Is Orlando's debacle a taboo subject?

Not by yourself, no, but millions of people in unison demanding the ban might just do the trick.

Paradoxically, I think that it will need a conservative administration and another timely massacre to achieve anything. Hillary will not be able to swing it unless public support is overwhelming.
 

Warrigal said:
Not by yourself, no, but millions of people in unison demanding the ban might just do the trick.

Paradoxically, I think that it will need a conservative administration and another timely massacre to achieve anything. Hillary will not be able to swing it unless public support is overwhelming.
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Our conservatives are the ones opposing gun control. They are the Republicans with the NRA backing them! Our democrats, liberals and progressives which is what Hillary and Obama and Sanders are are all for gun control. I have signed petitions for gun control and it still goes through congress. Demanding a ban doesn't automatically get one, we have to go by the system.
 
I'm working on the principle that only Nixon could get away with going to China.

Also, in Australia, if Labor had proposed national gun regulation it would have failed because the Coalition, consisting of two conservative parties, one urban and one regional, would have been united in opposition. However, John Howard, the conservative PM had the support of Labor and most of his own party. The regional party was upset but they were actually the least affected because farmers had a legitimate right to firearms ownership and they were not likely to favour assault style weapons in any case.

One problem I see that the US has that we don't is that you have 50 states. We only have 6. It is much easier to get agreement between the federal and state governments, even of different sides of the political divide. That is a much harder call when you have 50 states.
 

I'm still watching coverage on CNN. The worst shooting spree in America, they say. Trump is calling for Obama's resignation over this issue. What a mess this country is in at the moment. I hope we find a way out of it.
 
The FBI let this guy slide when they had him in their clutches a few years back, just so they could act in a politically correct fashion. We have all read reports about law enforcement being over-zealous and/or doing racial profiling.
 
chic said:
I'm still watching coverage on CNN. The worst shooting spree in America, they say. Trump is calling for Obama's resignation over this issue. What a mess this country is in at the moment. I hope we find a way out of it.
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I heard on the news this morning the stuff being said by Trump. He does really worry me and it did make me think what the heads of the US Armed Services think when he spouts his nonsense. I am pretty sure that they are working on a strategy which he damages every time he provokes ISIS with his 'up and at 'em' rhetoric. As for his condemnation of Obama, well I think it maybe shows that Trump perhaps lacks the powers of diplomacy, caution and consideration that you may want in someone as powerful as the President of th US.

On the gun thing, I think the things should be banned or at very least controlled through extremely restrictive licencing laws. However, just now I am not sure that this would have prevented what has happened in Orlando. It depends on whether or not this guy was operating as an individual claiming allegiance to Islam and ISIS. Or whether he was part of an ISIS organised attack.

Finally, my thoughts are really with the poor families who have to deal with what has happened. Good luck to them and may their god or faith strengthen them.
 
If they hate us already all we need is Trump to antagonize them more. If they want to accomplish something, target him instead of a bunch of innocent civilians. Dear Lord, when you think of all the survivors suffering today...very difficult to even process the enormity of it.
 
Ruthanne said:
Our leadership has been trying to bring about changes like the ones you are talking about but the problem is that our congress is heavily backed by the NRA (National Rifle Association) and they are constantly pointing to our 2nd amendment right to bear arms. The minute we try to change things they start screaming we are taking away their rights. If we can get a congress that has more democrats elected this year we may get a chance to change things concerning gun control. Our leadership is strong but cannot just demand people do what he says automatically, it has to go through the heavily Republican Congress that are hell bent on keeping their second amendment rights. In reality no one is trying to take away their 2nd amendment rights; only trying to make it harder for guns to get into the hands of the wrong people. Yet many say that this is not the answer too as we have the black market that sells guns to those who would use it for underhanded reasons.
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I've gave up on ever seeing any kind of gun control from the Republicans, if a room full of dead 6 year olds can't convince them, nothing can.
 
Ruthanne said:
Who is blaming Muslims? The shooter yesterday called 911 and said he was doing it for ISIS!
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I think the concern is that the bias and bigotry against the peaceful Muslims in your country will be exacerbated by these events. The fact that at the last minute he made that call is of course problematic, but face it, he doesn't speak for all Muslims. Just like Hillsboro Baptists doesn't speak for all Baptists. And that shouldn't happen should it? Didn't his ex-wife also has indicated some mental problems and violence in their home and his father had reported that he became somewhat unhinged when he saw a couple of guys kiss.
 
If this individual was on the FBI terrorist watch list... WHY was he allowed to purchase a firearm?


ps.... I know the answer... just wondering who else does.
 
This is the gun that was used in Orlando and Sandy Hook....note the advertising to sell it...

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Bettyann said:
STOP BLAMING MUSLIMS!!!! A HUGE problem in America is due to the miserable, ignorant, bigoted, ugly hateful attitudes...especially amongst the Christian RIGHT....Prime example: the Lt Governor of Texas.... America has GOOD PEOPLE...yes...but there is still the UGLY AMERICAN who honestly believes for some unfathomable reason that we are still "God's Country"... what a sick joke. What is dangerous about religion is that much of it perpetuatessick twisted version of what they call "GOD"...believing every word they were taught...which was steeped in Fear and Guilt Conditioning.... The self-righteous judgment that comes from 'religious people' is sickening... Our government WANTS to keep us divided... we are much easier to control that way.... What happened today in Orlando is not 'isolated' ... it is a visible, manifested result of hateful, prejudiced, bigoted thinking.
The murder of the 50 people was horrendous... our military kills 'nicely' in the name of God and Country...all we have to do is push a button and cause death... or don't 'those people' count????
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Well I don't think our government "wants" to divide us. They just do. Other than that, I agree with every word of your post. :applause2:
 
Debby said:
I think the concern is that the bias and bigotry against the peaceful Muslims in your country will be exacerbated by these events. The fact that at the last minute he made that call is of course problematic, but face it, he doesn't speak for all Muslims. Just like Hillsboro Baptists doesn't speak for all Baptists. And that shouldn't happen should it? Didn't his ex-wife also has indicated some mental problems and violence in their home and his father had reported that he became somewhat unhinged when he saw a couple of guys kiss.
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It wasn't at the last minute that he made the call, it was 20 minutes into his attack and the attack lasted for hours. I don't see a lot of bias and bigotry in the USA against Muslims where I live. We all get along well. We will see how this plays out. Isn't it funny how you take this situation and turn it into an attack against all of the people of the US calling them bias and bigots? You don't live here and you don't know how it really is. There are a few people like that and they don't represent all of us. Most of us are caring, loving people. But you don't see that, do you?
 
Well I think it happened because we have just another crazy person with a gun.

Guns laws did not stop this crazy person, laws never do stop crazy people. (they are crazy they have a hard time concentrating)

Crazy people have been known to use knives and baseball bats and even drive their cars into people. You see that is why they are crazy, I have knives and even a baseball bat and I do drive a truck however, I have never hurt anyone with any of them. (I am clearly not crazy)

So as far as I am concerned crazy people murder, guns are almost never to blame.

The world is full of crazy people, best protect yourself.
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Clubmike, if you were in a crowded place and a crazy, hate-filled person entered, intent on doing harm, would you rather he was armed with a baseball bat or an assault rifle?
 
You notice the ones who point fingers at Muslims being evil as a whole are the same folks who refuse to blame Guns being evil as a whole?
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This is just disgusting, just pitiful...make up for your manly shortcomings by owning the biggest gun...weenie bastards...if you browse at gun culture magazines...it's frightening...weapon porn.
 
Ruthanne, I understand that America has just gone through another horrific massacre, my heart goes out to you all. But Islamophobia exists, in your country and mine. It is only natural to be concerned that incidents such as this will rev up the haters. I bet we will see Muslim bashing incidents here. The Canadian contingent

does not think all Americans are racists et al. No, we don't live there, but unless one is blind, deaf, and terminally stupid, there is a serious problem with mass shootings happening in your country.
 
Guitarist said:
I recommend staying far, far away from any thread like that one.

They're not fun, you don't really learn anything (except how argumentative people can be, turning from the original attack to attacking each other with words in posts).

There are lot of fun threads here that are much more .... FUN!




I wish Matrix and SeaBreeze would delete all the "news" threads. We can find all we need (and more than we want) on TV and online news sites. Unless someone here is personally involved with any of these news stories I wish we'd all stick to discussing things we actually know something about.
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I must beg to differ on this, my friend. My belief, tis good and healthy to have discussion of controversial subjects. We all have opinions, and should be able to exchange ideas with fellow members. To suggest one sticks to subjects they "know something about" is to also suggest one cut themselves off from the world and the very issues which could effect us all at sometime, such as the Orlando tragedy. This could have happened in your local town and /or neighborhood; at your local grocery story, shopping mall, and/ or club.
 
Jackie22 said:
I've gave up on ever seeing any kind of gun control from the Republicans, if a room full of dead 6 year olds can't convince them, nothing can.
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Never, ever forget that the NRA is first and foremost a lobbying organization meant to enrich gun manufacturers. That's it. That's their sole purpose for existing, to do whatever they can to ensure that their clients sell as many guns as possible, no matter the damage.
 
fureverywhere said:
Um...always say "Respectfully" before suggesting someone is an idiot.
Don't criticize anyone directly but state your own take clearly and concisely.
Understand everyone has a right to their own opinion even if it comes with foil hats.
Or avoid religion and politics all together...easy yes?
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That is excellent advise. I once organized a debate between representatives of the two major Parties in our community. We tried to keep it civil via set of rues and a moderator to enforce the rules ("cut the mike" was a very powerful tool).

Anyway, one of the rules was that you could not say "You are wrong" but you could say, "I think you're wrong BECAUSE...." - and it was the "because" that kept the discussion civil yet lively.
 
fureverywhere said:
You notice the ones who point fingers at Muslims being evil as a whole are the same folks who refuse to blame Guns being evil as a whole?
2012-12-17-Screenshot20121217at4.33.36PM.png


This is just disgusting, just pitiful...make up for your manly shortcomings by owning the biggest gun...weenie bastards...if you browse at gun culture magazines...it's frightening...weapon porn.
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Guns, like money and other physical possessions, are inanimate objects. The want and usage of such possessions is not the fault of the possession, tis the intent of the possessor. Tis the Psych of society which needs addressing, which in the end could render some possessions(such as weapons) unnecessary.
 
senile1 said:
Guns, like money and other physical possessions, are inanimate objects. The want and usage of such possessions is not the fault of the possession, tis the intent of the possessor. Tis the Psych of society which needs addressing, which in the end could render some possessions(such as weapons) unnecessary.
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I absolutely agree... and that is why we want gun legislation to regulate just what kind of possessor get possession.. In other words.. laws against people not against the gun.
 
STOP BLAMING MUSLIMS!!!

Right - let's put the blame where it belongs, Christians, the military, the GOP, the NRA, the guv of Texas, etc. etc. etc.

And - it's those nasty ol' guns. But why stop there? If only we could have seized all box cutters, the 3,000 innocents would not have died on 9/11 when those Christians (ooops, Muslims) crashed those planes.


 

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