Do we really “trust in God”?

rgp said:
Sure I trust in him. I trust that he will bring about yet another catastrophic weather event , or perhaps a school shooting / mass shooting , etc. That will take the lives of hundreds ? thousands ? Many of which will likely be children . Yes indeed he surely does work in wonderous mysterious ways.
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In other words, big trouble can come our way, and sacrificing animals, burning candles, reciting the right words, does not protect us. But if we think positively and imagine something good can happen, that opens the door for something good to happen, and the chances that something good will happen are strong. If not, and we loose both legs, or a loved one, we can still create something good out of our misfortune. If we look for the good we will find it.

I knew a young man who had ALS, a disease that kills the nervous system. He couldn't even scratch his own nose. I was so impressed by his ability to overcome his misfortune and still find pleasure in life. He had great value because he taught a great lesson. I can imagine how we create god-like figures because we want to remember and emulate people who teach such great lessons. When I think my life is intolerable, I think of him and realize how lucky I am.
 

fancicoffee13 said:
God leaves decisions up to mankind. Mankind chooses to do these things you mention. God could intervene and heal and stop all chaos. But, these bad events make people and animals stronger to be overcomers. If everything was easy, no sickness, etc., we would never have any hurdles to overcome and figure out a way to do it better. Babies have to pick themselves up again and again until they learn how to walk.
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Yes and for that reason, I do not look forward to the Christian heaven.
 
I can't totally agree with rgp as some of these atrocities are purely man-made. However, I start to question why innocent children are born with terrible illnesses, or parasitic insects spread disease etc.. If you believe that god is responsible for "all things bright and beautiful", then you must also accept that 'he' is responsible for much of the bad things in the world.

I do not believe in a god, and when you're dead, you're dead.
 

The topic is do we really trust in God?

For those with blind faith or a belief there is a supernatural being billions of years old that created the heavens, earth & mankind.

What exactly do you trust?
 
Vida May said:
We have a problem with the question about if we believe there is a god. In the US that assumes the Christian definition of God, and for me and Jews, those stories are just stories to make a point. They are not to be taken literally. Actually, at least five of the stories appear to be are translations of Sumerian stories adjusted to fit the theme of one god and this leads some to think these people began in Egypt under a pharaoh who insisted everyone worship one god.

When I was 8, I asked my Sunday School teacher why Catholics and Protestants were separate. She could not give me a satisfactory answer and that lead to learning of all religions and they are all basically the same. Actually, I like the Hindu explanation of why we are not perfect better than the Christian one and I don't see their caste system as different from Western classes, in the days of old, when a person's life was stuck in the position a person was born into and this was seen as God's will.

Joseph Campbell explained how around the world myths share much in common. His notion was God spoke to everyone, and people heard him differently depending on their environment and history. I like that notion, but for me, that is not a god like the Christian god, but is logos. I think the Christian notion of a God that is modeled after humans, is as real as Zeus. Christians have made an incomprehensible god comprehensible and I think that is a mistake.

I say all that because I think we are better off accepting a notion of universal god than when we deny such a possibility, so I ask Christians to allow me and others, their understanding of god and don't make it an either-or choice.
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Vida May said:
We have a problem with the question about if we believe there is a god. In the US that assumes the Christian definition of God, and for me and Jews, those stories are just stories to make a point. They are not to be taken literally. Actually, at least five of the stories appear to be are translations of Sumerian stories adjusted to fit the theme of one god and this leads some to think these people began in Egypt under a pharaoh who insisted everyone worship one god.

When I was 8, I asked my Sunday School teacher why Catholics and Protestants were separate. She could not give me a satisfactory answer and that lead to learning of all religions and they are all basically the same. Actually, I like the Hindu explanation of why we are not perfect better than the Christian one and I don't see their caste system as different from Western classes, in the days of old, when a person's life was stuck in the position a person was born into and this was seen as God's will.

Joseph Campbell explained how around the world myths share much in common. His notion was God spoke to everyone, and people heard him differently depending on their environment and history. I like that notion, but for me, that is not a god like the Christian god, but is logos. I think the Christian notion of a God that is modeled after humans, is as real as Zeus. Christians have made an incomprehensible god comprehensible and I think that is a mistake.

I say all that because I think we are better off accepting a notion of universal god than when we deny such a possibility, so I ask Christians to allow me and others, their understanding of god and don't make it an either-or choice.
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Vida May, I so didn’t mean it was an either or choice. (Well in a way I guess I did. But what I meant was people have a choice to believe in any God they choose or not believe in any at all) I highly respect others beliefs and feel it’s
like one of those “there isn’t any right or wrong
answer tests” that I use to love to take. Do I, personally believe there is only one true God? Yes, but I think all people’s idea of God is one in the same...does that make sense? Do I think only people of my religion and my beliefs will go to heaven??? Absolutely not. I don’t think anyone was meant to prove or understand the concept of God. They were just meant to believe, have trust in, and follow the ways of whichever God they choose.
Sunny said:
Kathleen, no one can ever prove a negative. That is no argument for the existence of God at all.

If I say there is a large, purple, polka-dotted people eater in the middle of your living room, and you say no, there isn't, can I say, "Well, prove that there isn't?" Of course not. I would have to prove that there is.
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😂. Oh Sunny it is all beyond my mortal brain. I just believe what I believe with no explanations or proof needed. Guess that is called faith. But this is MY belief, and have all the respect in the world for what other people choose to believe or not believe
 
fancicoffee13 said:
God leaves decisions up to mankind. Mankind chooses to do these things you mention. God could intervene and heal and stop all chaos. But, these bad events make people and animals stronger to be overcomers. If everything was easy, no sickness, etc., we would never have any hurdles to overcome and figure out a way to do it better. Babies have to pick themselves up again and again until they learn how to walk.
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Mankind brings about hurricanes, earthquakes & the like ?

" these bad events make people and animals stronger to be overcomers"

Really ? Just when will we be strong enough ?
 
rgp said:
Mankind brings about hurricanes, earthquakes & the like ?

" these bad events make people and animals stronger to be overcomers"

Really ? Just when will we be strong enough ?
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Think about it this way RGP

Mankind has done really great at overcoming hurdles. Stones attached to sticks as weapons gave way metal. Bows & arrows gave way to rifles & bullets. Bayonets not great but better than close contact with a knife.

Tanks & armored vehicles worked really good but planes able to drop bombs improved the ability to kill without personal contact.

Useful was the M-1 carbine but better was the fully automatic machine gun. The fully automatic machine gun was accepted by criminals as a better way to out gun the police. Then seeing that, use by crazies to kill became popular. Guns are being phased out that is why the Chinese thought up a better way to kill. A bio weapon called covid-19. When that gets controlled the next hurdle will probably take longer to be put in place.

Killing without having to resort to stones attached to sticks took some time to achieve but as was pointed out mankind & hurdles are part of the challenges to overcome. Could be in the grand plan for mankind as the world population grew the hurdle of living a long life was part of the long term plan by God to limit population.
 
rgp said:
Mankind brings about hurricanes, earthquakes & the like ?

" these bad events make people and animals stronger to be overcomers"

Really ? Just when will we be strong enough ?
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Ok, the things you talked about are incidents that happen. We are to be strong in character, not to resort to violence, bitterness, division, etc. We need to help those that need help, show kindness, and forgiveness. Animals are the same, they forgive us when we correct them and they still love us and trust us. Natural disasters will happen and we go forward and build again and go forward with life.
 
There are two roads to choose from. Life or destruction. Not a lot of choices. At the end of the day, everything and everyone returns to dust. But, those who believe have life eternal and will not just return to dust. Our souls return to Heaven to live with the Father and our families. I speak bluntly and openly about this because I am a believer in God and know for certain all about Him and His creation. I don't have all the answers, but this is my statement. I have been tested and will continue to be tested in my Faith, but I resort to trusting in Him no matter what comes my way.
 
Knight said:
Think about it this way RGP

Mankind has done really great at overcoming hurdles. Stones attached to sticks as weapons gave way metal. Bows & arrows gave way to rifles & bullets. Bayonets not great but better than close contact with a knife.

Tanks & armored vehicles worked really good but planes able to drop bombs improved the ability to kill without personal contact.

Useful was the M-1 carbine but better was the fully automatic machine gun. The fully automatic machine gun was accepted by criminals as a better way to out gun the police. Then seeing that, use by crazies to kill became popular. Guns are being phased out that is why the Chinese thought up a better way to kill. A bio weapon called covid-19. When that gets controlled the next hurdle will probably take longer to be put in place.

Killing without having to resort to stones attached to sticks took some time to achieve but as was pointed out mankind & hurdles are part of the challenges to overcome. Could be in the grand plan for mankind as the world population grew the hurdle of living a long life was part of the long term plan by God to limit population.
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OK, think about it this way Knight..... all you said is true, but mankind does not create hurricanes, tornados, earthquakes, tsunamis etc...... which kill sometimes thousands in one stroke. That claim to fame belongs to your guy god.
 
fancicoffee13 said:
After listening to Joyce Meyer for quite awhile, I listened to Joel Osteen and bought his books. He is such a good preacher!
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I found Joel first, then Joyce, through him. Joel has his own station on Sirius XM. It is channel 128. 24/7!

I did see Joel live at Madison Square Garden over 10 years ago.
 
Pepper said:
I found Joel first, then Joyce, through him. Joel has his own station on Sirius XM. It is channel 128. 24/7!
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Thank you. Have you listened to David Jeremiah? I am listening to him now and he has lots to say to help us through this time in the world with this virus going on.
 
rgp said:
OK, think about it this way Knight..... all you said is true, but mankind does not create hurricanes, tornados, earthquakes, tsunamis etc...... which kill sometimes thousands in one stroke. That claim to fame belongs to your guy god.
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Well you have to admit God learns quick. He flooded the earth killing all but Noah & his family. That didn't work out to well as we all know. Maybe now his plan is to wipe out his creation little by little by the occasional hurricanes, tornados, earthquakes, tsunamis etc.. OK so it's not on the grand scale but wars and plagues can help take up the slack.

My guy has been around for billions of years now so we know he has patience. Remember this mayhem/death/destruction he causes is a test to see who is worthy of joining him where ever he is. One of those scientific facts that baffles most, where exactly is God. He can't be in our universe since he made it, because you can't make something that is already in place.

To bad the bakers aren't still around, I kind of enjoyed Tammy Fayes make up & the life they led promoting faith.
 
Knight said:
Well you have to admit God learns quick. He flooded the earth killing all but Noah & his family. That didn't work out to well as we all know. Maybe now his plan is to wipe out his creation little by little by the occasional hurricanes, tornados, earthquakes, tsunamis etc.. OK so it's not on the grand scale but wars and plagues can help take up the slack.

My guy has been around for billions of years now so we know he has patience. Remember this mayhem/death/destruction he causes is a test to see who is worthy of joining him where ever he is. One of those scientific facts that baffles most, where exactly is God. He can't be in our universe since he made it, because you can't make something that is already in place.

To bad the bakers aren't still around, I kind of enjoyed Tammy Fayes make up & the life they led promoting faith.
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His place is in our hearts, for he is always with us to help us and never leave us. His domain is in the third heaven.
 
fancicoffee13 said:
I had never given him much of a chance, and when I chose to listen to him for awhile, I got stuck on him like I did with Joel Osteen. Each one has their own way, or preaching techniques. Joyce, Joel and David J. are the ones I have liked a lot.
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David Jeremiah is the reason I got saved.

To me Joel Osteen is like God's cheerleader.
 
Sunny said:
240px-%27Moses%27_by_Michelangelo_JBU310.jpg


Statue of Moses by Michelangelo. See those things on his head?

Not funny, this nonsense was taken literally, and who knows how much suffering and death was prompted by it?
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A lot
 
fancicoffee13 said:
I gladly read about your choice and explainations. Everyone goes through life making choices, putting them into practice. I like things that work, really work. And I have made my choice and I read His Word daily and choose to pattern my life after His Will. To each his own. In my eyes, Catholics and Protestants both believe in the same God, just different ways of going about it. So, both are blessed. Sorry, that is short and sweet, but I don't want to elaborate on this subject too long.
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The Protestant faiths have always come about when a group of people disagree on a pastors or important persons view of the Bible and it’s teachings and meanings. People split off and form a new group, more to their liking, and a new Protestant religion is born.

In the “American” Catholic Church most people decided to use a form of birth control. The church, while not happy, did not kick these people out.

I know very little about the Jewish faith except this faith has also split into weaker less strict groups. I think they are three different groups from the very strict to the not so strict. But I am not going to google it.

I think it just shows people or perhaps just Americans chose their religion, and then chose the most convenient, to them, form of that religion. This says to me no ones religion is that strong. It is a belief in God that needs to be strong. Reading the Bible, not necessary.

My son with DS believes in God. The group home will not take him to church, but they do take the LDS members to church. When the LDS teachers come into the group home, I allow my son to listen because the word of God, is the word of God. My son prays to God. When he is sick he asks me to pray to God that he feels better. My son cannot read. He has an IQ of 53. His belief, in God, is strong and pure.
 
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