Male and Female

I can add another variation - XXX - one of my grand daughters has this chromosome combination. Clearly she is female but she also has a range of characteristics caused by this accident of conception.

As a former science teacher I would explain to my class that some babies are born with indeterminant gender due to poorly developed *******ia or are hermaphrodites. In the past the doctors would choose a gender and perform surgery to remove what they considered the easiest to deal with. The child would then be raised as the assigned gender even if psychologically they identified with the opposite sex.

I think it reasonable to teach that gender is not a binary proposition and to encourage acceptance of intersex children.
no offense but this kind of thing was never discussed or taught in school. and i never saw anyone kill themselves because they weren't in their right body. not in their right minds maybe. i just find it odd how society is always latching on to the next new hip thing. everyone suddenly thinks they have a disability or they suddenly think their gay or transgendered. it's always something. if some goof ball turned around tomorrow and said we came from cats and not apes like they originally thought, what kind of behavior do you think people would exhibit then? swapping out protein bars with catnip bars and licking their hands and wearing collars?

just for the record, i'm not mad, please don't get all up in arms. this is just an opinion. i'm not out to offend anyone or make anyone mad.
 

no offense but this kind of thing was never discussed or taught in school. and i never saw anyone kill themselves because they weren't in their right body. not in their right minds maybe. i just find it odd how society is always latching on to the next new hip thing. everyone suddenly thinks they have a disability or they suddenly think their gay or transgendered. it's always something.

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**********************if some goof ball turned around tomorrow and said we came from cats and not apes like they originally thought, what kind of behavior do you think people would exhibit then? swapping out protein bars with catnip bars and licking their hands and wearing collars?***************************

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no offense but this kind of thing was never discussed or taught in school. and i never saw anyone kill themselves because they weren't in their right body. not in their right minds maybe. i just find it odd how society is always latching on to the next new hip thing. everyone suddenly thinks they have a disability or they suddenly think their gay or transgendered. it's always something. if some goof ball turned around tomorrow and said we came from cats and not apes like they originally thought, what kind of behavior do you think people would exhibit then? swapping out protein bars with catnip bars and licking their hands and wearing collars?

just for the record, i'm not mad, please don't get all up in arms. this is just an opinion. i'm not out to offend anyone or make anyone mad.
No offence taken. I was teaching science to Year 10 classes (15 - 16 year olds) in the late 70s in an Australian Catholic High School. Reproduction was just one topic in the state curriculum and all lessons were factual and about the science. Cell division and genetics was also part of the syllabus. We did not enter into areas that were about social issues.
 
When I was kid we had a woman across the street everyone referred to as Jim. We never thought about it and to everybody she was just Jim. She gravitated to Jim of her own choosing in a time when the public wasn't being bombarded with information and mis-information by the blathering media looking for "content". Today it's different. Young kids still in a stage of development think that how they pee doesn't determine who they are. So sorry for them. Like they need more pressure growing up.
 
no offense but this kind of thing was never discussed or taught in school. and i never saw anyone kill themselves because they weren't in their right body. not in their right minds maybe. i just find it odd how society is always latching on to the next new hip thing. everyone suddenly thinks they have a disability or they suddenly think their gay or transgendered. it's always something. if some goof ball turned around tomorrow and said we came from cats and not apes like they originally thought, what kind of behavior do you think people would exhibit then? swapping out protein bars with catnip bars and licking their hands and wearing collars?

just for the record, i'm not mad, please don't get all up in arms. this is just an opinion. i'm not out to offend anyone or make anyone mad.
Imagine being a young girl and your mother, a total witch who never cared anything for you and beat you like a dog, never taught you girl biological. Imagine such biology was taught in school but you needed your parents permission to attend which they did not give. Imagine standing up one day, in class, soaked in blood.

Just for the record, just an opinion, all these issues need to be taught in school where most children feel safe enough to have the ability to understand what is being said to them. What kind of behavior did you think I EXHIBITED when I thought I was bleeding to death?

I will tell you. I ran and hid. I was terrified and I ran and hid. Then, when the bell rang to return to class, I left school, ran home, and hid in my closet. The unknown can frighten children no matter what their age. I am not mad, but most people have no ideal what a great many children go through.

Teaching children how the world around them works, teaching children what their at home normal should be, teaching children about where they can get fed, teaching children about hygiene, teaching children about where they are safe, teaching children how to care for themselves is far more important then teaching children some useless sport. IMO.
 
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I am good friends with two women who have children who were not comfortable with their female gender from a very early age. I knew these women well and listened to each of their stories with interest and compassion, because frankly I just can't imagine anything worse than not being able to identify with or relate to your biological gender. 😣 What a wretched thing.

So much of our identity, for right or for wrong, is defined by our gender, and yes, far less in this current time than ever before, but still. The stories these women told me were gut wrenching. By age 3 in the one case and 5 in the other, each of these kids were spurning the traditional gender roles, and rebelling against wearing dresses, the color pink, playing with dolls, having long hair etc....some very obvious things that were expected of girls 30-40 years ago. The Moms were sympathetic and flexible but the Dad in one case REFUSED to condone or allow ANY behavior, dress, play, that wasn't "appropriately" gender based. The dad in the other was less dogmatic, but still disturbed by the preferred choices of his daughter.

Fast forward to these kids 20 years later. Both were still adamantly opposed to behaving/dressing/acting in a way typical for being female. Both were doing everything they could to appear male, even though they were biologically female. The hardships both these kids endured from well meaning family members, school peers and officials, even strangers, was just so heartbreaking.

Thankfully, in both cases, the kids were put into intensive therapy, and both were able to deal with the disconnect they were feeling with their bodies vs who they felt they were. Ultimately both opted for gender reassignment therapy, which was a long process, not just because of the surgery, but even more so because of the evaluations, therapy, counseling, testing that they were subjected to before they were allowed to begin the transition. Doctors don't treat gender reassignment surgery as just some kind of a "whee!!! OK then let's chop off this, and add that, and drug you up so you can grow a beard and develop muscles." It's a grueling emotional process for the kid as they're tested and evaluated and dealing with all of the questions and examinations from professionals whose job it is to ensure that the person knows just what they're doing before the surgeons and doctors are allowed to take the next step, and all the while the "patient" just wants to finally feel comfortable in their own skin!

My friends kids are enjoying life now as males. They look amazing!! They have girlfriends, and friends, good jobs, and are finally, in their mid-late 30's, beginning to live the life they feel they were meant to. They are surrounded by people who have supported them, not judged them, been willing to see them as people first, not just a gender....and no, almost all of these folks are not themselves gender challenged, gay or otherwise involved in alternative life styles. They, too, are just people, enjoying their friendships and living their lives without judgment or being judged.
 
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One thing for sure, until any of you, except 911 and myself (that I know of), have worked in either or both EMS and law enforcement, you, most likely, won't understand where either of us come from with this subject.

But, then again, my wife has never worked in either and she totally understands how I feel about the subject.
 
When I was kid we had a woman across the street everyone referred to as Jim. We never thought about it and to everybody she was just Jim. She gravitated to Jim of her own choosing in a time when the public wasn't being bombarded with information and mis-information by the blathering media looking for "content". Today it's different. Young kids still in a stage of development think that how they pee doesn't determine who they are. So sorry for them. Like they need more pressure growing up.

I don't think today's kids or anyone else needs the suggestion that they may not be who God made them to be. We have a kid a work with Autism who is very easily influenced by surrounding environment and ideas. He sees something somewhere and because he thinks a particular man is cute...and he likes girls he's now convinced he's bi-sexual. If that crap wasn't being toted around in the media like mugs of coffee I doubt he'd have any issue there.

It's this kind of mental influence isn't good for people. I'm not saying that gender or sex related issues don't exist. I just think that them flaunting it all over the media is giving people stupid ideas that don't know any better.
 
I strongly disagree, but I do not want to start a 12 page thread.

What you can do is to answer the following question for me: "How did we get to where we are?"

Here is my point using analogies: If a 12 y/o commits a murder, he will generally serve time in a youth development home and then be released back into society. There are cases where a 10-12 y/o will get prison time, but those are the exceptions. The usually defense for these kids that murder is that the brain is not fully developed and they don't understand about the consequences and yadda, yadda, yadda.

Today we are saying: "Well, if my 12 y/o son thinks he is a girl, then so-be-it, I will do what I can to make that happen." My question is, "How does he know he wants to be a girl?" His brain isn't fully developed and maybe when he turns 20, he will think, "Boy, did I ever screw up."
Exactly!
 
Just for the record: you can't "catch" gay....people are what they are. Students should know about the differences in people, not kept in the dark to make assumptions based on hate and fear.
Heh, I'm pretty sure students today know all about most everything waaaaay before the classroom

As for me, I didn't know all that much

Still don't

So, got to reading

Mostly about lesbianism, and how they think

I......I.....I think I'm a lesbian

winter.jpg
 
Just for the record: you can't "catch" gay....people are what they are. Students should know about the differences in people, not kept in the dark to make assumptions based on hate and fear.
You know it's interesting that you should say this. I'm certain I had some classmates that were gay but back then this stuff wasn't out there being pushed by the media and creating the hate that we see now. The media is responsible for a lot of what's wrong with society today as a whole I think.

The reason I made that last remark about the media is because for years they wanted people with Tourette Syndrome to make people aware that it's out there. Ok so now that people are aware of it now everyone thinks they have it or we've become the butt of jokes. I frankly would rather have people unaware. Ignorance can truly be bliss at times.
 
I don't think today's kids or anyone else needs the suggestion that they may not be who God made them to be. We have a kid a work with Autism who is very easily influenced by surrounding environment and ideas. He sees something somewhere and because he thinks a particular man is cute...and he likes girls he's now convinced he's bi-sexual. If that crap wasn't being toted around in the media like mugs of coffee I doubt he'd have any issue there.

It's this kind of mental influence isn't good for people. I'm not saying that gender or sex related issues don't exist. I just think that them flaunting it all over the media is giving people stupid ideas that don't know any better.
God, IMO, supplies our souls which drive us to be male or female, inside our minds. Mother Nature, makes our bodies. Mother Nature often mucks it up. So, while God, supplies a male soul, nature can supply a female body.

Otherwise, due to the wide range of birth defects in newborn children, we would have to assume that God makes a lot of mistakes. I prefer to assume Mother Nature is to blame.

Edited to add: We become who we become though a wide variety of choices made through out our lives by us. God gave us free choice. God doesn’t make serial killers, God doesn’t make child abusers, the list is endless of the types of people God did/does not make. We make ourselves while being influenced by others. We must take personal responsibility for who we are.
 
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I don't think today's kids or anyone else needs the suggestion that they may not be who God made them to be. We have a kid a work with Autism who is very easily influenced by surrounding environment and ideas. He sees something somewhere and because he thinks a particular man is cute...and he likes girls he's now convinced he's bi-sexual. If that crap wasn't being toted around in the media like mugs of coffee I doubt he'd have any issue there.

It's this kind of mental influence isn't good for people. I'm not saying that gender or sex related issues don't exist. I just think that them flaunting it all over the media is giving people stupid ideas that don't know any better.
Or he just might be bi-sexual.

A woman, with Down’s syndrome, was recently moved to my sons all male group home from the all female group home. Why? Because she identifies as male, not female. The guys accept her as male. She/he is happier. I doubt the media influenced him/her.
 
Heh, I'm pretty sure students today know all about most everything waaaaay before the classroom

As for me, I didn't know all that much

Still don't

So, got to reading

Mostly about lesbianism, and how they think

I......I.....I think I'm a lesbian

View attachment 132774
You would be surprised and shocked about how much children don’t know or are confused about. As to your being a lesbian, sorry you are not, but a cross dresser, hmm. 🤣
 
Common sense and rational observation would indicate that some people are not comfortable with the gender they were born into or "assigned."

Obviously, those people should be treated with decency and respect, and should be welcomed into society.

Common sense does not indicate that everyone is "gender fluid" and should be encouraged to experiment with gender identities. That way lies madness.
 
As my children were growing up and I got to know their friends and classmates, it was fairly easy from very early years (sometimes preschool) to realize some were gay. They weren't influenced by the media - it was how they were wired.

To me, the classes we're discussing help validate the kids who feel "other" when it comes to their gender, and equally importantly, it teaches their classmates that these kids aren't freaks, nor do they have something wrong with them. When lights are shone on a subject the fear and ignorance disappear.

Of course, the primary reason parents don't want their children exposed to this information is that they're terrified their children will be inspired and "turned" gay or bi.

p.s. I did know kids who committed suicide in HS. Was it because they realized they were gay? Perhaps. They took their secrets with them to the grave so I'll never know.
 
no offense but this kind of thing was never discussed or taught in school. and i never saw anyone kill themselves because they weren't in their right body. not in their right minds maybe. i just find it odd how society is always latching on to the next new hip thing. everyone suddenly thinks they have a disability or they suddenly think their gay or transgendered. it's always something. if some goof ball turned around tomorrow and said we came from cats and not apes like they originally thought, what kind of behavior do you think people would exhibit then? swapping out protein bars with catnip bars and licking their hands and wearing collars?

just for the record, i'm not mad, please don't get all up in arms. this is just an opinion. i'm not out to offend anyone or make anyone mad.

It's most likely that when you were in school homosexuality was still considered a form of mental illness.

We can't be sure that anyone who committed suicide before we had the vocabulary of gender awareness didn't commit suicide for those reasons but wasn't able to express them because they didn't know how to describe what they were experiencing. It might be that they described themselves as being crazy because they didn't feel like they were supposed to feel. Thus your "not in their right minds" might have been a term to describe non-conventional gender awareness.

I do agree that awareness might lead some people to try things they might not have chosen to try in an earlier time period. However I don't see that as a bad thing. If they are aware that they have some interest in something that isn't "normal" as long as it isn't harmful to themselves or others I think they should be able to investigate their interests.
 
As my children were growing up and I got to know their friends and classmates, it was fairly easy from very early years (sometimes preschool) to realize some were gay. They weren't influenced by the media - it was how they were wired.

To me, the classes we're discussing help validate the kids who feel "other" when it comes to their gender, and equally importantly, it teaches their classmates that these kids aren't freaks, nor do they have something wrong with them. When lights are shone on a subject the fear and ignorance disappear.

Of course, the primary reason parents don't want their children exposed to this information is that they're terrified their children will be inspired and "turned" gay or bi.

p.s. I did know kids who committed suicide in HS. Was it because they realized they were gay? Perhaps. They took their secrets with them to the grave so I'll never know.

Absolutely agree with you but there is a big difference between thinking you might be gay and thinking you might want to change genders, especially with the help of drugs and/or surgery.
 
Big issues include:

Do biological boys-identifying-as-women get to play on young women's sports teams?

Do biological boys-identifying-as-women get to shower with young women?
 
Big issues include:

Do biological boys-identifying-as-women get to play on young women's sports teams?

Do biological boys-identifying-as-women get to shower with young women?
I think showers are going by the way side in many schools, but a boy identified as a girl would shower separate if the school still had showers and the same for the other.
 
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases...horia/in-depth/pubertal-blockers/art-20459075

This is a great Mayo Clinic article about pubertal blockers, what they are, what they do and steps needed for them to be given to children. I'm not sure if there are actual laws regarding their use but the article does say that the parents or other caretakers or guardians have to consent to the treatment. Here are the requirements listed for a child to get the pubertal blockers:

To begin using pubertal blockers, a child must:
  • Show a long-lasting and intense pattern of gender nonconformity or gender dysphoria
  • Have gender dysphoria that began or worsened at the start of puberty
  • Address any psychological, medical or social problems that could interfere with treatment
  • Provide informed consent
 


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