WWII Nazi memorabilia

justfred said:
And so it was just Hitler,s Germany and Stalin's Russia that committed atrocities. Let's be honest and open on this. The Allies were no angels at times and I could tell a few tales but the second world war is over and done with so let's get on with sorting today's problems. What's done is done and cannot be undone.
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Today, cultural marxists have also made the memory of my own American forefathers a "problem"...
a problem that they want to erase from society and history. And not just my Confederate forefathers
and their legacy images... but they are also attacking anyone in the past that they now find "offensive"....
including Christopher Columbus, George Washington and Thomas Jefferson. As I posted previously,
the groundwork has already been laid in other draconian nations to punish with imprisonment one's
"illegal" personal perspective of history.

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KingsX said:
Ironically, Germany recently allowed a carefully edited version of "Mein Kampf" to be published in Germany. But one can
still go to jail for questioning the victor's version of WW2 history.
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And what is the victor's version of WW2 in your opinion? What about it do you dispute? Do you believe that the Allies liberated Hitler's concentration camps? Do you even believe there were concentration camps and that 6 million Jews were exterminated? Or any at all?
 
Olivia said:
And what is the victor's version of WW2 in your opinion? What about it do you dispute? Do you believe that the Allies liberated Hitler's concentration camps? Do you even believe there were concentration camps and that 6 million Jews were exterminated? Or any at all?
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There's an old famous saying... "The victors of the war write the history."

When I was in college, I took special honor student history courses that viewed history from the losers' perspective.

What I dispute is anyone who seeks to restrict an individual's right to the freedom to question the "victor's" version of history.

No one appears to care if anyone questions the history of Napoleon's wars... not even Russians whose capital city, Moscow, was invaded and occupied by Napoleon's French troops.

Up until recently, the ONLY war where the "victor's version of history" is protected by LAW in many European nations is WW2, the war that Putin says was won by Stalin's Red Army victors.

But today, another war has been added to that PC list... the American Civil War. Now the images of MY Confederate forefathers are officially condemned and banned as have been the images of the Third Reich in Europe.

This progression of erasing images and history that some might find offensive that continues today is part of the cultural marxist social revolution that began in Western nations after WW2.

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Olivia said:
And what is the victor's version of WW2 in your opinion? What about it do you dispute? Do you believe that the Allies liberated Hitler's concentration camps? Do you even believe there were concentration camps and that 6 million Jews were exterminated? Or any at all?
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Was i there ? No, am I an expert ?...again No but.........

My father was withe the 45th infantry Thunderbirds , part of Patton's 3rd Army. They along with the 42nd Rainbow division were the liberators of Dachau. I have photos of him there...as well as others. I do not doubt for one moment the atrocities history holds on record.

He [my father] wasn't one to talk too much about WWII and his role in it. But when i was a young man, he did explain Dachau, & what he saw there.

Long story but, one aspect of it I do recall was his witnessing the reaction of the townspeople that were forced to come see what had been happening at the camp...As he said...they had to know...the smell alone permeated the air, the trees...he said hell, even the ground itself.

So...do {I} believe it all happened?....Sadly I do indeed.
 
My question to you was:

And what is the victor's version of WW2 in your opinion? What about it do you dispute? Do you believe that the Allies liberated Hitler's concentration camps? Do you even believe there were concentration camps and that 6 million Jews were exterminated? Or any at all?

Your answer below. Looks like you answered it.


KingsX said:
There's an old famous saying... "The victors of the war write the history."

When I was in college, I took special honor student history courses that viewed history from the losers' perspective.

What I dispute is anyone who seeks to restrict an individual's right to the freedom to question the "victor's" version of history.

No one appears to care if anyone questions the history of Napoleon's wars... not even Russians whose capital city, Moscow, was invaded and occupied by Napoleon's French troops.

Up until recently, the ONLY war where the "victor's version of history" is protected by LAW in many European nations is WW2, the war that Putin says was won by Stalin's Red Army victors.

But today, another war has been added to that PC list... the American Civil War. Now the images of MY Confederate forefathers are officially condemned and banned as have been the images of the Third Reich in Europe.

This progression of erasing images and history that some might find offensive that continues today is part of the cultural marxist social revolution that began in Western nations after WW2.

.
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How many Jews may or may not have been killed during WW2 appears to be the special interest of others here... it's not mine. I do know that there were at least a half of million Jews in Stalin's Red Army [most of the camps referenced here were in Stalin's Red Army occupation zone.]

But I will say this, forcing others to obey draconian laws that forbid an opinion contrary to the official victor's version of history... will make it self-fulfilling prophecy.

My interest is to promote the freedom to discuss any part of the history and NOT be jailed in Europe for breaking a law because of an opinion contrary to the victors.

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KingsX said:
Decades ago when I was a teenager, we went to the famous Canton, Texas flea market.
As I walked along, there walking ahead of me was an old Indian man wrapped in a blanket.
On the back of the blanket was a huge swastika like the one Hitler used. It was a strange
"coincidence" because I was reading Mein Kampf at the time.

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Interesting but check it out. Are they exactly the same? For instance one is right to left and the other is left to right. It's an ancient symbol.
 
Olivia said:
And what is the victor's version of WW2 in your opinion? What about it do you dispute? Do you believe that the Allies liberated Hitler's concentration camps? Do you even believe there were concentration camps and that 6 million Jews were exterminated? Or any at all?
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I am not saying that. Yes Both Hitler and Stalin committed horrific crimes against fellow humans, Far worse crimes than any other nation has committed in history. What I am saying is that some of our Allies were not squeaky clean either. I clearly remember, (Maybe it was a fake film maybe it was not) Allied soldiers sat on a river bank with a machine gun. Across the river from a building emerged five German soldiers waving a white flag and with their arms raised in surrender. They were mown down by the men with the machine gun. Although this is a minor incident compared to the horrors of the extermination camps it should not have happened.
 
Camper6 said:
Interesting but check it out. Are they exactly the same? For instance one is right to left and the other is left to right. It's an ancient symbol.
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I know there are differences in swastikas. As I posted, the huge swastika on the old Indian man's blanket was exactly like Hitler's swastika.

The swastika was also used as a hidden stylized cross by early persecuted Christians, Ironically, now it is the swastika that is persecuted.

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How many Jews may or may not have been killed during WW2 appears to be the special interest of others here... it's not mine. I do know that there were at least a half of million Jews in Stalin's Red Army [most of the camps referenced here were in Stalin's Red Army occupation zone.]
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No, KingsX, it is not the "special interest" of any particular group. It must be the interest of us all.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

(And whatever number of Jews "may or may not" have been in Stalin's Red Army -- huh? What on earth has that got to do with the number of people killed by the Nazis in the Holocaust? Gives a new meaning to
the term "Red Herring!")

And justfred, yeah, right. So six million Jews (and six million others!) were killed by the Nazis in their murderous rampage. But you clearly remember seeing a film (which by your own words, may have been a fake) where 5 German soldiers were shot by the allies. So it all comes out even; both sides were wrong?

Unbelievable.
 
It's hard to believe that questioning the Holocaust is where this topic has landed.

I started this thread in hopes of learning how others managed (unwanted) inherited Nazi memorabilia. Were they conflicted because these items were part of our fathers' war experience and may have some historical value? When did the practice of taking war trophies home end? Indeed has it ended at all? Now that I think about it (and I may be incorrect on this) the US hasn't been on the winning side of a major ground war since WWII.

Only a couple of posters addressed any of these questions.

After watching the quite disturbing, if thinly veiled, antisemitism of some here, I have found my own answer. I'll phone the quite excellent Los Angeles Museum of Tolerance for some direction on this. My suspicion is that the Nazi flag will become acquainted with my trash can very shortly.

How disturbing some of the sentiments expressed here would be for many American men who fought to stop Nazism and release prisoners from those concentration camps. That I write these words on Memorial Day feels particularly apt and poignant.

p.s. All of the American soldiers that I knew who served in the ETO - and I grew up around many - were quite clear about the horrific intent of the Nazi's Final Solution and the terrible losses of life, health, dignity, personal peace and/or possessions inflicted on the Jewish people by that regime. Gypsies, homosexuals and the disabled were also targeted as being "impure" and therefore unworthy of either life or freedom among the "master race", but the Nazis' primary targets were the Jewish people and their primary aim was annihilation.
 
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Starsong, I wouldn't throw it in the trash can just yet. The Los Angeles Museum of Tolerance may give you some good answers. I also think you might contact the U.S. Holocaust Museum in Washington, DC. I went to their web site and found this, as a starting point. The Nazi flag could be a part of their permanent exhibit, if they don't already have one.

https://www.ushmm.org/online/form/contact-the-museum/input
 
There is a huge difference between those idiots who collect nazi memoribilia becuase they admire such behavior, and the memoribilia owned by those who were proud to say, "I helped beat the bastards."

We all must remember that The Nazi's were not the only ones who committed mass murder in the millions. Though such information is suppressed by the Communists, and the Cultural Marxists here in America, Stalin actually murdered more people than did Hitler.

Anyone who denies that the Holocaust happened, is an uneducated idiot. We, however, we also must remember that Josef Stalin murdered far more.
 
Sunny said:
No, KingsX, it is not the "special interest" of any particular group. It must be the interest of us all.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana
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Really?

Is the 20th century Armenian holocaust when millions of Armenians were massacred of special interest to you?

Is the 20th century Russian holocaust when millions of Russians were massacred of special interest to you?

Is the 20th century Ukrainian holocaust when millions of Ukrainians were intentionally starved to death of special interest to you?

I bet most Americans have never heard of these Christian holocausts.

What most people care about is what the mass media tells them to care about.

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Traveler said:
There is a huge difference between those idiots who collect nazi memoribilia becuase they admire such behavior, and the memoribilia owned by those who were proud to say, "I helped beat the bastards."

We all must remember that The Nazi's were not the only ones who committed mass murder in the millions. Though such information is suppressed by the Communists, and the Cultural Marxists here in America, Stalin actually murdered more people than did Hitler.

Anyone who denies that the Holocaust happened, is an uneducated idiot. We, however, we also must remember that Josef Stalin murdered far more.
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Agreed. Sad to say there have been a number of unspeakably horrific political leaders who've been responsible for intentionally murdering millions of their own citizen. In the 20th Century alone, Hitler, Stalin, Leopold II (Belgian Congo), Pol Pot and Turkish leaders (Armenian genocide) come immediately to mind. This planet has spawned no shortage of powerful bloodthirsty men.
 
StarSong said:
Agreed. Sad to say there have been a number of unspeakably horrific political leaders who've been responsible for intentionally murdering millions of their own citizen. In the 20th Century alone, Hitler, Stalin, Leopold II (Belgian Congo), Pol Pot and Turkish leaders (Armenian genocide) come immediately to mind. This planet has spawned no shortage of powerful bloodthirsty men.
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Not to dispute any of that. Just that the subject of this thread was about Nazi memorabilia. I don't understand the diversion to make it seem like no big deal about Nazi's and their intent of that genocide as opposed to other genocides.
 
KingsX said:
Really?

Is the 20th century Armenian holocaust when millions of Armenians were massacred of special interest to you?

Is the 20th century Russian holocaust when millions of Russians were massacred of special interest to you?

Is the 20th century Ukrainian holocaust when millions of Ukrainians were intentionally starved to death of special interest to you?

I bet most Americans have never heard of these Christian holocausts.

What most people care about is what the mass media tells them to care about.

.
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Excellent point. Many people, perhaps most people, have little knowledge of the real world. If such people happen to stumble across information that does not support their slanted, uneducated views of the world, they will ignore that info and act as if it does not exist.

No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the public at large.
 
Traveler said:
Excellent point. Many people, perhaps most people, have little knowledge of the real world. If such people happen to stumble across information that does not support their slanted, uneducated views of the world, they will ignore that info and act as if it does not exist.
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Just goes to show the Nazi extermination of Jews is just a little blip in history, is that it? My great uncle was ready to board a ship to New York City in France. But that wasn't good enough for the Nazi's. They didn't want Jews to just leave Europe, they wanted to exterminate every last one.
 
No one went broke underestimating the narrowness of xenophobic minds either. Fascinating what goes into creating such a mindset. Currently coauthoring a book about it. There have been, and continue to be terrible

genocidal periods in history, all are important. But this thread deals with Nazi memorabilia, their flag is a glaring representation of all those who suffered and often died under their brutal regime. It is incredibly

insensitive to brush this aside in order to discuss other brutalities, particularly since some of us have Jewish ancestors affected by the Final Solution. To do so reeks of antisemitism, and violates the rules as carefully laid out by admin.
 
The Nazi's created the most unimaginable hell on earth for Jews, Poles, Comminists, homosexuals, gypsies, dissidents, and many other groups. BUT, IT WAS NOT THE ONLY HOLOCAUST THAT HAS HAPPENED IN WORLD HISTORY. THE 20TH CENTURY ALONE, IS RIFE WITH THE KILLING FIELDS.
 
Traveler said:
Excellent point. Many people, perhaps most people, have little knowledge of the real world. If such people happen to stumble across information that does not support their slanted, uneducated views of the world, they will ignore that info and act as if it does not exist.

No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the public at large.
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The irony is... as i posted here previously, in 2012 Putin dedicated a huge Jew holocaust center in Moscow, the largest in the world.

Yet he is dead silent about the millions of Christian Russians and Ukrainians [Russian citizens at the time] who were brutally murdered en masse by Bolsheviks. In 2000, he refused to attend the canonization of Tsar Nicholas II and his royal family [who were also martyred by Bolsheviks] at the newly rebuilt Church of Christ the Saviour in Moscow. But then, Putin was KGB and has expressed regret at the demise of the USSR.

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Traveler said:
The Nazi's created the most unimaginable hell on earth for Jews, Poles, Comminists, homosexuals, gypsies, dissidents, and many other groups. BUT, IT WAS NOT THE ONLY HOLOCAUST THAT HAS HAPPENED IN WORLD HISTORY. THE 20TH CENTURY ALONE, IS RIFE WITH THE KILLING FIELDS.
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NO ONE has said it was or is! But this thread is about Nazi memorabilia. And I'll keep saying that until doomsday here if I have to as long as using other atrocities is used to brush off the Final Solution by Hitler!
 
Shalimar and Olivia, thank you for pointing out how easily deflections can move our focus from the matter at hand. I apologize for participating in the distraction.

It's likely that the Holocaust greatly affected the lives of most on this forum since today's Seniors grew up with adult family members, friends, neighbors, and relatives who were WWII veterans. To those who lost family members in the Holocaust I offer my sincerest condolences. I cannot begin to imagine your anger and pain from such a horrific cruelty.
 
My support of the Israeli nation is well documented. Any implication that I do not feel great sympathy for the Jews and shame that that a so-called Christian nation (Nazi Germany) could create the holocaust, is dishonest and the lowest form of debate.
 

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