What went wrong?

Shalimar said:
Sadly, I believe that such abhorrence truly existed in relation to women. Nothing they could have done would ever have been sufficient to men of that ilk, who viewed women as possessions not people.
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I'm glad to say such didn't exist in our family.

The men (back in the day) would have liked to believe they were in charge, but when momma cracked the wooden spoon, the men quickly tucked their tails between their legs and made themselves scarce.

In other words, the men knew exactly who was boss and in charge.
 

Panzyitis attacks with sissification. Recall not too many years ago when the "new thing" was men's feminine side!? It was all over the news and on every single talk show and we had to watch hosts ask "regular guys" if they had one and because it was the latest fashion thing they all said yes. I wanted to scream and often did. I am somewhat open minded but last time I checked I'm a man. I also love dogs but I am not one.
 
StarSong said:
Why shouldn't women smoke cigars or ride motorcycles if they so desire.? Haven't seen any conversations about women (in the US, at least) wanting to go shirtless. Perhaps that's a Canadian issue.

I think marriages are stronger when partners have equal power throughout. That's how my and my children's marriages are structured and we're managing just fine. The women and the men pull equal weight.

Marriage isn't the default answer for everyone. I know more than a few women who are much happier living solo. And plenty of men who feel the same.
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I rode motorcycles and smoked joints and while we didn’t have children, my husband preferred me to stay home and look after our dogs.
My man is amazing. Like 911 says about his father, my man’s work ethics are impeccable. In 27 years he hardly missed a day. He does anything for his family. I wish I could say I was just as good at being a housewife but I can’t. He truly IS my better half. He’s a real man to me.
 
:eek: well, some of these posts belong in the Museum of Humanity!
The question asked is "What went wrong?". Nothing, went wrong, people have evolved that's all and it's a great thing.

To be a "man" does not mean keeper of the keys. It means being in touch with and accepting your strengths and weaknesses. It's all right for a man to cry, to respect women and their needs, to have a vested interest in bringing up the children.

By the same token, it is all right for a woman to be soft and feminine and also strong to make her own decisions, to be able to rely on her own resources, be equal to a man. In fact a marriage in my opinion where equality, respect and room for growth is not present - is no marriage.

No one has to be a boss man or boss lady - it's all about partnership and love 👩‍❤️‍👨
 
Dana said:
:eek: well, some of these posts belong in the Museum of Humanity!
The question asked is "What went wrong?". Nothing, went wrong, people have evolved that's all and it's a great thing.

To be a "man" does not mean keeper of the keys. It means being in touch with and accepting your strengths and weaknesses. It's all right for a man to cry, to respect women and their needs, to have a vested interest in bringing up the children.

By the same token, it is all right for a woman to be soft and feminine and also strong to make her own decisions, to be able to rely on her own resources, be equal to a man. In fact a marriage in my opinion where equality, respect and room for growth is not present - is no marriage.

No one has to be a boss man or boss lady - it's all about partnership and love 👩‍❤️‍👨
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Qft.
 
Dana said:
:eek: well, some of these posts belong in the Museum of Humanity!
The question asked is "What went wrong?". Nothing, went wrong, people have evolved that's all and it's a great thing.

To be a "man" does not mean keeper of the keys. It means being in touch with and accepting your strengths and weaknesses. It's all right for a man to cry, to respect women and their needs, to have a vested interest in bringing up the children.

By the same token, it is all right for a woman to be soft and feminine and also strong to make her own decisions, to be able to rely on her own resources, be equal to a man. In fact a marriage in my opinion where equality, respect and room for growth is not present - is no marriage.

No one has to be a boss man or boss lady - it's all about partnership and love 👩‍❤️‍👨
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That’s a GREAT post! Well articulated. 👍
 
horseless carriage said:
Sissification! Brilliant, I am going to steal that.
I do like Gaer's comment: "GIRLS WERE GIRLS AND MEN WERE MEN."
Do we qualify?
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Classy!

I have used the term "neutered male" to describe what I think "sissification" might refer to. To me, these men are so wrapped up in political correctness that they forgot what it means to be a man. If a man is as I described in my previous post, he should never need to walk around apologizing for his mere existence, trying so hard to not offend everybody. The male who does that is "male", but no longer "man".

To me, it doesn't work well to have the courts decide how people should treat each other because then we have people trying to grab power by lording over another group of people, using these laws as baseball bats to beat these other groups up with. Then, we have those now being beat up, getting the courts to install still more laws to protect them from those doing the beating. It never ends, and after a while, everybody is so hog-tied with the laws that nobody can do anything without offending somebody and getting into legal trouble. It seems to me we are there now.

Common human decency and respect for one another ought to be sufficient and really is the easiest and simplest solution. With this solution, we ALL become a part of the solution instead of constantly contributing to the problem.

Tony
 
Aunt Marg said:
I remember the phrase well, though it didn't apply in my childhood home, as mom and dad had a hard enough time just keeping up, never mind keeping up with anyone else.

I never would have guessed that such abhorrence existed in relation to homemakers.
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Oh, it existed all right, all over. As someone said above, you were very lucky in your situation. And as you said above, maybe it was because of the European background in your family; that could well be. I've read a lot of history and it seems like the happy background situation you experienced has never been really prevalent in the U.S.; a lot of the letters, diaries & journals from the beginning of this country seem to feature a (maybe American) preoccupation with money, money, money.

So that kind of sit-com, 50s-early 60s, everybody being happy with mom staying home with the kids was a 20-some-year aberration. Up 'till about the time the Indus. Revol. was really taking a hold in the U.S., women of course didn't work outside the home but they were mostly farm women who reeeealy worked their butts off (still do the few who still exist) or else rich women. And what I and many others have experienced of what happened to women who because of money had to work outside the home (and therefore added everything they were doing before, all the housework, in addition to now working outside the home), I don't think very many women at all did it just because of women's lib. They may have said that to make themselves (or their husbands, gotta remember that male ego) feel better about the fact that he didn't make enough $$ for her to stay home.

So the that time period of the happy, stay-at-home mom was such a small amount of time--ask any historian; they laugh their butts off at a measly 20-year time frame for anything--that I don't think it should ever be counted on as coming back again. I think that probably the worst thing you could do to a daughter is get her hopes up for that kind of life when she most likely would never get it; maybe sad (to some) but true.
 
To all of you who are admonishing me for "Herbert Hoover". I did not write this song. This song, "Those were the Days" was written by Gene Raskin and first recorded in 1962 by the Limelighters. Please notice the quote marks around the song.

When i was growing up in Montana, they used to say, "Montana is where men are men and women are damn glad of it!"
Yes, Men are now much more effiminate and it's sad.

I should add: IMO
 
Gaer said:
To all of you who are admonishing me for "Herbert Hoover". I did not write this song. This song was written by Gene raskin and first recorded in 1962 by the Limelighters. Please notice the quote marks around the song.

When i was growing up in Montana, they used to say, "Montana is where men are men and women are damn glad of it!"
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In the Army, there was some catchy phrase for every state. For Montana it was "the land where the women are scarce and the sheep are shy".

To be fair, I spent a fair amount of time in Montana when I got back from Vietnam and I liked it out there. After the Army, when back to civilian life, Montana was known as "big sky country". Back then, I think even the Montana license plates had that on them. That WAS (and still is) an accurate depiction. The sky was huge and full of stars at night. Besides, I really didn't see many (or any) sheep while I was there. But then I didn't spend much time in western Montana.

Tony
 
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