Two Children Killed In School Shooting

[seadoug]

Like usual, the left wing politicians will turn tragedy into opportunity to further their agenda.
We've all heard it before, guns don't kill people, people do.
You don't need a gun to kill people. We've seen mentally ill people drive into a crowd with the pedal mashed to the floor.
Propane tanks, Molotov cocktails, knives, baseball bats, candlesticks, rocks, bare hands, etc.
Guns have been around forever, but the problem seems to be getting worse.
Mentally ill people are going untreated because nobody wants to hurt their feelings.
24/7 "news" channels make the shooter famous, plaster his picture all over the TV and internet. "Not such a nobody now"
Until we stop blaming the tool and start solving the root problem, nothing will change.
All the guns could disappear today, and the crazies will still kill as many people as they can to make themselves famous.
Not trying to offend anyone, just saying if we keep believing guns are the problem, then nothing will change.

Mentally ill people are going untreated because these days it takes forever to get an appointment with a therapist and most mental institutions have been closed over the years. No need to make this political.

The importance of these efforts was highlighted in APA’s 2022 Covid-19 Practitioner Impact Survey, which found that 60% of psychologists were reporting no openings for new patients, and more than 40% were carrying waiting lists of 10 or more patients. About 20% said they saw an increase in demand for treatment from populations of color and younger patients, and the expanding workload is taking a toll. Nearly half of the 2,295 respondents agreed or strongly agreed that they felt burned out.

 

[Irishdude]

You're talking about things that can only be determined after the crime. You would have every person on earth locked up! Anyone who was bullied, anyone who seems sad, any child who ever has a temper tantrum or was ever bullied must be "closely monitored."

It's impossible to predict who will snap. We live in a free society where we don't lock people up just because they don't meet someone else's standard of normal.

The murderer's name is Robin not Robert. It was legally changed a few years ago.

But seeing as how he was a murderous anti-Semite who wanted to see children die, I'm ok with calling him Robert.

 

[January]

I think we can call this loathsome, murderous, anti-Semitic POS by any damn pronoun we choose.

If I start calling myself Elvis Presley tomorrow it means I'm crazy, not that I am Elvis Presley.

saying he/she is a loathsome murderous so and so - sure - but I don't think getting on our high horse about the name being Robert and not the name it was changed to is helpful.

That just means we are condoning the sort of bullying Robin was subjected to - of course we don't condone the shooting actions but that doesn't mean we are ok with the bullying or non acceptance of the person that preceded it.

and of course anyone called Elvis isnt THE Elvis Presley - but if my name is legally Elvis, then that is my name. I'm sure there are people out there wit h the name Elvis - obviously more than one person can have the same name.

and anyway Robin is a perfectly generic name, not one associated with any famous person in particular.

Not the same thing at all.

 

[Warrigal]

How sad that he had to kill two little children and wound seventeen others. Afterward he then killed himself. I heard the other victims are expected to live.

Last I saw was that two of the wounded children have also died.

 

[CallMeKate]

Last I saw was that two of the wounded children have also died.

I will retract if I'm wrong, but I do not believe this is true.

 

[Warrigal]

I will retract if I'm wrong, but I do not believe this is true.

I think you are correct. I cannot find any reference. I believe I might have heard it on the radio but cannot be sure.

 

[oslooskar]

Not while the second amendment remains in force. The total number of gunfire deaths in the US in 2024 was: 46,728. Here in the UK there were 22 firearm deaths in the year ending March 2024, which is the most recent full year for which data is available.

Quoting raw gun-death numbers without context is misleading. Over half of U.S. gun deaths are suicides and that is not the same thing as murder. If you want to talk about crime, compare homicide rates, do not lump everything together. Also, while you pointed out today’s UK numbers, you might also want to ask how many people in the UK are now being arrested or questioned by police over their social media comments. That’s the price of trading away liberty for a false sense of security.

I should also point out that before the 1920 Firearms Act, British citizens could freely own pistols, rifles, even military surplus weapons and gun crime was virtually nonexistent. The UK wasn’t safe because of its ban on firearm ownership, it was safe because ordinary people were free and responsible. Disarmament didn’t create safety, it only removed a right.

 

[Irishdude]

saying he/she is a loathsome murderous so and so - sure - but I don't think getting on our high horse about the name being Robert and not the name it was changed to is helpful.

That just means we are condoning the sort of bullying Robin was subjected to - of course we don't condone the shooting actions but that doesn't mean we are ok with the bullying or non acceptance of the person that preceded it.

and of course anyone called Elvis isnt THE Elvis Presley - but if my name is legally Elvis, then that is my name. I'm sure there are people out there wit h the name Elvis - obviously more than one person can have the same name.

and anyway Robin is a perfectly generic name, not one associated with any famous person in particular.

Not the same thing at all.

I'm perfectly happy up here on my high horse, thanks.

 

[911]

When my son first got his driver's license, I told him to basically expect, as a teenage boy, to be pulled over, whether it's a local, relatively "minor" pull-over or if he gets pulled over on an interstate. He's slender, like his father, and would usually take his wallet out of his back pocket when driving and lay it on the front passenger seat because it was uncomfortable to sit on. Naturally, at times the wallet would slide off into the front passenger footwell.

I made sure to tell him that if this had happened, to NOT, under ANY circumstance, reach down to retrieve his wallet (i.e., to get his license). I told him to keep his hands on the wheel and explain to the officer what he would be doing, that if he just reached down the officer would assume he's reaching for a gun and pull his own weapon and probably scare the s--t out of him.

It's sad that this even has to be such an issue.

I'm glad you've stayed safe, @911.

It’s always a good idea that anytime a driver is stopped or pulled over for the driver to keep their hands on top of the steering wheel where the approaching Trooper or Officer can see them. Cop killing today is more rampant than in the past.

What is taught at the Academy isn’t always what a Trooper will do. Sometimes we have to act on a gut feeling to take the necessary precaution, so the Trooper will act in a manner that’s safest for the driver and the Trooper. Generally, the Trooper can tell who to trust and who to take extra precautions with.

Most Troopers run the license before exiting their vehicle to check for stolen vehicle, wants, warrants and any prior arrests. In today’s world, most of our Troopers’ and many local police departments’ vehicles have an ALPR or Automated License Plate Reader attached. The scanner automatically runs the tag and if the vehicle is stolen or if there are any outstanding warrants or prior arrests, the computer will immediately sound an alert that warns the Trooper and prints out the information.

The idea is to keep everyone safe and out of harm’s way.

 

[old medic]

Keep in mind that bullying is a part of childhood/growing up.

EXCACTLY!!!!! And we LEARNED how to DEAL with it... Its called COPING SKILLS...
Now a-daze (pun intended) you have people melting down because they don't get there way like a spoiled brat.

 

[January]

No we didn't all learn to cope with bullying - it had the same effects it has on people now.

And of course the internet has made cyber bullying so much worse.

No wonder bullying is hard to stamp out when there are people dismissing it like this.

 

[officerripley]

If guns aren't the problem and people are the problem, then why are those people being allowed guns?

 

[Deya]

Facts:

When the FBI tried to visit his mother, she refused to answer the door. She retained an attorney. The attorney says she was too distraught to talk. As to this date, the mother hasn't been available for questioning.

The FBI later obtained search warrants and seized several electronic devices as well as a lot of newspaper articles and photos of former school shooting and other heinous crimes involving children that this killer had collected.

His mother signed off on his name change when he was 17 and wanted to identify as a she. His manifesto makes it clear he was unhappy that current medical technology could not make him into a real female. He wished he had been born a girl.

He went to school at the Catholic school where the heinous murders took place. For how long or when hasn't been released yet. His mother worked there until 2021.

Now, we can speculate all we want, talk politics of guns and mental illness, but such does nothing but breed hate and discontent. We need more facts. It is easy to understand this male, identifying as female, had serious mental problems.

What part did his mother play in his developing these mental problems and hating children? Did she ever try to get him counseling when he was a child? I'm not talking about counseling to convince him he couldn't be a girl, but help to understand his feeling and help him be happy about his identity change and deal with living that life.

He was going to kill children and if not using guns, could have easily made a bomb that would have killed a lot more than he did. I refer to him as a he, because his own writing, made it clear he was unhappy that he could not become a real female, and wished he had never transitioned. How he transitioned, if he did other than name change, has not been released yet. Whether he took puberty blocking meds as a kid, isn't known. Was he on estrogen therapy? We don't know. So much we don't know.

It sickens me that when children die and a gun was used, it becomes a political discussion about guns. It seems to me that the discussion should be about the person that pulled the trigger and why they became so deranged and had a desire to murder innocent children. At least this person killed themself. I wish they had before killing and wounding the children.

 

[WhatInThe]

EXCACTLY!!!!! And we LEARNED how to DEAL with it... Its called COPING SKILLS...
Now a-daze (pun intended) you have people melting down because they don't get there way like a spoiled brat

Unrealistic expectations in the day and age of instant gratification and tech including social media fuels their 'fires'

This pos cowardly murderer was suicidal and still had to get their way, one last dig because life didn't turn out they way he thought it should(apparently they had some regrets about decisions earlier in life at the end)

 

[Cornhusker]

Guns contribute to the problem.

So do cars, trucks, hands, feet, knives, bats, sticks, television, drugs and poor parenting.
You can't ban everything. We have to fix the root problem. we have to figure out what causes these people to want to kill.
Notoriety, a desire to be somebody and mental illness seems to be a theme in these tragedies.
We waste billions on stupid crap, imagine if we attacked this problem with the idea of stopping the killing instead of using every tragedy to blow the gun control horn.

 

[Cornhusker]

I don't blame the tool itself - I blame easy access to the tool

The root cause of US having so many mass gun shootings is easy access to the tool

It's really not that easy.
It's illegal to sell to someone who is mentally ill.
Until we face the fact that things like gender confusion are a mental illness, mentally ill people will get guns.
But at least we didn't hurt their feelings.

 

[rgp]

You're talking about things that can only be determined after the crime. You would have every person on earth locked up! Anyone who was bullied, anyone who seems sad, any child who ever has a temper tantrum or was ever bullied must be "closely monitored."

It's impossible to predict who will snap. We live in a free society where we don't lock people up just because they don't meet someone else's standard of normal.

The murderer's name is Robin not Robert. It was legally changed a few years ago.

Well, sorry but there usually are tell-tale signs , markers that should {IMO} be carefully watched , and if they are too pronounced, they should be dealt with.

And it's name really doesn't matter [I suppose] but it was a male , not a female.

 

[KSav]

When the FBI tried to visit his mother, she refused to answer the door. She retained an attorney. The attorney says she was too distraught to talk. As to this date, the mother hasn't been available for questioning.

That angers me. I can understand she likely is distraught; however, her child mowed down innocent children. She needs to suck it up and cooperate with the authorities.

 

[Deya]

That angers me. I can understand she likely is distraught; however, her child mowed down innocent children. She needs to suck it up and cooperate with the authorities.

Yep, makes me wonder what her involvement was. Did she know about his collection of mass child murders? She certainly knew of his discontent with his "transitioning." She was certainly in a hurry to hire a lawyer. Perhaps she feels responsible for encouraging his identity change which he later regretted.

 

[CallMeKate]

That angers me. I can understand she likely is distraught; however, her child mowed down innocent children. She needs to suck it up and cooperate with the authorities.

Yes... and the only reason I can think of is that she supplied the gun... wonder if that's what will be discovered?

He had not transitioned. One of his journal entries was translated as: “I don’t want to dress girly all the time but I guess sometimes I really like it. I know I am not a woman but I definitely don't feel like a man.”

I can go to the courthouse and change my name to Ralph, but that's not going to make me a man. Robert did not know WHAT he wanted, apparently.

He had everything well planned out. More of his words: “Maybe I could attack an event at the on-site church … think attacking a large group of kids coming in from recess is my best plan. … Then from there I can go inside and kill, going for as long as I can.” “I am feeling good about Annunciation. It seems like a good combo of easy attack form and devastating tragedy and I want to do more research. I have concerns about finding a large enough group. I want to avoid any parents, but pre and post school drop off.”

 

[Deya]

Ask yourself, why did the mother retain the services of Ryan Garry, a very high profile criminal defense attorney? If she was just distraught and needed an attorney to talk to officials and press, a family lawyer would have been all that was needed. Her son was dead, so why does she need a high profile criminal defense attorney? This case is starting to get bizarre.

Search Ryan Garry, criminal defense attorney.

 

[WhatInThe]

Ask yourself, why did the mother retain the services of Ryan Garry, a very high profile criminal defense attorney? If she was just distraught and needed an attorney to talk to officials and press, a family lawyer would have been all that was needed. Her son was dead, so why does she need a high profile criminal defense attorney? This case is starting to get bizarre.

Search Ryan Garry, criminal defense attorney.

I think Colin Kapernick's attorney/case I saw. Her home looks like it took money as well.

Where is or what happened to the father. With violent criminals isn't a significant percentage that don't have a father in their lives for what ever reason.

 

[CallMeKate]

Where is or what happened to the father. With violent criminals isn't a significant percentage that don't have a father in their lives for what ever reason.

I'd have to look it up (and will).... but I *think* I read that they were divorced like at least a decade ago. I'll edit this when I find out for sure. EDIT: Can't find it, still looking.
Okay, EDIT #2... found it. Time Magazine online: "According to the Minnesota Star Tribune, Westman was one of three children of Mary Grace and James Allen Westman, who divorced in 2013 after 25 years of marriage."

 

[Jules]

After events like this, there’ll be reports of the shooter(s) participating in dark web groups that glorify killing. Perhaps more should be spent on undercover operations to discover them and provide intervention.

 

[Irishdude]

saying he/she is a loathsome murderous so and so - sure - but I don't think getting on our high horse about the name being Robert and not the name it was changed to is helpful.

That just means we are condoning the sort of bullying Robin was subjected to - of course we don't condone the shooting actions but that doesn't mean we are ok with the bullying or non acceptance of the person that preceded it.

and of course anyone called Elvis isnt THE Elvis Presley - but if my name is legally Elvis, then that is my name. I'm sure there are people out there wit h the name Elvis - obviously more than one person can have the same name.

and anyway Robin is a perfectly generic name, not one associated with any famous person in particular.

Not the same thing at all.

BTW there is no evidence that this creep was ever bullied. He started wearing Nazi regalia in seventh grade and was abusive, not abused.