robbery. He resisted until it required four policemen to hold him. Unfortunately one of them lost control in the struggle and killed him, but it wasn't over $20.

"Racist cop?" Any evidence of that? If so, you've found something that the prosecution's dozen lawyers couldn't find and they spent a whole year in preparation. Chauvin worked with fellow cops of different races every day, he dealt with civilians of all colors every day, he had an Asian wife, and one of the prosecution's witnesses was an elderly black man who said he had friendly chats with Chauvin all the time.

Maybe you wouldn't think I was "dancing around" and talking "nonsense" and making "excuses" if you read the many times I said Chauvin was clearly in the wrong. I may sound a "second rate lawyer" but the truth matters to me even when talking about someone who is guilty of murder.
 
Della said:
"The boy who cried wolf" is a ancient children's story about the human psychological response to someone who tells lies. That is, they tend not to believe that person later when they are telling the truth. That's all. Just an explanation as to why the police might not have believed him. I didn't say there was a law against crying wolf or that the police shouldn't have called medics earlier.

Floyd did not lose his life over $20. He lost his life over resisting arrest. The result would have been the same if he had been approached over parking in the wrong spot or bank robbery. He resisted until it required four policemen to hold him. Unfortunately one of them lost control in the struggle and killed him, but it wasn't over $20.

"Racist cop?" Any evidence of that? If so, you've found something that the prosecution's dozen lawyers couldn't find and they spent a whole year in preparation. Chauvin worked with fellow cops of different races every day, he dealt with civilians of all colors every day, he had an Asian wife, and one of the prosecution's witnesses was an elderly black man who said he had friendly chats with Chauvin all the time.

Maybe you wouldn't think I was "dancing around" and talking "nonsense" and making "excuses" if you read the many times I said Chauvin was clearly in the wrong. I may sound a "second rate lawyer" but the truth matters to me even when talking about someone who is guilty of murder.
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Amen to that Della, Amen to that.
 
rgp said:
Had he lead a law abiding life , he would very likely be alive today ...... jmo.
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Gonna call BS on that statement.

Brionna Taylor, Atatiana Jefferson, Tamil Rice, (he was only 12) Ahmaud Arbery to name several just off the top of my head
 

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