I suppose, too, that it's a way for the "powerless" and to feel "powerful".
Another school shooting
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I suppose, too, that it's a way for the "powerless" and to feel "powerful".
Don M.
SF VIP
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- central Missouri
If there is anything positive about this latest shooting, it is the fact that the authorities have captured this lunatic, and he appears to be unharmed. Hopefully, they can learn something about what drove him to this senseless act, and begin to take steps to help prevent future acts of a similar nature. Most of the time, these shooters are either shot, or take their own lives, and we are left with little other than speculation for their motives.
With all these school shootings, there is a active attempt, in this States legislature, to allow teachers to take firearms courses, and be allowed to carry concealed weapons in school...it wouldn't surprise me to hear of other states that are considering similar legislation. Another alternative might be to have armed police assigned to our schools...this senseless killing of children cannot be allowed to continue.
With all these school shootings, there is a active attempt, in this States legislature, to allow teachers to take firearms courses, and be allowed to carry concealed weapons in school...it wouldn't surprise me to hear of other states that are considering similar legislation. Another alternative might be to have armed police assigned to our schools...this senseless killing of children cannot be allowed to continue.
Warrigal
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- Sydney, Australia
We have our fair share of disturbed young men too but the last one that got his hands on such lethal weaponry was in 1996. Laws were introduced, not to ban all guns as frequently supposed, but to make sure anyone wanting to buy one had a valid reason for doing so. (Yes I know - the 2nd Amendment - it would require another amendment to the constitution) There was a gun amnesty that allowed a lot of illegal guns (as in unregistered) to be handed in and other legal guns were bought back and all of them destroyed. The states agreed to uniform legislation and the federal government outlawed the importation of certain categories of guns.
Not easy to achieve and politically courageous BUT WE HAVEN'T HAD TO CRY OVER VICTIMS OF A SHOOTING RAMPAGE EVER SINCE. As far as I can remember we have never has a school massacre. That does seem to be a uniquely American phenomenon.
https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&...hur-Massacre&usg=AOvVaw0mJ0sjvDQmMnu4pc-2YXAc
Not easy to achieve and politically courageous BUT WE HAVEN'T HAD TO CRY OVER VICTIMS OF A SHOOTING RAMPAGE EVER SINCE. As far as I can remember we have never has a school massacre. That does seem to be a uniquely American phenomenon.
https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&...hur-Massacre&usg=AOvVaw0mJ0sjvDQmMnu4pc-2YXAc
Traveler
Senior Member
- Location
- San Diego County
Until people begin to understand that there is something seriously wrong with our crumbling culture, it will continue. Sad but true.
I agree. Young people in the U.S. used to carry and use guns when I was growing up, but things like this never happened back then. Maybe it's lack of parenting?? IDK,
My sincere condolences to the families and friends of the victims.
I was involved in trying to prevent one school shooting back in '06. The shooter, Charles Roberts, took ten little Amish girls hostage and shot eight of them and killed five. It was a very horrendous sight to watch play out. Our negotiator could not talk the shooter out before he killed himself. Once the shooting started, Five of us charged the building, weapons in hand, but Charles had killed himself just as we kicked in the door.
The egregiousness of the shooter's actions did not hit me until hours later. I think the fact that I had so much to do kept my mind busy and was able to block out the horrific nature of what had just happened. I have replayed that day over and over asking myself if I could have done something different to prevent the shooting from even starting, but the Psychiatrist that I had visited days later told me that when these types of people go on a mission such as this, nothing will stop them.
That day has been the worse day of my life.
The egregiousness of the shooter's actions did not hit me until hours later. I think the fact that I had so much to do kept my mind busy and was able to block out the horrific nature of what had just happened. I have replayed that day over and over asking myself if I could have done something different to prevent the shooting from even starting, but the Psychiatrist that I had visited days later told me that when these types of people go on a mission such as this, nothing will stop them.
That day has been the worse day of my life.
Warrigal
SF VIP
- Location
- Sydney, Australia
God bless you for caring and for being there. :bighug:
Warrigal
SF VIP
- Location
- Sydney, Australia
Here is another hero who cared.
Vale, Aaron Feis. Heaven awaits the man who lays down his life for another.
Florida shooting: Football coach 'died a hero' shielding students from school gunman
Thu 15 Feb 2018, 8:33pm
A Florida high school football coach "died a hero" after being shot while shielding students from gunfire in a deadly attack that killed 17 people.
Reports emerged on Twitter that the school's varsity football assistant coach Aaron Feis had stepped in to cover students and was himself shot.
The school's football team later tweeted that Mr Feis had been shot as he "selflessly shielded students from the shooter".
"He died a hero and he will forever be in our hearts and memories," the MS Douglas Football department tweeted.
One of the Douglas players, Charlie Rothkopf, tweeted that Mr Feis had provided cover for other students.
Vale, Aaron Feis. Heaven awaits the man who lays down his life for another.
dpwspringer
Member
- Location
- Georgia
I think you are on to something, unfortunately the way the wind is blowing it is likely to continue getting worse. Victimology or whatever it is called that we have heaped on us by much of the media causes most everybody to get upset, frustrated, and feeling like they are being done wrong.
hearlady
Basic Member
- Location
- N Carolina
I just have no words.........
hearlady
Basic Member
- Location
- N Carolina
Wait! Yes I do. I always hear "He fell through the cracks". We need to fill these cracks.
There were signs. Many, many signs.
There were signs. Many, many signs.
I thought the same thing, Don, when I read about it this morning. At least this one isn't dead, and maybe by studying and talking with him, the authorities can find out what makes these mass murderers "tick." What was going through his head at the time? What prompted him to do such a horrifying act in the first place? I know he was expelled from that school for bad behavior, so how long was this level of anger boiling in his system? Maybe some clues might come to the surface that could help prevent the next mass shooting.
About the guns, there's probably not much that can be done at this point. The gun lobby has seen to it that there are so many weapons of mass slaughter floating around that even if all guns were banned tomorrow, there would still be millions of them out there on the black market. Obviously, anyone wanting to own a gun would still easily find one.
retiredtraveler
Senior Member
There were armed police here. Didn't do anything. You can patrol the entire school all the time and be in all places.
rgp
Well-known Member
- Location
- Milford,OH
Remember when parents used to have some anxiety / fear when their teenage kids went out on a weekend night ? I sadly suspect they now have that same anxiety / fear when their kids go to school...How in the world did we get to this point ?
S
Stormy
Guest
RIP to everyone who died
You're right Radish not everybody but the ones who are loudest. It pisses me off that every time this happens there's people waggin their fingers and preaching more gun restrictions especially from other countries who are already under complete gov control. Again and again they ignored all the warnings about this Nikolas de Jesus Cruz, the school officials and the gov and him being involved with the Syrian resistance and other terrorist bomb making groups. He made so many threats and they were all ignored now everyone is so shocked. He even said he was going to be a school shooter on social media. Where were the armed security guard that should have been in place since the last school shooting? Were any qualified adults allowed to conceal carry and maybe stop this lunatic when the count was 3 dead? That's all the input I have here like you Radish
https://www.buzzfeed.com/briannasac...ng-threat-from?utm_term=.aqw79XNJ1#.dqYzRQAK0
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/broward/article200126034.html
"Fox News reports that Cruz was a member of "resistance groups" on Facebook, according to reporter Trace Gallagher.
“He’s also following resistance groups, like Syrian Resistance groups and fighter groups out of Iraq and, we should also note that a couple days ago, as far as a week ago, that he was involved in a Youtube chat room conversation about bombs or building bombs,” Gallagher said."
Traveler
Senior Member
- Location
- San Diego County
I believe that there are multiple causes of why so many young men do these terribly violent attacks. Anger ? Yes, but what has caused that anger ?
Children need much, much more parental involvement and supervision of what the child is allowed to do. Unfortunately, in todays world, children have access to every bizarre thing on the internet. I am NOT a computer expert but I have heard that there are ways to lock-out certain undesirable aspects of the www.
I have also read that there are extremely realistic and ultra violent video games. It has been said that by the mid to late teens, kids have "killed over 10,000 "virtual people" on those games.
We have heard that many, perhaps even most, of the teenage killers are loners who isolate themselves. This is a HUGE "red-flag". Normal, mentally healthy kids do NOT isolate themselves. Normal, healthy kids are involved with their peer groups. They play sports, go to the beach, go to parties, have part-time jobs, and start to become interested in dating.
I repeat, the biggest, most important factor for raising normal, healthy, happy kids is for the parents to be totally involved in their children's lives. A little bit of so-called "quality time" doesn't cut it. Day in, day out, 24/7, love, kindness, involvement, supervision and caring discipline are all required to raise healthy children.
Two last notes. Buying "things" for children can NEVER take the place of love and involvement. And boys absolutely need a strong male presence in their lives. A single parent mother can do the job but she must be one very tough, yet loving, parent.
Camper6
Well-known Member
- Location
- Northwestern Ontario Canada
Not really. The forefathers never envisioned weapons of that type to be used to kill innocent civilians.
Even during the revolution. The only targets were soldiers on both sides. Civilian homes were not raided and innocents killed.
This is stretching the Second Amendment way to far from what it was intended for.
What's puzzling or is getting lost is that this mass murderer/shooter was 19 years old-a young adult, not a juvenile. He wasn't in the school anymore. He's still a killer and doesn't minimize what he did but this wasn't a kid being bullied on the school yard. He should've been treated like any other adult when investigating any prior threats or offenses. Saw where the FBI interviewed him in the fall-did they treat him like a high school student or young adult? Also heard he was expelled for bringing banned items to school. It's like no one can put all the facts together.
Ironically, the Broward County sheriff's name is Israel and the shooter's middle name is Jesus [ Nicolas de Jesus Cruz.]
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Schools officials should be armed and trained how to use those weapons in an emergency.
Recently I heard about a crime that happened many years ago when an estranged abusive father entered an elementary school with a gun and demanded the Principal hand over his little boy. It should have ended there in the Principal's office. Instead, the Principal took the father to the child's classroom [putting other children in danger] and the armed father left the school with the little boy who was never seen again and is presumed to have been murdered [the father who is now in prison refuses to tell authorities what happened to the little boy.]
Traveler
Senior Member
- Location
- San Diego County
I believe that any discussion of too many readily available firearms is missing the point.
How many teenagers are attending America's schools ? Ten of millions. Out of that number, how many teenagers go on killing rampages ?
We are talking about approximately 1 in a million. Any fool can obtain a firearm in America. 99.9999 % of teenagers DO NOT pick up a weapon and start killing. Why ? In my opinion, in the answer lies in how children are parented.
The number one goal of any parent is, or should be, to successfully raise a normal, healthy, educated, child. In other words, to prepare the child to take on the responsibilities of a successful, productive, adult. In this respect, the parents of the Florida killer --- failed. Just as the parents of the Columbine and Sandy Hook killers failed in their primary task.
The root cause, in my opinion, is the child has been granted too damn much freedom. As someone else mentioned, the brain of a child has not sufficiently developed to allow the child to made good life choices. We do not allow children to buy cigarettes or alcohol. We do not allow children to vote or stay out all night. Nor do we allow children, below a certain age, to drive a car. The reason we do not allow those things is because we recognize that children simply do not possess the requisite level of responsibility.
We want, indeed need to, allow a child certain freedoms but only when they are ready for those freedoms. We encourage and teach our children how to walk BUT we don't allow the child to walk out the front door at age two. We allow a child limited freedom to eat or not eat certain foods. But we, as good parents, make every effort to insure the child is getting the proper nutrition. No good parent would ever allow a child to eat nothing but ice cream. We, as good parents, control the child's impulses. In other words, we guide (discipline) the child.
Bit by bit we allow more and more freedoms to the child BUT only when we are certain that the child can safely handle those freedoms.
Trust of, and freedom for, the child, should never be granted willy-nilly. It must be earned by the child.
How many teenagers are attending America's schools ? Ten of millions. Out of that number, how many teenagers go on killing rampages ?
We are talking about approximately 1 in a million. Any fool can obtain a firearm in America. 99.9999 % of teenagers DO NOT pick up a weapon and start killing. Why ? In my opinion, in the answer lies in how children are parented.
The number one goal of any parent is, or should be, to successfully raise a normal, healthy, educated, child. In other words, to prepare the child to take on the responsibilities of a successful, productive, adult. In this respect, the parents of the Florida killer --- failed. Just as the parents of the Columbine and Sandy Hook killers failed in their primary task.
The root cause, in my opinion, is the child has been granted too damn much freedom. As someone else mentioned, the brain of a child has not sufficiently developed to allow the child to made good life choices. We do not allow children to buy cigarettes or alcohol. We do not allow children to vote or stay out all night. Nor do we allow children, below a certain age, to drive a car. The reason we do not allow those things is because we recognize that children simply do not possess the requisite level of responsibility.
We want, indeed need to, allow a child certain freedoms but only when they are ready for those freedoms. We encourage and teach our children how to walk BUT we don't allow the child to walk out the front door at age two. We allow a child limited freedom to eat or not eat certain foods. But we, as good parents, make every effort to insure the child is getting the proper nutrition. No good parent would ever allow a child to eat nothing but ice cream. We, as good parents, control the child's impulses. In other words, we guide (discipline) the child.
Bit by bit we allow more and more freedoms to the child BUT only when we are certain that the child can safely handle those freedoms.
Trust of, and freedom for, the child, should never be granted willy-nilly. It must be earned by the child.
these children that have autism are put on medication that can hurt them --just like doctors putting people on chantix so they will quit smoking have suicidal thoughts -- have heard a lot of people say they had to get off of it--they put children on ritalin and other meds and sometimes it worse than the disease
Shalimar
SF VIP
- Location
- Vancouver Island Canada
In many cases, doctors with little or no mental health training, hand out Ritalin like candy without first ascertaining is the child disturbed, or disturbing? Kids with hellish homes often act out, but that is often indicative of a poor environment, not necessarily a biochemical imbalance. As for Chantix, I couldn’t take it, it made me majorly depressed, borderline suicidal.
We had a young man on another mind altering drug that I forget the name. His mother came home from work and found him hanging in a doorway upstairs. It’s times like those that I Just wanted to go home and take a long vacation. I have no idea how these drugs work, but IMO, I think they are very dangerous. I am not sure if the good they do for some is worth the bad they do for others.
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